Let's talk about six, baby



  • OK, so common consensus is we haven't settled on a replacement for Jerome.

    What are the options?

    Squire
    Fifita
    Ioane
    Cane/Todd a la Aussie
    Taufua
    Barrett
    Frizell
    Random bolter from Super Rugby 2019

    The only option I'm 100% against is Fifita.



  • Thread title gets an upvote from me!



  • @billy-tell I have thoguht for a while that Cane would make a great six. Hard hitting, good over the ball, and with enough ball running ability.

    Ioane if he could play tighter and have better facial expressions has potential.



  • I like Squire. He isn't flash but he is reliable and toils in the tight, which is what I what to see.

    The advantage of having BBBR in your team is that he is the 'loosie' type ball carrier in the team and with huge effect.

    Squire does the rest of the 6 type duties



  • Read is the guy who plays the most like Kaino now.

    The Cane/Read/Kaino backrow was well balanced. Rather than change the roles of the loosies and making the 6 the guy that runs in wide channels (like a younger Read used to) I would prefer to move Read to 6 and pick the best 8 (Akira)



  • Nonu to 6?



  • No love for Papalii?



  • Evans and Hemopo are other names you could throw in the mix.

    Be interesting who gets the 6 shirt against Italy.



  • @kiwimurph Todd won't be available for that test. As this is only the 32-men squad, you'd expect Papali'i to get a start at 7, not 6.



  • @mimic

    Paps at 6 and Cane at 7 with Read at 8 is strong, mobile, and pretty balanced. I guess that Dalton couldn't hold up one side in the 1-3-3-1, but is he a good enough ball player out there Or, Read goes out with Taylor, and Paps and Cane go through the middle?



  • Who ever comes in needs to be tall, our lineout is a weapon we should not in any way sacrifice.

    How tall is Hemopo?

    I don't mind the idea of moving Read if there is a viable 8 option.



  • Is Papali'i a viable option in the lineout? Squire has been used a more often in recent tests.

    @mariner4life Hemopo has no problems as a lineout target in SR. Hemopo and Squire are pretty much the same height.



  • @taniwharugby said in Let's talk about six, baby:

    Nonu to 6?

    Hayman to 8, Read to 6 ...

    But seriously, shouldn't we be looking at who has the right height to weight ratio?



  • @billy-tell said in Let's talk about six, baby:

    OK, so common consensus is we haven't settled on a replacement for Jerome.

    What are the options?

    Squire
    Fifita
    Ioane
    Cane/Todd a la Aussie
    Taufua
    Barrett
    Frizell
    Random bolter from Super Rugby 2019

    The only option I'm 100% against is Fifita.

    Are people forgetting that Fifita had one awesome game last year against Argentina. Surely that counts for.....Well something. The poor guy is this generations Mark Carter.



  • @mariner4life said in Let's talk about six, baby:

    Who ever comes in needs to be tall, our lineout is a weapon we should not in any way sacrifice.

    How tall is Hemopo?

    I don't mind the idea of moving Read if there is a viable 8 option.

    I did enjoy SB coming on last weekend and immediately stealing a lineout at the front. Then BBBR had a field day after that as the English hooker psyched himself out.



  • @kiwimurph said in Let's talk about six, baby:

    Evans and Hemopo are other names you could throw in the mix.

    Be interesting who gets the 6 shirt against Italy.

    I would add Seu as well. It's a shame he was injured this year and so missed most of the SR season. I found him outstanding during the last stages of the Mitre 10 Cup.



  • Ok so I'm always going to back a mullet, but these days I think Squire is only good for 40 mins before his intensity really drops off. I take the earlier point where SB came on and made a big difference, he has the height and mobility without being the 'enforcer' type we really covet at 6.
    So....we need a 6 with.....Brodie's Big Heart, Collin's Courage, Richie's Resolve and Jerome's Juddering hits. HmmmmI don't think we've found him just yet.
    This brings us to an interesting point, since Read is buggering off after 2019, it is high time we start developing an 8 - 52nd man - you know who you are get in there! I'd be happy to see Read switch to 6, and allow for Akira to come in at 8.
    Whether Seu can come back to some form, can Squire nail down the 6 spot, whether Frizzle can make more of a statement, are all interesting conundrums for 2019, and will need to be addressed with certainty before RWC.



