North vs. South



  • http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/all-blacks/85166487/would-the-all-blacks-toughest-game-be-a-northsouth-state-of-origin

    Thoughts? I'd love this to be an annual fixture. 'Province' of Origin for me (vs. Super Rugby franchise location as suggested in the comments of the article).

    With both teams loaded with super stars - this would get great attendance.



  • @JayCee Or province of origin being the province of the club you first made a 1st class team from?



  • If such a concept ever eventuated again I would use the player's secondary school, as the article suggested. That's the true origin of each player before being signed up to provincial academies etc. Only restrict it to NZ-based players.

    The inter-island games used to be an annual fixture, and there was the zonal series for a few years in the late 1980s.

    It's not going to happen though with the congested schedule.



  • Sure. With all the changes to the rugby schedule that are being negotiated recently, like the idea of combining the June test window and EOYT window into one big window, I don't see why they couldn't try to fit games like this in somewhere, because honestly, the current schedule is pretty boring and SANZAAR's "future plans" (expanding Super Rugby even more) are shit. They need more things like the Lions tour that mixes things up a bit, kinda like how the NBA has its All-Star weekend, which features the All-Star game, slam dunk challenge, etc.

    Basing it on their 1st XV teams/high schools seems like the better idea to me though.



  • Bast on the current player dispersal I can't see any other result than a resounding North Island victory.

    A concept like this would be great to get up because if marketed right could be a money maker and the NZRU could keep all the funds, no outgoing expenses to the Northern Unions etc (but also maybe no Northern Union TV money too).

    Always a nice idea - I wish they would bring it back for domestic cricket more.



  • I can't wait to hear talkback about it when, in the first one Keiren Read does a knee, and Beauden Barrett does a hammy, taking them out of test rugby for a season.

    Unlike some, i don't have that much interest in watching another game of NZ players playing each other. I am not sure it would be the commercial success they are hoping for.

    State of Origin has it's popularity in hate. And that hate has traditionally been from north of the border, based on the way the NSWRL used to treat Qld. There just isn't the passion and rivalry in NZ rugby to drive the money side.



  • @mariner4life said in North vs. South:

    I can't wait to hear talkback about it when, in the first one Keiren Read does a knee, and Beauden Barrett does a hammy, taking them out of test rugby for a season.

    Unlike some, i don't have that much interest in watching another game of NZ players playing each other. I am not sure it would be the commercial success they are hoping for.

    State of Origin has it's popularity in hate. And that hate has traditionally been from north of the border, based on the way the NSWRL used to treat Qld. There just isn't the passion and rivalry in NZ rugby to drive the money side.

    Agree with this, there's more hate/passion in the already traditional matches like Auckland v Canterbury (or Blues v Crusadars). NZ rugby is province based, in fact I hate Otago just as much as Waikato and Auckland.

    (the southern man myth really annoys me)



  • North vs South might be interesting if we didn't already have Super Rugby. You see enough All Blacks going head to head there. I doubt a one-off game would be a big money spinner.



  • I'm guessing those saying base it on secondary school, didn't go to boarding school?



  • @Bones I doubt many students, even those from farming stock, move islands to go to school.



  • @Bovidae plenty move Islands (Fiji/Samoa...)

    Lots of kids end up at Auckland schools, but you need to draw the line somewhere otherwise it all becomes a bit of a farce, that said, dont know if it would appeal greatly.

    We have alot of rugby already, and outside of the ABs many fans are just as happy to watch from the comfort of thier own home.



  • "Mate vs Mate.....State vs State........FARKIN ORRRRRRRRRRRRRRJINNNNNNNN YOU CUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUNNNNNTTTTTTTS"

    Doesn't really work even with the most feral kiwi accent does it ?



  • Of those in the current squad

    South

    1. J. Moody
    2. O. Franks
    3. B. Retallick
    4. S. Whitelock
    5. L. Squire
    6. M. Todd
    7. E. Dixon
    8. D. McKenzie
    9. R. Crotty
    10. A. Lienart-Brown
    11. B. Smith

    North

    1. O. Tuungafasi
    2. D. Coles
    3. C. Faumuina
    4. P. Tuipoluto
    5. J. Kaino
    6. S. Cane
    7. K. Read
    8. A. Smith
    9. B. Barrett
    10. J. Savea
    11. M. Fekitoa
    12. G. Moala
    13. W. Naholo
    14. I. Dagg


  • @ACT-Crusader said in North vs. South:

    Of those in the current squad

    South

    1. J. Moody
    2. O. Franks
    3. B. Retallick
    4. S. Whitelock
    5. L. Squire
    6. M. Todd
    7. E. Dixon
    8. D. McKenzie
    9. R. Crotty
    10. A. Lienart-Brown
    11. B. Smith

    North

    1. O. Tuungafasi
    2. D. Coles
    3. C. Faumuina
    4. P. Tuipoluto
    5. J. Kaino
    6. S. Cane
    7. K. Read
    8. A. Smith
    9. B. Barrett
    10. J. Savea
    11. M. Fekitoa
    12. G. Moala
    13. W. Naholo
    14. I. Dagg

    Looks like an extremely exciting, but ultimately fucken pointless, game.

    Not unlike however many years Origin has been around really ( minus the excitement for much of that )



  • @ACT-Crusader Didn't Liam Squire go to Palmerston North Boys?



