Wallabies v Ireland #1 - Brisvegas



  • @nta said in Wallabies v Ireland #1 - Brisvegas:

    @derm-mccrum said in Wallabies v Ireland #1 - Brisvegas:

    Glad it’s an SA ref making that call.

    It was a Kiwi TMO.

    Even better. 😏



  • Fucking hell just give it.



  • From a test match where the TMO wasn’t used to a test where there’s too much of it!



  • Marmion in? Probably not.

    That went as expected given the trial lineup and Oz record.

    Congrats Australia. Look froward to seeing the next one.

    Off to work.



  • Well done Qantas Wallabies. All down to the selection of Pete Samu...



  • That was weird. Skeen was saying that there was a knockon in the footage that he could see, but this wasn't on the TV. Very strange.



  • Despite Ireland not playing all their big guns, that's a hell of a win for the Wallabies. Will do them a fucking world of good.



  • Scrum worked. That's good!
    Lineout didn't. That's bad...
    Defence worked. That's good!
    Attack didn't. That's bad...
    The frogurt is also cursed...

    I think if Ireland picked their first choice lineup they'd have won.



  • Loved the kid in green in the background, making it very clear to the ref verbally and with appropriate hand signals - that he was, in fact, a "piston wristed gibbon" - to not give the consolation try.



  • Not enough class today in that Irish starting XV.

    Ireland have world class halves and Ryan is a great lock.

    I predict Gary Ringrose (13) and Dan Leavy (7) will come back in for sure for test 2.

    Great result for Australia, they really hung in there and Beale was brilliant.



  • Excellent physicality by the Wallabies tonight.

    Their midfield and back 3 in attack don’t seem to be on the same page. This has been a problem with the Wallabies for a while, no matter who the personnel are, and that’s why they struggle to put on points.



  • @act-crusader said in Wallabies v Ireland #1 - Brisvegas:

    Excellent physicality by the Wallabies tonight.

    Their midfield and back 3 in attack don’t seem to be on the same page. This has been a problem with the Wallabies for a while, no matter who the personnel are, and that’s why they struggle to put on points.

    Kerevi was almost completely absent, except when he dropped the ball.

    And what's the point of picking a big lump like Timu of your not going to put him on the burst?



  • Wallaby attack was much more threatening than the Irish.

    Wallaby defence very impressive too.



  • Pocock was farkin' good for a player who hasn't played a test in over a year. Beale showed his class too.



  • @bovidae said in Wallabies v Ireland #1 - Brisvegas:

    Pocock was farkin' good for a player who hasn't played a test in over a year. Beale showed his class too.

    I don't get the Pocock hate in NZ. He would walk into the AB 23 imo. MOTM performance tonight.



  • @akan004 said in Wallabies v Ireland #1 - Brisvegas:

    I don't get the Pocock hate in NZ. He would walk into the AB 23 imo. MOTM performance tonight.

    Same reason for the Richie hate everywhere in the world when he was playing: he is a very good player (Richie was much more maligned because he was a much better and more influential player, Pocock is all tackles and turnovers, his ball running is as terrible as Owen Franks')



  • This was the best result all weekend. Who said Super Rugby doesn't build test rugby players, 3-0 I say. The Irish don't really have any backplay what so ever and it showed today but has been evident during the 6N.



  • @akan004 said in Wallabies v Ireland #1 - Brisvegas:

    I don't get the Pocock hate in NZ. He would walk into the AB 23 imo. MOTM performance tonight.

    I don't think it's hate, just that he's awesome in one facet of the game, but weak in others.

    There probably isn't a better exponent of turnovers at the ruck - he's strong, low centre of gravity and a great sense of where to sniff them out. However, that comes at a cost - not a lineout option, doesn't seem to be much of a lifter. often floats on defence looking for a TO opportunity, rarely makes dominant tackles and his ball running is amazingly bad for someone with his physical attributes.

    Would I have him or 2011-2015 Kaino? No contest. Him or McCaw? No contest. Pocock or Cane - Cane by a bit, but not as clear cut as above. Him or Squire ... now I'm starting to think.

    Not helped by trying to squeeze Hooper and Pocock into the same team



  • Aussie certainly on the rise, kudos to Cheika ( who I just can't not like)

    That's not all Ireland's got is it?



