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@Crazy-Horse said in US Politics:
@Duluth said in US Politics:
Radley Balko did a lot of good reporting on it (particularly this book from 2013)
The decades long war on drugs being the main cause (get scared whenever politicians talk about 'The war on x')
The problem was accelerated with old military gear/vehicles from Iraq etc getting sold to police forces.On the flip side, you need the police equipped to deal with situations in a timely and effective manner, and they may need the military type tools to do this.
It’s the whole escalation of equipment argument though. Just like gun control where having a rifle to hunt with has escalated to having automatic assault weapons.
Military weapons are designed for war not for policing. They were buying up things like armoured personnel carriers.
They have also gone from specialists, such as SWAT teams to equipping barely trained cowboys with enough gear to take down a small country. -
@antipodean as astonished at the first autopsy indicating it wasn't due to suffocation?
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@Crucial said in US Politics:
@Crazy-Horse said in US Politics:
@Duluth said in US Politics:
Radley Balko did a lot of good reporting on it (particularly this book from 2013)
The decades long war on drugs being the main cause (get scared whenever politicians talk about 'The war on x')
The problem was accelerated with old military gear/vehicles from Iraq etc getting sold to police forces.On the flip side, you need the police equipped to deal with situations in a timely and effective manner, and they may need the military type tools to do this.
They have also gone from specialists, such as SWAT teams to equipping barely trained cowboys with enough gear to take down a small country.
Are you talking about the US?
Re military style weapons for the police. Qld have introduced them on a limited scale to trained officers, meaning some patrols cars will be carrying them. NZ appears to be the same. This is so police have some sort of ability to respond to an active shooter. Even though we carry side arms, they are only useful up to 20 metres if you are a good shot. Useless against someone carrying a rifle. Police cannot afford to lose any use of force situations, let alone ones involving an active shooter.
Police need to be better equipped than the offenders. I guess it's an arms race...
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@reprobate said in US Politics:
@Rembrandt said in US Politics:
I was a little concerned after Corona but I think the footage of the last few nights settles it.
Congrats on 4 more years Mr Trump.
Mate, this is a truly bizarre attitude and conclusion.
These protests are no longer characterised by 'racial justice' they are now representative of random assaults on the street, vandalism, arson, destruction of peoples livelihoods and multiple murders (unsure how much footage is circulating in msm but their is plenty on social potentially further discrediting the CNN types ). Democrats have largely been in support of the protests (and antifa) while Republicans have largely been against and Trump in particular has been strongly against. Support for Federal & Military action to shutdown the protests is now in the majority (https://assets.morningconsult.com/wp-uploads/2020/06/01181629/2005131_crosstabs_POLICE_RVs_FINAL_LM-1.pdf) and democrat State representatives have proven they will not help protect people or property, a terrific advertisement for the importance of the 2nd amendment.
Not holding my breath for BLM to actually give a damn about David Dorn or any other casualty of this. Black lives only matter to these people if it achieves a political aim.
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@Paekakboyz said in US Politics:
@antipodean as astonished at the first autopsy indicating it wasn't due to suffocation?
Excited delirium is a thing. As is the observation that consultants tend to provide the outcomes you hired them for...
The broader problem is competing autopsies make the prosecutor's job much harder.
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@Rembrandt said in US Politics:
@reprobate said in US Politics:
@Rembrandt said in US Politics:
I was a little concerned after Corona but I think the footage of the last few nights settles it.
Congrats on 4 more years Mr Trump.
Mate, this is a truly bizarre attitude and conclusion.
These protests are no longer characterised by 'racial justice' they are now representative of random assaults on the street, vandalism, arson, destruction of peoples livelihoods and multiple murders (unsure how much footage is circulating in msm but their is plenty on social potentially further discrediting the CNN types ). Democrats have largely been in support of the protests (and antifa) while Republicans have largely been against and Trump in particular has been strongly against. Support for Federal & Military action to shutdown the protests is now in the majority (https://assets.morningconsult.com/wp-uploads/2020/06/01181629/2005131_crosstabs_POLICE_RVs_FINAL_LM-1.pdf) and democrat State representatives have proven they will not help protect people or property, a terrific advertisement for the importance of the 2nd amendment.
Not holding my breath for BLM to actually give a damn about David Dorn or any other casualty of this. Black lives only matter to these people if it achieves a political aim.
Hang on. You have fallen into the trap of not seperating the actual peaceful protests from those looking to take advantage of civil disobedience. It isn't a party line thing at all. People regardless of political slant are against assault, looting, rioting etc (as shown by laws agreed as such)
According to the tables linked (very good thank you) 72% of voters in total (all 'sides') think it is important for the President to address racial inequality in the U.S., which refers to differences across races in income, access to quality healthcare, access to voting rights or general quality of life?