  • @KiwiMurph I was claiming his Nelson Marist allegiance



  • @KiwiMurph said in North vs. South:

    @ACT-Crusader Didn't Liam Squire go to Palmerston North Boys?

    Sam Whitelock is from up North as well. Fielding HS iirc.. I remember making a team last year.



  • @ACT-Crusader said in North vs. South:

    @KiwiMurph I was claiming his Nelson Marist

    typical crusader poaching



  • @mariner4life I've even re-poached Sam Whitelock....



  • @ACT-Crusader pooooaaaach!

    "are you England? Are you England? Are you England in disguise?"



  • @Bovidae You can doubt all you like, it still happens. What about those that go to more than one high school too?



  • @Bones make it where you started your form 3 year, oh wait, thats year 9??? Doesnt matter if you only went for 2 weeks and got kicked out, thats your school of Origin!



  • @Bones said in North vs. South:

    @Bovidae You can doubt all you like, it still happens. What about those that go to more than one high school too?

    1st high school in NZ. If they didn't attend school in NZ, then they aren't eligible.



  • @mimic said in North vs. South:

    @Bones said in North vs. South:

    @Bovidae You can doubt all you like, it still happens. What about those that go to more than one high school too?

    1st high school in NZ. If they didn't attend school in NZ, then they aren't eligible.

    No offence mate but that sounds pretty silly. If anything it should be last high school, not first.

    Edit: Or just club you first made a 1st class side from...



  • @Bones said in North vs. South:

    @mimic said in North vs. South:

    @Bones said in North vs. South:

    @Bovidae You can doubt all you like, it still happens. What about those that go to more than one high school too?

    1st high school in NZ. If they didn't attend school in NZ, then they aren't eligible.

    No offence mate but that sounds pretty silly. If anything it should be last high school, not first.

    Edit: Or just club you first made a 1st class side from...

    It's not silly at all. So many people play for a school, and then move to another school in their final year (and sometimes repeat 7th form) to make the first XV. It happens a lot in Auckland, which why there's a stand down period when you change schools.

    Not a fan of clubs, cos they usually poach from the North Island schools anyway.



  • @mimic Agree to disagree.



  • Arguing eligibility rules in a contest that doesn't, and never will, exist.

    Gotta say the fern is heaps more fun when the ABs are playing poorly. Wish I made more of an effort in late 2007.



  • @Bones I'm not saying it doesn't happen but it's much less likely a player moves from say Whangarei to Christchurch for school education than the same player moves once they leave school as they are given a university scholarship. If a player goes to schools in both the NI and SI they get to choose which team to represent, as many SOO players can do with their club affiliation.

    If this game was played the only interest would be if teammates played against eachother (mate against mate). Otherwise the teams are just an extension of the Super teams.



  • @Bovidae said in North vs. South:

    @Bones I'm not saying it doesn't happen but it's much less likely a player moves from say Whangarei to Christchurch for school education than the same player moves once they leave school as they are given a university scholarship. If a player goes to schools in both the NI and SI they get to choose which team to represent, as many SOO players can do with their club affiliation.

    If this game was played the only interest would be if teammates played against eachother (mate against mate). Otherwise the teams are just an extension of the Super teams.

    Yeah that sounds fairer with them able to choose.

    Can't say I agree at all on the Super teams extension though - did you look at the teams named earlier in the thread? There's a lot of players playing in the opposite island of their province.



  • @MN5 said in North vs. South:

    . Wish I made more of an effort in late 2007.

    I think you made the right call at the time.



  • I've got a better idea that people would be more likely to tune into. Gather 50 of the top NZ players, ABs included. Select two captains, have all players stand out on the field and the two captains just start selecting the other 22 players for their team like schoolyard footy.

    The four players not selected run the touch duties and water 🙂



  • @ACT-Crusader said in North vs. South:

    I've got a better idea that people would be more likely to tune into. Gather 50 of the top NZ players, ABs included. Select two captains, have all players stand out on the field and the two captains just start selecting the other 22 players for their team like schoolyard footy.

    The four players not selected run the touch duties and water 🙂

    Oooh, not bad. But let's think big. The NZRU could finance a year's operations. Run a nationwide/international lottery. Winners get to be "captain" (think Ryder Cup) who get to select their teams on a draft basis (you choose one, i choose one), and you get to coach/manage (with some help from the coach you draft).

    Who wouldn't tip in a $100 to have a crack at coaching the best players in the country for a week? Some would tip in more than that.



  • Mils is an interesting example. Grew up in Southland, played most of his High School rugby down there and still rolls his R's.

    But played his last year with Kelston, and all of his first class rugby north of Taupo.

    If I had guess to I'd say he probably still considers himself a proud Southlander and if he had the choice would be turning out for the South Island.



  • @Frye I love Mils, he is one of my favourite All Blacks, but you guys are really scratching for players if he's getting a jersey



  • @mariner4life he's no chance but he's an interesting example when determining criteria.

    On the other hand I bet Sam Whitelock would consider himself a mainlander nowadays. Stockholm syndrome cough



  • @Frye Yes, Mils is the extreme case if you use high school as your origin as he moved from the SI to NI.

    A player like Cane moved schools too but only from Reporoa College to Tauranga Boys' College. That type of movement would be much more common and wouldn't affect which team you would be eligible for.

    So Read, Whitelock, Smith and Squire would be in the theoretical NI team and Retallick, ALB and DMac in the SI team.


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