  • Duluth has nailed it re:balance and being flexible in terms of the jersey numbers.

    All for giving Akira a go next year, but playing with the cards they currently have I'm not sure Cane/Savea/Read isn't adequately balanced. Maybe there is an aversion to it because of how Australia continue to soil themselves with two 7s but that combination seems different.

    It could also be recency bias given Savea came off one of his best games in black.



  • @shadowtrooper said in Let's talk about six, baby:

    Ok so I'm always going to back a mullet, but these days I think Squire is only good for 40 mins before his intensity really drops off. I take the earlier point where SB came on and made a big difference, he has the height and mobility without being the 'enforcer' type we really covet at 6.
    So....we need a 6 with.....Brodie's Big Heart, Collin's Courage, Richie's Resolve and Jerome's Juddering hits. HmmmmI don't think we've found him just yet.
    This brings us to an interesting point, since Read is buggering off after 2019, it is high time we start developing an 8 - 52nd man - you know who you are get in there! I'd be happy to see Read switch to 6, and allow for Akira to come in at 8.
    Whether Seu can come back to some form, can Squire nail down the 6 spot, whether Frizzle can make more of a statement, are all interesting conundrums for 2019, and will need to be addressed with certainty before RWC.

    JC is looking down from heaven and isn't happy you didn't mention his juddering hits too.



  • @cgrant said in Let's talk about six, baby:

    I would add Seu as well. It's a shame he was injured this year and so missed most of the SR season. I found him outstanding during the last stages of the Mitre 10 Cup.

    Seu looks best at 6 or lock but I fear Cooper will play him at no.8 again. He has the athleticism of Fifita but doesn't neglect his work in tight.



  • @mn5 said in Let's talk about six, baby:

    @shadowtrooper said in Let's talk about six, baby:

    Ok so I'm always going to back a mullet, but these days I think Squire is only good for 40 mins before his intensity really drops off. I take the earlier point where SB came on and made a big difference, he has the height and mobility without being the 'enforcer' type we really covet at 6.
    So....we need a 6 with.....Brodie's Big Heart, Collin's Courage, Richie's Resolve and Jerome's Juddering hits. HmmmmI don't think we've found him just yet.
    This brings us to an interesting point, since Read is buggering off after 2019, it is high time we start developing an 8 - 52nd man - you know who you are get in there! I'd be happy to see Read switch to 6, and allow for Akira to come in at 8.
    Whether Seu can come back to some form, can Squire nail down the 6 spot, whether Frizzle can make more of a statement, are all interesting conundrums for 2019, and will need to be addressed with certainty before RWC.

    JC is looking down from heaven and isn't happy you didn't mention his juddering hits too.

    Jerry mastered the double hit , there would be the initial hit from body on body , the part where he often hurt them more , was when he slammed them into the ground , maybe if other players did that with the same brutality, especially if they were wearing black , we might see the rules committee looking at it .



  • @bovidae said in Let's talk about six, baby:

    @cgrant said in Let's talk about six, baby:

    I would add Seu as well. It's a shame he was injured this year and so missed most of the SR season. I found him outstanding during the last stages of the Mitre 10 Cup.

    Seu looks best at 6 or lock but I fear Cooper will play him at no.8 again. He has the athleticism of Fifita but doesn't neglect his work in tight.

    I rate him higher than Fifita and Frizell. He is much stronger than his lean frame may let it think and he's got genuine speed too. Standing at 2.01m, he is a good lineout target. Questions could be asked about his defense against big, powerful forwards running at him. I have never seen him make offensive tackles.