  • Do old viewers remember Lee Grant on here and his spouting about a young kid called Beale who was going to be a great and single-handedly save Australian rugby? I think he's finally arrived, hell of a game he played last night.



  • @kiwipie I remember that well and followed the kid from then on. I like to see him play well, but I digress...

    He's only 29

    All the experienced heads played well



  • Not sure if mentioned, this makes Aus the holder of the coveted Raeburn Shield



  • My first ever trip to Suncorp, and I chose a pretty good time to do it.

    Normally my expectations are low in the first match of the season, but I was pleasantly surprised. It was a high-quality physical encounter with a great last 20 minutes.

    Ireland were well below their best, but we forced them into a number of errors with good hard defence and work at the ruck. Pocock gets the praise but equally praise should go to the work of BPA, Timu, Samu and Hooper.

    We took our chances well and will be much better for the hitout. Our lineout was a bit shambolic, and our backline a bit rusty.

    The most pleasing aspect was our defence, especially in midfield - Kerevi and Beale stepped up massively.

    As for Suncorp, what a great stadium. Though the lack of atmosphere puzzled me a bit - barely any work on the PA, not much music, long periods of silence. Felt like the crowd was there to be roused, but nobody ever did...



  • I feel a bit dirty - I'm happy with this result.

    @barbarian said in Wallabies v Ireland #1 - Brisvegas:

    Though the lack of atmosphere puzzled me a bit - barely any work on the PA, not much music, long periods of silence. Felt like the crowd was there to be roused, but nobody ever did...

    TBH, those sound like positives to me.



  • @nepia said in Wallabies v Ireland #1 - Brisvegas:

    TBH, those sound like positives to me.

    Normally I'd agree with you. But things were eerily quiet at times. And I'm not talking about the need for mindless chat, it's stuff that matters - the PA didn't acknowledge Pete Samu coming on for his debut, or Johnny Sexton coming off the bench.

    Both were massive moments in the game and would have got half the crowd on their feet each time, but they were ignored. And that's a shame.



  • @barbarian said in Wallabies v Ireland #1 - Brisvegas:

    @nepia said in Wallabies v Ireland #1 - Brisvegas:

    TBH, those sound like positives to me.

    Normally I'd agree with you. But things were eerily quiet at times. And I'm not talking about the need for mindless chat, it's stuff that matters - the PA didn't acknowledge Pete Samu coming on for his debut, or Johnny Sexton coming off the bench.

    Both were massive moments in the game and would have got half the crowd on their feet each time, but they were ignored. And that's a shame.

    Fair enough, I was thinking of the PA trying to start chants and cheering etc.



  • @barbarian you’ll have to come back during the Super season to witness a ‘we are Red, we are Red’ chant over the PA, they are great.



  • I was reading the ref review on the42

    Re: the disallowed try.

    Van der Westhuizen has awarded the try to Israel Folau but Skeen calls in, “Marius, I want to show you… the situation is foul play, a tackle on a Green player by Gold 5 when Green is not in possession.”

    Van der Westhuizen views the footage above and replies, “Ben, it’s pretty clear to me there that it’s back on the 10-metre line, a player not in possession of the ball being tackled. My decision at the moment is to overturn the try and go back for a penalty against number 5.”

    I've taken some stills from the gif.

    What do you guys think?
    I think if a dummy runner, in front of the ball gets tackled, then that is not the defence's fault.

    Calling back for tackling the player without the ball 5 phases back, for a dummy run. is horseshit. Technically it's penalty to Australia for obstruction.

    However. If they decided the foul play was what 5 Gold was doing to the player on the ground and how long he pinned him down for then fair enough IMO. But that wasn't what they communicated.

    alt text

    alt text



  • @rapido The ball actually went in front of the Irish player that got tackled though, not behind him. He just chose not to catch it. Does that still make him a dummy runner?



  • @kiwimurph said in Wallabies v Ireland #1 - Brisvegas:

    @rapido The ball actually went in front of the Irish player that got tackled though, not behind him. He just chose not to catch it. Does that still make him a dummy runner?

    Yes, it did go in front of the Irish player.

    What I'm saying is that technically there is a moment (in the first screenshot) when the Irish runner is in front of the ball and is moving directly at the Australian defender. He is now basically offside and shouldn't interfere with a defender.

