Aaron Cruden



  • With a maximum of one Super season and three tests to go in his NZ career I was wondering how the Fern rate his career relative to the other great 10s we have produced.

    Posting this after chatting with a mate who surprised me a bit saying said he rates him second behind Carter as the best 10 we've produced in the professional era. It seemed a little ridiculous at first given he never really owned the jumper.

    The core of his case was he has the Super titles to get into the conversation with Sepncer/Mehrtens, his overall game was more complete with those two having more obvious weaknesses and lastly that while being provincial heroes neither of those two presided over a sustained period of success in black either - which would be the biggest knock on Cruden.

    I'm somewhat swayed - although still find it tough to disregard Spencer's peaks and would have him marginally ahead. What does the Fern think?



  • To be that well regarded he'd have had to go into first receiver way more than he did. He often relied on Dagg to be the main playmaker while he waited for a mismatch, then called for the ball.

    He also for more than half of his career had a short field kicking game, and later in his career over used the chip kick.

    Was a good player but not in the same league as Carlos and Mehrts. I'd have Tony Brown over him too.



  • I would agree that Cruden is rated second behind Carter. He didn't have the highs of Mehrtens and Spencer at their best but Cruden didn't have their lows in performance either. I've seen plenty of Cruden up close for the Chiefs since 2012 where he has been one of the main reasons for the Chiefs' success since then.

    Cruden is undefeated as a starter for the ABs too.



  • Third best behind Carter and Barrett!

    Spencer far too flakey to be considered.



  • The shock at Chiefs fans overrating Crudan!



  • @Kirwan said in Aaron Cruden:

    The shock at Chiefs fans overrating Crudan!

    Ha ha! You Wellingtonians always bangin on about Spencer....

    Hang on....



  • @Kirwan said in Aaron Cruden:

    The shock at Chiefs fans overrating Crudan!

    The shock at someone rating Tony Brown ahead of him...



  • pfft, surely it goes like this...

    DC
    Daylight
    Beaver
    BB
    Cruden-Spencer-Merhts
    Brown-Mannix-Preston-McAllister
    A month of Sundays
    Marc Ellis



  • @taniwharugby said in Aaron Cruden:

    pfft, surely it goes like this...

    DC
    Daylight
    Beaver
    BB
    Cruden-Spencer-Merhts
    Brown-Mannix-Preston-McAllister
    A month of Sundays
    Marc Ellis

    Dammit! How could I forget New Zealands greatest first 5?!?



  • Yeah nah. He would be behind Carter, Mehrts and Spencer for me. You could also argue that Barrett has reached greater heights.

    Having said that he was really good in that 2012-2015 period when Carter was often missing.



  • jesus could you imagine Carlos behind our recent forward pack taking wide A Smith passes? He'd be a nightmare to defend.

    Cruden is a bloody good player, but 2nd on our pro-era 10s is a bit high.



  • @Kirwan said in Aaron Cruden:

    To be that well regarded he'd have had to go into first receiver way more than he did. He often relied on Dagg to be the main playmaker while he waited for a mismatch, then called for the ball.

    He also for more than half of his career had a short field kicking game, and later in his career over used the chip kick.

    Was a good player but not in the same league as Carlos and Mehrts. I'd have Tony Brown over him too.

    Agree with most of that.

    Mehrtens played first receiver consistently - but rarely ever played the playmaker. Very often it was just shovel it along to Alatini/Little/Cullen to do something constructive.

    Then you have the whole defensive angle where Cruden runs rings around Mehrts - that has to count for soemthing.

    Personally preferred Evans game to Cruden's - if we eliminate that 2008 Blues season under Nucifora - better kicking, his peer defensively, seemed more fluid in attack.



  • @Kirwan said in Aaron Cruden:

    The shock at Chiefs fans overrating Crudan!

    I think the biggest shock is anyone rating Tony Brown above him. That's plain idiotic. Brown was always only the next option 10 after the better options went down (and I was a big fan of Browns style of play).

    For much of his career Cruden was going toe to toe with the greatest 10 of all time and matched him during a long winning run of matches.

    If Barrett keeps up his form at 10 he'll likely be rated higher but at the moment I don't know how anyone can anoint him number two as a 10 as he's got one brilliant season - so the one coming will be the one that tells.

    In saying all that I don't think Cruden rates above Mehrts and Spencer, but I'm not sure he rates below them either.

    I was recently watching a highlights video (it was one where these two black guys watch a video on Youtube and then film themselves - kind of strange but it's a whole thing apparently) from 2012 - 2015 and Cruden was involved in a whole lot of the good stuff.



  • Carter

    Cruden: thought about typing "daylight" second but I reckon Cruden's closer than that. His spatial awareness and seemingly limitless "time" puts him right up there. Yes, he played around great guys but were they great because he made them so much better? thinking yes

    Barrett: bizarro having him above Mehrts who didnt really have the supporting cast quite on offer now, plus Mehrts bailed us out of some really tight spots... but ffs Barrett has won the world cup and kicked arse all over the place

    Mehrts

    Spencer: mercurial losses not the AB way



  • Cruden has been a great player, but like Rattue, I don't think he ever really reached the heights that were predicted. I don't think he was ever viewed as quite at the top echelon. He certainly was at super rugby level, and was a good international, but just never quite at that top level.

    Carter, then Mehrts, then everybody else. If Barrett continues his form this year, then that may well change.



  • @taniwharugby said in Aaron Cruden:

    pfft, surely it goes like this...

    DC
    Daylight
    Beaver
    BB
    Cruden-Spencer-Merhts
    Brown-Mannix-Preston-McAllister
    A month of Sundays
    Marc Ellis

    Someone has fraped you. Your posts are usually never this funny



  • Cruden was a very good player but wasn't superstar level. He didn't have a prayer when BB ramped it up last year and tbh I rate LS above him now. No. 2 behind Carter? Cant see that. Would rate him below Mehrts, BB and Carlos.



  • @MajorRage said in Aaron Cruden:

    Cruden has been a great player, but like Rattue, I don't think he ever really reached the heights that were predicted.

    We agree on one thing, Rattue never reached any height!!



  • He's in the convo at 3 for me, behind Fox and Carter in some order I'd need to think about.

    He did sensational things on the field. Henry described him as the best 10 he'd seen after Fox. Carter was a freak, but Fox was a machine. Like Norm Hewitt, Crudes had poor timing being stuck behind a great, and then getting injured once he got his chance



  • @Donsteppa said in Aaron Cruden:

    @Kirwan said in Aaron Cruden:

    The shock at Chiefs fans overrating Crudan!

    The shock at someone rating Tony Brown ahead of him...

    Better kicker (goal kicker and directing the team around the field), better tackler, and didn't hide from running the backline.

    You can't be included in these great ten lists if you won't run the backline.