  • Fifitia no thank you, too lazy. Frizell and Hemopo are worth another look perhaps. But for me Scott Barrett and Liam Squire (in that order) are the best two options at 6.

    Horses for courses. If it is dry, Squire is the better runner in space. Scott Barrett offers more at lineout time and at the maul so is better option for a game on a damp track. He was superb off the bench against England last week.



  • I want to see Scott Barrett play some more at during Super Rugby. A tight, lineout ball winning blindside flanker might be just what we need to provide balance, especially in games where Savea is playing rather than Cane.



  • Could Read move back to 6?? IIRC that’s where he started his AB career.



  • @billy-tell said in Let's talk about six, baby:

    Could Read move back to 6?? IIRC that’s where he started his AB career.

    Great idea. Not sure if it's been mentioned on here before but maybe that could mean Akira Ioane could play No 8.



  • I've just had a quick look at the ESPN stats these last two weeks.

    Liam Squire

    v England - 3 x runs for 0 metres gained. 5 tackles made. 0 turnovers generated.

    v Ireland - 5 x runs for 2 metres gained. 3 tackles made. 1 x penalty conceded for a high tackle. 0 turnovers generated.



  • @kiwimurph shit, so he made 2m more than I did, and same amount of turnovers! 🙂



  • I agree, it's not in a great place.



  • Can anyone technical knowledge of backrow play see a problem with 6 Read 7 Cane or Savea 8 A. Ioane?



  • Read started his AB career at 6 but hasn't played there for a long time.

    No reason they couldn't move him there in the 2nd half and bring on a bruising no.8 instead of using Barrett to replace the starting blindside. Very unlikely to happen though as they favour having a second no.7 on the bench, while the locks usually go 80 mins.



  • @sparky said in Let's talk about six, baby:

    Can anyone technical knowledge of backrow play see a problem with 6 Read 7 Cane or Savea 8 A. Ioane?

    technical? no. Time? yes. Read moving to a position he hasn't played in years, and a new guy being brought in to the team. And on top of that, all 4 of those guys play for different Super Rugby sides.

    That's a nicely balanced trio, but it has zero chance of starting a meaningful test together.



  • I think moving Cane to 6 would make more sense, he plays more as a 6 anyway.



  • @taniwharugby said in Let's talk about six, baby:

    I think moving Cane to 6 would make more sense, he plays more as a 6 anyway.

    I'm not sure that's actually true, except for the fact that he is the guy in our pack who hits people really really hard.



  • @taniwharugby Interestingly Cane has sometimes moved to no.8 for the Chiefs but not to 6.

    It would be a brave move of Hansen and co to move players to different positions now.



  • @mariner4life not that we have had a traditional fetcher for some time, but I think he just plays more like Kaino did than any of those we have tried so far and is a bit tighter than a normal 7.

    Isnt as loose as Ardie, Todd sits someone in between the 2.

    @Bovidae yeah cant see them tinkering that much, assuming all are fit, if we were naming the starting trio for the RWC final tomorrow, I think we would see Squire, Cane, Read.



  • @mariner4life said in Let's talk about six, baby:

    That's a nicely balanced trio, but it has zero chance of starting a meaningful test together.

    Scott Barrett is logging minutes at (or in lieu of a) 6 in meaningful tests. It’s not out of the box.



  • @rotated said in Let's talk about six, baby:

    @mariner4life said in Let's talk about six, baby:

    That's a nicely balanced trio, but it has zero chance of starting a meaningful test together.

    Scott Barrett is logging minutes at (or in lieu of a) 6 in meaningful tests. It’s not out of the box.

    That might just be because of the stupid RWC restrictions on squad size. A few extra players won't hurt the budgets that much.



  • @snowy I was not impressed when they mad eit mandatory for everyone to have a full replacement front row on the bench a few years back, 23 players, but RWC squad sizes stayed the same WTF?



  • @machpants Yep, tough on the coaches / selectors. It just means that you can't pick your best team, and that sucks.


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