    I'm not saying this should be blown up as a penalty every time, it is not a blatant act of obstruction. There is on really centimetres and seconds in the timing of this.

    My hunch is Skeen only inspected this incident because of the silly business that happened on the ground.

    But I'm wondering, if not worried, if this tackle off the ball had occurred without the pinning down - would there have been cause enough to over-turn a try? That's a dangerous precendent that's going to encourage attacking dummy runners to run full tit into contact with the opposition.



  • Coleman has time not to go on with that tackle. Stick a shoulder in? by all means. But to hit, drive and dump? That's just dumb, and asking to involve the ref. And once you involve the ref...



  • @rapido said in Wallabies v Ireland #1 - Brisvegas:

    @kiwimurph said in Wallabies v Ireland #1 - Brisvegas:

    @rapido The ball actually went in front of the Irish player that got tackled though, not behind him. He just chose not to catch it. Does that still make him a dummy runner?

    That's a dangerous precendent that's going to encourage attacking dummy runners to run full tit into contact with the opposition.

    I see what you are saying but on the flip side Coleman has just lined this bloke up and smashed him - look at the first screenshot you posted - the ball is well past.

    Basically what @mariner4life has said above.



  • @mariner4life said in Wallabies v Ireland #1 - Brisvegas:

    Coleman has time not to go on with that tackle. Stick a shoulder in? by all means. But to hit, drive and dump? That's just dumb, and asking to involve the ref. And once you involve the ref...

    Yes, I agree.

    I think Coleman doubled down and saw it as an opportunity to put in a sly hit, rather than being actually fooled by the dummy.

    I would have like a bit more communication about that part by the 2 officials to ease my paranoia.

    In a sliding door moment: If Coleman had attempted to pull out of the actual tackle before impact - and just brace himself, what would have happened I wonder ..... no arms, shoulder, cards etc etc, christ, now I'm talking myself back round to favouring Coleman because offside player shouldn't run at defenders ......



  • @rapido said in Wallabies v Ireland #1 - Brisvegas:

    @mariner4life said in Wallabies v Ireland #1 - Brisvegas:

    Coleman has time not to go on with that tackle. Stick a shoulder in? by all means. But to hit, drive and dump? That's just dumb, and asking to involve the ref. And once you involve the ref...

    Yes, I agree.

    I think Coleman doubled down and saw it as an opportunity to put in a sly hit, rather than being actually fooled by the dummy.

    I would have like a bit more communication about that part by the 2 officials to ease my paranoia.

    In a sliding door moment: If Coleman had attempted to pull out of the actual tackle before impact - and just brace himself, what would have happened I wonder ..... no arms, shoulder, cards etc etc, christ, now I'm talking myself back round to favouring Coleman because offside player shouldn't run at defenders ......

    again, depends. hold your position and stop him with a "solid" shoulder? no worries. Lean in Sonny Bill style and lay him out? In the hands of the ref. If you are going to play on the edge, be a bit sneaky about it. Don't be a big, dumb target



  • I don't like the try being overturned and a penalty awarded to Ireland simply because I'm sick of seeing dummy runners impeding defenders.



  • @antipodean said in Wallabies v Ireland #1 - Brisvegas:

    I don't like the try being overturned and a penalty awarded to Ireland simply because I'm sick of seeing dummy runners impeding defenders.

    an attitude i have a lot of sympathy for, but the instances that get me pissed off aren't like this one.

    I really hate the front pod of forwards being in front of the ball when the team go wide behind them, and they magically get themselves in the defensive line and stop the defense sliding.

    I don't see so much obstruction these days now that i think about it.



  • @rapido said in Wallabies v Ireland #1 - Brisvegas:

    I was reading the ref review on the42

    Re: the disallowed try.

    Van der Westhuizen has awarded the try to Israel Folau but Skeen calls in, “Marius, I want to show you… the situation is foul play, a tackle on a Green player by Gold 5 when Green is not in possession.”

    Van der Westhuizen views the footage above and replies, “Ben, it’s pretty clear to me there that it’s back on the 10-metre line, a player not in possession of the ball being tackled. My decision at the moment is to overturn the try and go back for a penalty against number 5.”

    I've taken some stills from the gif.

    What do you guys think?
    I think if a dummy runner, in front of the ball gets tackled, then that is not the defence's fault.

