RWC: Japan v Ireland (Pool A)





  • Well done Japan! Did. Not. Expect. That.
    My sympathies with Irish fans. I know exactly how you feel right now.

    I still think Ireland will come out top of the pool. The Boks managed that in 2015 and as impressive as the Brave Blossoms were on the day, they have 2 very tough games coming up against opposition who will definitely not underestimate them.

    By the way: Does that result make Jamie Joseph a coaching "genius" like Eddie Jones?



  • I guess we can expect a couple of these over the next few days:

    Titanic.jpg



  • @Rapido said in RWC: Japan v Ireland (Pool A):

    @taniwharugby said in RWC: Japan v Ireland (Pool A):

    @Rapido as will Ireland if that is who we face, and I cant see them doing that on the evidence of thier play this year.

    As someone else alluded to above, they are gonna have to play thier top lineup again, as they try to top thier pool.

    It will be interesting to see if Japan can replicate that performance again, I'm not sure they can either.

    I don't give a shit about Ireland's run in. They're no longer contenders. But they're potential party poopers. I prefer a Saf 07 run.

    My own theory about 2015, which is a theory a tad disrespectful to Heyneke's boks, is that NZ spent far to much emotional energy in our 1/4 final dispatching a poor France, because we had demons to exorcise, leaving us still partially spent in our relatively brain dead semifinal performance that we squeaked past.

    Great teams can still get past that, of course, we aren't great though. Were currently 'only' good.

    Excellent post. The emotional energy to overcome Ireland (who we owe for last year) potentially leaves us exposed should we make a semi a week later. A flat performance against England or Australia in a semi, like we had against RSA in 2015, and we're toast this time. Hence, my very strong preference for a QF against Japan.



  • @junior said in RWC: Japan v Ireland (Pool A):

    @Rapido said in RWC: Japan v Ireland (Pool A):

    @taniwharugby said in RWC: Japan v Ireland (Pool A):

    @Rapido as will Ireland if that is who we face, and I cant see them doing that on the evidence of thier play this year.

    As someone else alluded to above, they are gonna have to play thier top lineup again, as they try to top thier pool.

    It will be interesting to see if Japan can replicate that performance again, I'm not sure they can either.

    I don't give a shit about Ireland's run in. They're no longer contenders. But they're potential party poopers. I prefer a Saf 07 run.

    My own theory about 2015, which is a theory a tad disrespectful to Heyneke's boks, is that NZ spent far to much emotional energy in our 1/4 final dispatching a poor France, because we had demons to exorcise, leaving us still partially spent in our relatively brain dead semifinal performance that we squeaked past.

    Great teams can still get past that, of course, we aren't great though. Were currently 'only' good.

    Excellent post. The emotional energy to overcome Ireland (who we owe for last year) potentially leaves us exposed should we make a semi a week later. A flat performance against England or Australia in a semi, like we had against RSA in 2015, and we're toast this time. Hence, my very strong preference for a QF against Japan.

    Same as the 2011 final after the perfect SF. If we play Ireland I'd rather win a tight game, at least it might stop any complacency



  • Zero chance Ireland plays 2nd stringers v Samoa. Also zero chance Scotland isn't massively targeting the Japan game.



  • @Billy-Webb said in RWC: Japan v Ireland (Pool A):

    Well done Japan! Did. Not. Expect. That.
    My sympathies with Irish fans. I know exactly how you feel right now.

    I still think Ireland will come out top of the pool. The Boks managed that in 2015 and as impressive as the Brave Blossoms were on the day, they have 2 very tough games coming up against opposition who will definitely not underestimate them.

    By the way: Does that result make Jamie Joseph a coaching "genius" like Eddie Jones?

    It’s an interesting question about JJ. The Highlanders haven’t been as good since he left, and in both teams he gets a lot out of limited players.

    Be interesting to see what he could do with the best. He might have a better approach with someone like Akira too, instead of throwing him publicly under a bus like Hanson did (same with Luatua).



  • @jegga said in RWC: Japan v Ireland (Pool A):

    @Snowy said in RWC: Japan v Ireland (Pool A):

    @ACT-Crusader said in RWC: Japan v Ireland (Pool A):

    There was Irish Richard, but I heard he may have died.

    Well that sucks, and he had good taste in tractors.