83% of voters think it is important for the public to address the same.That's a large majority that see a problem here. Yes 54% of 'Reps' are in the 'do not support' categories regarding protestors but this survey does not differentiate at all between protestors and 'others' and the majority of Reps are sympathetic with the message.
That implies to me that they would be fine with peaceful protests, just not the stirred up minority taking advantage to be lawless. -
Stating that this will ensure Trump is re-elected is pretty ridiculous. It's June, and given how quickly things have changed since January you'd be mad to make any sort of prediction for an event that's five months away. No result would shock me at this stage - Trump/Biden landslides, or it coming down to a handful of college votes.
I don't think these protests will be a lethal blow to his Presidency, but I also don't think they help him. Surely any rational person can see the US is a complete mess at the moment. Regardless of how or why that may be the case it doesn't reflect well on the sitting President, especially one whose central platform was to 'make America great again'.
The pre-conditions for a first term President being voted out are there, as they were for GHWB and Carter. But we're in a very different place to where we were in 1992 or 1980 so it's almost impossible to make any sort of prediction.
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@antipodean said in US Politics:
Excited delirium is a thing. As is the observation that consultants tend to provide the outcomes you hired them for...
The broader problem is competing autopsies make the prosecutor's job much harder.
One thing that complicates these autopsies is the Dr that is usually involved
There's a massive amount of money in cases like this so they get the best doctor they can. One doctor has gotten so much experience he's become the default choice - Dr Micheal Baden
There's nothing wrong with paying for the best but it does make conspiracy theorists get over excited when they see the cases he's been involved in: JFK, OJ, Phil Spector, Aaron Hernandez, Michael Brown, Jeffrey Epstein and now this case.
He used to tell some funny stories about autopsies on 'Red Eye' years ago.. he's seen a lot of weird shit
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@canefan said in US Politics:
@barbarian as a not so long departed poster used to say, don't trust the polls. Anything can happen. Trump will keep his base, it remains to be seen if the Dems voters can get suitably motivated to vote him out.
Maybe the Dems might actually try and campaign in Michigan this time. Who knows...
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@canefan said in US Politics:
@barbarian as a not so long departed poster used to say, don't trust the polls. Anything can happen. Trump will keep his base, it remains to be seen if the Dems voters can get suitably motivated to vote him out.
Swing States aren't looking that flash for Trump at the moment and who knows what will happen to the black vote, or if Biden can provide sufficient assurances that will actually get the numbers even voting.
As we learned last time, the electoral college system can be the deciding factor if you let things be close enough.
A bit like giving the ref an opportunity to influence the result in a rugby game.
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@Crucial said in US Politics:
@canefan said in US Politics:
@barbarian as a not so long departed poster used to say, don't trust the polls. Anything can happen. Trump will keep his base, it remains to be seen if the Dems voters can get suitably motivated to vote him out.
Swing States aren't looking that flash for Trump at the moment and who knows what will happen to the black vote, or if Biden can provide sufficient assurances that will actually get the numbers even voting.
As we learned last time, the electoral college system can be the deciding factor if you let things be close enough.
A bit like giving the ref an opportunity to influence the result in a rugby game.
I'm not sure Biden captures the imagination. He just has to play it straight and hope that Trump motivates enough people to come out and vote against him. If they get too petty it will devolve into a slanging match and Trump is quite adept at those
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@canefan said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
@canefan said in US Politics:
@barbarian as a not so long departed poster used to say, don't trust the polls. Anything can happen. Trump will keep his base, it remains to be seen if the Dems voters can get suitably motivated to vote him out.
Swing States aren't looking that flash for Trump at the moment and who knows what will happen to the black vote, or if Biden can provide sufficient assurances that will actually get the numbers even voting.
As we learned last time, the electoral college system can be the deciding factor if you let things be close enough.
A bit like giving the ref an opportunity to influence the result in a rugby game.
I'm not sure Biden captures the imagination. He just has to play it straight and hope that Trump motivates enough people to come out and vote against him. If they get too petty it will devolve into a slanging match and Trump is quite adept at those
Agree on the 'play it straight' part.
Biden will need to look like the adult in the room offering leadership without being condescending.
He does need to offer something though, and not rely on an 'anti' vote. If he offers nothing or a return to pre-Trump many of the voters that wanted 'any sort of change' will just not vote.
I think non-votes will hurt Biden more than Trump.I would like to see him enter debates ready to call fact checks on Trump's lies.
Whether Biden and the Dems can actually offer anything other than 'get rid of Trump' remains to be seen. He isnt the most inspiring pick.
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@Siam said in US Politics:
I think the bigger problem than trump or Biden is that the losing side will not accept the result and the whole thing will fester.
We really need an alien attack very soon 😉
A MAGA uprising? That would not turn out well.
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