    Calling back for tackling the player without the ball 5 phases back, for a dummy run. is horseshit. Technically it's penalty to Australia for obstruction.

    However. If they decided the foul play was what 5 Gold was doing to the player on the ground and how long he pinned him down for then fair enough IMO. But that wasn't what they communicated.

    alt text

    alt text

    Rubbish, if we allow any player without the ball to be tackled just because they were skipped with a pass and are now infront of the ball carrier you will have open season for cheap shots on players not expecting to be tackled. Its a pretty simple concept. If someone doesn't have the ball don't follow through with a tackle on them. Just like if you have lined up a big tackle on the 10 but he gets his pass or kick away you are entitled to a free late hit.

    I don't really care that it disallowed a try. The fact is it should have been picked up at the time and play probably would have been restarted with ireland kicking for the corner or goal not Australia scoring at the other end.



  • I have no issues with the penalty - he tackled a man without the ball.

    I think the better discussion is if it warranted disallowing a try that was scored 5+ phases later. The ref didn't pick it up at the time, it wasn't particularly dirty, nor did it have a tangible impact on the ensuing play.

    Technically it's 'foul play' and under the current guidelines it's fair to pull it back. So I have no problems with the officials, per se. But the guidelines? Hmmm.

    I reckon the criteria should be tightened a bit, so it only allows you to pull up acts that meet the yellow card threshold.

    I know many people watching at the game or at home saw that incident as 'everything wrong with rugby', ie excessive officialdom and pedantry cancelling out a good, fair try.

    Now I don't think non-rugby fans should dictate how we officiate our game, but in this instance I think they had a point.



  • @barbarian said in Wallabies v Ireland #1 - Brisvegas:

    I have no issues with the penalty - he tackled a man without the ball.

    I think the better discussion is if it warranted disallowing a try that was scored 5+ phases later. The ref didn't pick it up at the time, it wasn't particularly dirty, nor did it have a tangible impact on the ensuing play.

    Technically it's 'foul play' and under the current guidelines it's fair to pull it back. So I have no problems with the officials, per se. But the guidelines? Hmmm.

    I reckon the criteria should be tightened a bit, so it only allows you to pull up acts that meet the yellow card threshold.

    I know many people watching at the game or at home saw that incident as 'everything wrong with rugby', ie excessive officialdom and pedantry cancelling out a good, fair try.

    Now I don't think non-rugby fans should dictate how we officiate our game, but in this instance I think they had a point.

    i agree with a lot of this.

    is this the try where the turnover was the ball hitting a wallaby in a strange position?



  • @pukunui said in Wallabies v Ireland #1 - Brisvegas:

    @rapido said in Wallabies v Ireland #1 - Brisvegas:

    I was reading the ref review on the42

    Re: the disallowed try.

    Van der Westhuizen has awarded the try to Israel Folau but Skeen calls in, “Marius, I want to show you… the situation is foul play, a tackle on a Green player by Gold 5 when Green is not in possession.”

    Van der Westhuizen views the footage above and replies, “Ben, it’s pretty clear to me there that it’s back on the 10-metre line, a player not in possession of the ball being tackled. My decision at the moment is to overturn the try and go back for a penalty against number 5.”

    I've taken some stills from the gif.

    What do you guys think?
    I think if a dummy runner, in front of the ball gets tackled, then that is not the defence's fault.

    Calling back for tackling the player without the ball 5 phases back, for a dummy run. is horseshit. Technically it's penalty to Australia for obstruction.

    However. If they decided the foul play was what 5 Gold was doing to the player on the ground and how long he pinned him down for then fair enough IMO. But that wasn't what they communicated.

    alt text

    alt text

    Rubbish, if we allow any player without the ball to be tackled just because they were skipped with a pass and are now infront of the ball carrier you will have open season for cheap shots on players not expecting to be tackled. Its a pretty simple concept. If someone doesn't have the ball don't follow through with a tackle on them. Just like if you have lined up a big tackle on the 10 but he gets his pass or kick away you are entitled to a free late hit.

    I don't really care that it disallowed a try. The fact is it should have been picked up at the time and play probably would have been restarted with ireland kicking for the corner or goal not Australia scoring at the other end.

    It's also a simple concept, if the pass skips you, to not continue your run into an opponent. Slow, stop or change direction to a supporting line. That's what used to happen for a hundred odd years.


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