2019 Tour de France



  • @SynicBast I’m interested to hear your evidence against Thomas.



  • @scribe said in 2019 Tour de France:

    @SynicBast I’m interested to hear your evidence against Thomas.

    I don’t think he’s claiming evidence just suspicion.
    Brailsford has always appeared dodgy and doesn’t quell suspicions.
    I d like to think the sport is in a clean phase but just like cricket, things that appear odd will raise eyebrows



  • @Crucial I asked if he was implying that Thomas was doping and he said yes. That’s more than suspicion.



  • @scribe said in 2019 Tour de France:

    @Crucial I asked if he was implying that Thomas was doping and he said yes. That’s more than suspicion.

    I provided an inference, you took the implication. If I was mounting a prosecution, sure I'd have to provide evidence, but I'm not. I just find it very suspicious particularly given that particular team and its recent demonstrated behaviour - in matters of doping with cycling, the benefit of the doubt generally does not go in their favour in the court of opinion.



  • What happened last night? Seems like carnage on a basic stage?

    G Thomas the only top guy to not lose time. Tour over?



  • @mariner4life said in 2019 Tour de France:

    What happened last night? Seems like carnage on a basic stage?

    G Thomas the only top guy to not lose time. Tour over?

    side winds split the ploton twice in the space of a minute and the front part of the peloton had almost two big teams - Sunweb and Team Dopage Rename. They pounced and upped tempo big time - as would any team with GC ambitoions - so what was meant to be a bit of a progression became a nightmare for the GC contenders caught in the Split - George was on his way back to the peloton loaded up with didons for Krusijwijk and the otheres when the split occurred and just got hammered.

    In so far as the fallout goes - Alaphilippe must now have to reconsider his options as the currentleader - he's strong enough to at least remain a contender for GC but Porte, Fuglsang and a few others are done - Both big GC contenders form Team Dopage Rename are right at the front - so, barring a crash, Thomas and bernal are now favourites - so yeah the tour is almost effectively done and dusted.



  • Fuck it - that's such a rubbish way to fall out of contention!



  • jesus h christ GB screwed the pooch there and so did his team. Total amateur hour.

    why the fcuk would a guy who's fourth on GC and your teams backup option for overall be going back to the car on a windy flat stage. You have people who are literally paid to do that.

    you would never see Bernal going back to get bottles.

    the team is performing well as individuals but their directors are farking twats. But this is a massive individual fcukup which George has to also take a lot of the blame for. Skinny weed like that in a bit of wind he's fcuked. He's also underselling himself as a team leader by doing domestique work - a euro rider would NEVER do what he did.

    "The radios were a bit sketchy and we all got our wires crossed. I ended up going back to get bottles, which was really weird. I don't really know why I was going back but I was under the impression I needed to get them, but the boys didn't even need them. The team car was also confused," Bennett said.

    needs to lose another 10 mins somewhere so he can have a shot at a stage win.. which will only happen if SK crashes.

    farking angry about this! thought this was going to be an awesome year.. then Bevin falls off (AGAIN.. 3rd year in a row) then GB does this. ugh.



  • That's fucked. Super unprofessional.



  • @WillieTheWaiter said in 2019 Tour de France:

    the team is performing well as individuals but their directors are farking twats. But this is a massive individual fcukup which George has to also take a lot of the blame for. Skinny weed like that in a bit of wind he's fcuked. He's also underselling himself as a team leader by doing domestique work - a euro rider would NEVER do what he did.

    That's the bit I don't understand. Surely he has enough experience to respond with "fuck off, I don't do that work anymore"?



  • @antipodean said in 2019 Tour de France:

    @WillieTheWaiter said in 2019 Tour de France:

    the team is performing well as individuals but their directors are farking twats. But this is a massive individual fcukup which George has to also take a lot of the blame for. Skinny weed like that in a bit of wind he's fcuked. He's also underselling himself as a team leader by doing domestique work - a euro rider would NEVER do what he did.

    That's the bit I don't understand. Surely he has enough experience to respond with "fuck off, I don't do that work anymore"?

    Yip. I don't think you can blame the team here.



  • @antipodean said in 2019 Tour de France:

    @WillieTheWaiter said in 2019 Tour de France:

    the team is performing well as individuals but their directors are farking twats. But this is a massive individual fcukup which George has to also take a lot of the blame for. Skinny weed like that in a bit of wind he's fcuked. He's also underselling himself as a team leader by doing domestique work - a euro rider would NEVER do what he did.

    That's the bit I don't understand. Surely he has enough experience to respond with "fuck off, I don't do that work anymore"?

    kiwi mentality? mucking in.. what a dozy fcuker!



  • He's there riding as support to Kruiswijk, with the supposed pay-off that he gets to be team leader at the Vuelta.

    In that role - if you get told to go back and get bidons, you go back to get bidons. I guess what's not clear is whether that was what he got told to do.



