Grace Millane
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Do we KNOW there was a murder?
We suspect she died in the company of a man who has been arrested and charged with her murder, and appears to have tried to dispose of her body.
Do we know how she died? Not yet.
Let's assume for a second she ODed. He panics and dumps the evidence. A potential scenario.
Guilty of perverting the course, interfering with a corpse etc.
We don't know anything yet.
The dude is currently innocent.
So all these people making grandiose claims, including our dearly beloved PM, should hold their comments until we know more, especially if it compromises an actual murder trial. (Especially Cindy.)
Remember Gabe Tostee and Warriena Wright? Dubious actions and character but mot guilty of murder.
PS. Has Cindy apologised on behalf of NZ to any other murder victim's families?
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@booboo yup the defence lawyer will have a field day with Adern's apology and all the hit pieces in the media.
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@jegga What happened to Grace was absolutely dreadful and I'm heartbroken for her family and friends, but the public grief overload and vigils, articles, Prime Ministerial apology on behalf of the nation for one tourist are absolutely OTT.
If the PM wants to sob about something, how about our appalling domestic violence or suicide rates.
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@jegga said in Alternative needed from the absolute crap of stuff.co.nz:
@mokey or child abuse rates , I guess she’ll get round to it when it’s politically convenient.
What exactly do people do at a vigil for someone they were unaware existed until they died?
Get to know her better?
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@rembrandt said in Alternative needed from the absolute crap of stuff.co.nz:
Half tempted to put up a facebook post...I'm not home for Christmas and due a friend cull anyway..
What will you say?
This women was apparently very nice but not nice enough for a prime ministerial apology and tears when she got murdered
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12174820
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@raznomore Have previous PMs given apologies? https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/109208429/grace-millane-joins-list-of-women-tourists-killed-in-new-zealand-while-travelling
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Does that matter??
I'll go you one further. Has any other prime minister been in power with a murdered tourist and social media being as powerful as it is now? How easy is it to influence world view with a bunch of tweets?
As I said I would have preferred she came out and say "NZ has serious domestic violence and child abuse problems on a whole.... " It absolutely sucks thats not happened but in my opinion in this age a level of damage control, trying to appear that we are a safer country than we are is necessary so that people continue to jump on planes to NZ.
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@raznomore said in Alternative needed from the absolute crap of stuff.co.nz:
Does that matter??
Well it does create a bit of a precedent. I accept that the world is hurtling ever faster towards a news frenzy outrage cycle, but the flip side to that is it's easily forgotten given the next item is a mere click away.
Given the last of them was in 2012, Twitter had existed for ~six years and had 100 million users posting 340 million tweets a day I can't see the need to apologise. Nor does it appeared to have impacted tourist numbers.
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@raznomore I think it is wrong the way she has said it.
Saying we are sorry this happened in NZ would have been ok, but reall,y all she needed to do was offer our sympathies and condolences, but an apology made in that way implies NZ as a country has done something wrong and this is what she is apologising for.
I have nothing to be sorry about, so why was the PM apologising on my behalf?
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@antipodean I dont think you can realistically compare 2012 twitter user statistics with the current social media atmosphere. Where(what medium) , what people post and how far reaching it has become kind of makes it a different planet, even if it is only 6 years later.
I do not want to detract from a very real issue and I am not particularly an Ardern stan. I just see merit, from a purely business point of view, in making a far reaching apology. Even if it is out of embarrasment rather than genuine sympathy.
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Apologising on behalf of all NZers is an absolutely absurd thing to do, not to mention the potential for compromising the case against this guy.
NZ is a safe country to travel too, there's no way this one isolated murder was ever going to hurt our tourism numbers. I personally don't know why the fuck Adern even felt compelled to comment at all. Well, apart from her narcissistic tendency to want to be seen as holier than thou all the bloody time.
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@raznomore As TR put it; sympathies and condolences, sure. But this?
“There is this overwhelming sense of hurt and shame that this has happened in our country, a place that prides itself on our hospitality, on our manaakitanga,” she said, using the Māori word for welcoming others.
“So on behalf of New Zealand, I want to apologise to Grace’s family – your daughter should have been safe here and she wasn’t, and I’m sorry for that.”
Asserting shame and an apology on behalf of the nation is gross overreach IMO.
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I'm gonna run out of upvotes at the amount of top quality posts about this.
So question for all ferners.....( except you sorry @Mokey ) but you'll get the drift.....
Since every fucken left wing feminist thinks the action of one guy means that the every NZ bloke hates women ( and there's been so many sanctimonious articles about this where the writer turns Grace Millanes plight into a story about themselves ) are we allowed to retort with the example of the bloke who died in a hit and run at the hands of a woman?
Of course not cos he was probably white and straight.....
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@taniwharugby said in Grace Millane:
@raznomore I think it is wrong the way she has said it.
Saying we are sorry this happened in NZ would have been ok, but reall,y all she needed to do was offer our sympathies and condolences, but an apology made in that way implies NZ as a country has done something wrong and this is what she is apologising for.
I have nothing to be sorry about, so why was the PM apologising on my behalf?
Word to this post TR.
With all due respect if I'm sorry for this murder I'd better be prepared for a lifetime of sitting at home being sorry for every subsequent murder that occurs between now and my death.
I'm gonna need some incredible time management skills to get quality time for every victim....
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Despite all NZ males toxic masculinity and allegedly seeing women as chattels not one poster has blamed the victim or criticised her for apparently meeting someone on tinder. Bizarre really.
Wasn't the last backpacker killed Birget Bauer from Germany? I didn't really pay too much attention to it at the time but the part that got to me was later one when her parents came to visit, they got the cops to show where they found her body and the detective in charge pulled out a hipflask of whiskey and him and her dad drank it together in silence. The detective was an older guy and you could see that just being out there with the parents while they took in the scene really affected him.
John Key didn't feel the need to apologise on the country's behalf or squeeze out tears on cue either. To be honest Arderns behaviour reminds me of the scene in Veep where Selinas mother was in a coma and her and her press team were discussing when to pull the plug to get the maximum bump in the polls or the longest lasting effect on them.