    Was a Massey Ferguson fan?

    John Deere. Clearly being Irish he liked green.







  • Ireland incorrectly penalised against Japan

    Ireland coach Joe Schmidt says World Rugby has confirmed that there were three incorrect offsides calls in their shock loss to Japan.
    
    World Cup hosts Japan produced one of the upsets of the tournament by claiming a 19-12 win over Ireland, who were favourites to progress to the playoffs unbeaten.
    
    The game was refereed by Angus Gardner, who was assisted by Jerome Garces and Matthew Carley. Garces will be in charge of Ireland’s next match against Russia on Thursday.
    
    After submitting his referee review to World Rugby in the aftermath of that result, Schmidt was told in the feedback from the governing body that his side was incorrectly penalised on three occassions.
    
    ‘We were penalised for offside four times and we’ve now got the feedback that three of those were incorrect calls,’ Schmidt was quoted by The 42. ‘People were asking us about our discipline.
    
    ‘It’s pretty hard to keep getting off the line and on to the front foot when you are getting those calls. Two of them were from an assitant referee who is going to be refereeing us on Thursday [Jerome Garces], so we know we’re going to have to be on our best behaviour.
    
    ‘One thing I would say about this team is that, generally speaking, it’s unusual for us to have a higher penalty count than our opponents, so it’s frustrating.’
    


  • @Stargazer said in RWC: Japan v Ireland (Pool A):

    Ireland incorrectly penalised against Japan

    Ireland coach Joe Schmidt says World Rugby has confirmed that there were three incorrect offsides calls in their shock loss to Japan.
    
    World Cup hosts Japan produced one of the upsets of the tournament by claiming a 19-12 win over Ireland, who were favourites to progress to the playoffs unbeaten.
    
    The game was refereed by Angus Gardner, who was assisted by Jerome Garces and Matthew Carley. Garces will be in charge of Ireland’s next match against Russia on Thursday.
    
    After submitting his referee review to World Rugby in the aftermath of that result, Schmidt was told in the feedback from the governing body that his side was incorrectly penalised on three occassions.
    
    ‘We were penalised for offside four times and we’ve now got the feedback that three of those were incorrect calls,’ Schmidt was quoted by The 42. ‘People were asking us about our discipline.
    
    ‘It’s pretty hard to keep getting off the line and on to the front foot when you are getting those calls. Two of them were from an assitant referee who is going to be refereeing us on Thursday [Jerome Garces], so we know we’re going to have to be on our best behaviour.
    
    ‘One thing I would say about this team is that, generally speaking, it’s unusual for us to have a higher penalty count than our opponents, so it’s frustrating.’
    

    I'm editing my initial reaction to this post.

    I'd like to see the actual report. Call me skeptical.

    Secondly, did they review how many times you got away with being offside?



  • Ireland coach Joe Schmidt

    "We've had an opportunity to study and analyse our selections, tactics, and performance against Japan last Saturday and come to the conclusion that the players and myself can do a lot better.

    Congratulations to Japan for besting us in most aspects of the match and most importantly on the scoreboard.

    Their WC destiny is in their own hands.

    As is ours.

    We'll need to do a lot better in our remaining pool matches to secure qualification to the QF stages.

    All we can do at this stage is concentrate on our fixtures, work hard between matches, and deliver performances the Irish public can be proud of."

    You're welcome Joe 😉



  • What did the report say about lazy Irish runners?

    Jeepers Schmidt is getting more Irish fan-like by the day. Give your team a f*cking plan B when plan A is not working. Rather than blame the ref post match.



  • @booboo said in RWC: Japan v Ireland (Pool A):

    I'd like to see the actual report. Call me skeptical.
    Secondly, did they review how many times you got away with being offside?

    Agreed, always another side to it.

    At least Joe has realised that Faeces is shit.

    "Two of them were from an assitant referee who is going to be refereeing us on Thursday [Jerome Garces],"

    I honestly don't know whether he is the most incompetent ref I have ever seen, or he has some big, hidden, gambling accounts.



  • @Stargazer said in RWC: Japan v Ireland (Pool A):

    ‘People were asking us about our discipline...generally speaking, it’s unusual for us to have a higher penalty count than our opponents,

    if he wants to keep charging forward thinking there is nothing wrong, I am sure that will come back to bite him on the arse, again.