  • @WillieTheWaiter said in 2019 Tour de France:

    @antipodean said in 2019 Tour de France:

    @WillieTheWaiter said in 2019 Tour de France:

    the team is performing well as individuals but their directors are farking twats. But this is a massive individual fcukup which George has to also take a lot of the blame for. Skinny weed like that in a bit of wind he's fcuked. He's also underselling himself as a team leader by doing domestique work - a euro rider would NEVER do what he did.

    That's the bit I don't understand. Surely he has enough experience to respond with "fuck off, I don't do that work anymore"?

    kiwi mentality? mucking in.. what a dozy fcuker!

    There's a world of difference between doing extras to assist the team where required and doing stuff others are more suited for and employed to do, particularly given the conditions.

    Don't infer from my comment that he should be a prima donna about it.



  • @Chris-B said in 2019 Tour de France:

    He's there riding as support to Kruiswijk, with the supposed pay-off that he gets to be team leader at the Vuelta.

    In that role - if you get told to go back and get bidons, you go back to get bidons. I guess what's not clear is whether that was what he got told to do.

    Riders that get to be team leader in a Grand Tour aren't your usual domestiques. I can't recall a super-domestique abandoning the rider he's supposed to be supporting to go and get bottles.



  • @Chris-B said in 2019 Tour de France:

    He's there riding as support to Kruiswijk, with the supposed pay-off that he gets to be team leader at the Vuelta.

    In that role - if you get told to go back and get bidons, you go back to get bidons. I guess what's not clear is whether that was what he got told to do.

    nah.. if SK crashes (like he did leading the Giro two years ago) then you've got a second option to go for a high GC placing.

    they have totally removed that option today. But George is the one that needs to take the blame there as much as the team.

    his support duties are in the mountains.. today he should have just been riding near the front and paying attention!

    funnily enough in previous years I would have been happy with this scenario - as a he's no longer a GC threat would have given him more of an opportunity to win a stage. But convinced he's never going to do so as he just doesn't seem to have any sort of hard kick / acceleration over the other climbers. Wearing the yellow jersey, even if just for a day, would have been the best result ever by any kiwi - and that's what he's cocked up his chance to do.



  • @WillieTheWaiter I agree - it's a tactical fuck-up - but, if he got told to go back for the bidons, then I disagree that he should have said, "I'm the Great George Bennett and such tasks are beneath me".

    A second fuck-up by Visma is that Groenewagen also got caught in the same group as George, which doubtless also wasn't supposed to happen on a flat stage. My reading is that they simply didn't anticipate a big GC attack at that point - one of the other riders who got caught out (I think Ciccone) said something along the lines that they thought that danger from crosswinds was past.

    Another problem for George is that he doesn't have a great ITT, so he's always going to be giving up plenty of time to the likes of Thomas - which doesn't make him a great prospect to win overall.

    I'd agree that he's probably a bit unlikely to win a stage by breaking away from the GC riders on a final climb, but he could easily win one like Teuns did earlier - from long distance.



  • The blame lies squarely with team management - despite all our hopes, George was never going to be anything other than a super-domestique failsafe for Kruiswijk. And yes, if he's asked to go back and get waterbottles, he will do that - the watre bottle call is at the call of the directeur sportif - we've seen other GC team leaders go back and fetch waterbottles for sprinters or KOM specialists already in this tour so George going back was nothing unexpected - the issue I have is that team management knew there was a possibility of cross winds splitting the peloton at that stage of the race - I think they were surprised at the severity of the effect but they were aware of a decent probability, so it does come down to an error of judgement letting your #2 GC rider away from the front.

    George is actually best omn the long climbs anyway - he's not a puncheur style rider but more of a long tempo rider - but still it's gutting as he was a threat that the other teams couldn't ignore ...a 1 -2 of Kruiswijk and Bennett was a pretty healthy combo.



  • @antipodean said in 2019 Tour de France:

    @Chris-B said in 2019 Tour de France:

    He's there riding as support to Kruiswijk, with the supposed pay-off that he gets to be team leader at the Vuelta.

    In that role - if you get told to go back and get bidons, you go back to get bidons. I guess what's not clear is whether that was what he got told to do.

    Riders that get to be team leader in a Grand Tour aren't your usual domestiques. I can't recall a super-domestique abandoning the rider he's supposed to be supporting to go and get bottles.

    I think George's position in the GC was pretty much a bonus to TJV. They stuck him on the front for a decent stint on the very first day, to try to set up a stage win for Groenewagen - and presumably to save the legs of their TT riders for the next day. That's not usually what happens to super (climbing) domestiques either.

    They've accidentally burned the bonus of George's high position in the classifications - but, George was pretty clear at the start about what his job was.

    http://www.cyclingnews.com/features/analysing-jumbo-vismas-tour-de-france-team-with-george-bennett/



  • @SynicBast said in 2019 Tour de France:

    And yes, if he's asked to go back and get waterbottles, he will do that - the watre bottle call is at the call of the directeur sportif - we've seen other GC team leaders go back and fetch waterbottles for sprinters or KOM specialists already in this tour so George going back was nothing unexpected

    But they aren't the Great George Bennett. This is a disaster. Not sure if his employers and peers understand the concept of team - do what's necessary to ensure GGB wins.


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