    So because in the past few years we have more often than not had a higher penalty count than our opposition, so if we have a lower one, does that make the opposition coach think they were hard doen by (I know, they do anyway...cos we is cheetahs)



  • @taniwharugby said in RWC: Japan v Ireland (Pool A):

    @Stargazer said in RWC: Japan v Ireland (Pool A):

    ‘People were asking us about our discipline...generally speaking, it’s unusual for us to have a higher penalty count than our opponents,

    if he wants to keep charging forward thinking there is nothing wrong, I am sure that will come back to bite him on the arse, again.

    So because in the past few years we have more often than not had a higher penalty count than our opposition, so if we have a lower one, does that make the opposition coach think they were hard doen by (I know, they do anyway...cos we is cheetahs)

    Finally.



  • @taniwharugby said in RWC: Japan v Ireland (Pool A):

    @jegga if they manage to roll us during the course of this tournament, they'll come!

    OK. So it's agreed.

    If we come up against Argentina and lose, we all say it was only a friendly,



  • @jegga said in RWC: Japan v Ireland (Pool A):

    There was Thomond78 too

    A sad loss to the Fern. Wrote some great posts.



  • I don't know what would be more embarrassing, losing to Japan or the coach blaming the ref afterwards.

    Man for man the Japanese players arguably are all inferior to their Irish counterparts but they are well coached and played with more passion and skill. Schmidt and the players and fans should take it on the chin and move on.



  • @mofitzy_ said in RWC: Japan v Ireland (Pool A):

    I don't know what would be more embarrassing, losing to Japan or the coach blaming the ref afterwards.

    Man for man the Japanese players arguably are all inferior to their Irish counterparts but they are well coached and played with more passion and skill. Schmidt and the players and fans should take it on the chin and move on.

    The way they mocked us for being bitter about Barnes etc in 2007 and they behave like this after getting owned.
    So far they’ve blamed
    The ref
    The heat
    The humidity
    And the time of day



  • @jegga said in RWC: Japan v Ireland (Pool A):

    @mofitzy_ said in RWC: Japan v Ireland (Pool A):

    I don't know what would be more embarrassing, losing to Japan or the coach blaming the ref afterwards.

    Man for man the Japanese players arguably are all inferior to their Irish counterparts but they are well coached and played with more passion and skill. Schmidt and the players and fans should take it on the chin and move on.

    The way they mocked us for being bitter about Barnes etc in 2007 and they behave like this after getting owned.
    So far they’ve blamed
    The ref
    The heat
    The humidity
    And the time of day

    GH, Richie and the team refused to blame Barnes at the time. The rest of us were not as philosophical



  • @Stargazer said in RWC: Japan v Ireland (Pool A):

    Ireland incorrectly penalised against Japan

    Ireland coach Joe Schmidt says World Rugby has confirmed that there were three incorrect offsides calls in their shock loss to Japan.
    
    World Cup hosts Japan produced one of the upsets of the tournament by claiming a 19-12 win over Ireland, who were favourites to progress to the playoffs unbeaten.
    
    The game was refereed by Angus Gardner, who was assisted by Jerome Garces and Matthew Carley. Garces will be in charge of Ireland’s next match against Russia on Thursday.
    
    After submitting his referee review to World Rugby in the aftermath of that result, Schmidt was told in the feedback from the governing body that his side was incorrectly penalised on three occassions.
    
    ‘We were penalised for offside four times and we’ve now got the feedback that three of those were incorrect calls,’ Schmidt was quoted by The 42. ‘People were asking us about our discipline.
    
    ‘It’s pretty hard to keep getting off the line and on to the front foot when you are getting those calls. Two of them were from an assitant referee who is going to be refereeing us on Thursday [Jerome Garces], so we know we’re going to have to be on our best behaviour.
    
    ‘One thing I would say about this team is that, generally speaking, it’s unusual for us to have a higher penalty count than our opponents, so it’s frustrating.’
    

    Schmidt's feedback is wrong, then. IMO.
    4 times penalised for offside and 3 of them happened to be wrong? Bollocks.

    We must be talking millimetres. No ref should be hung out to dry over millimetres. I'm thinking this is likely a mis-use of the purpose of the refereeing review process.

    A quick search of minute-by-minute commentaries to jog my memory.

    Here are the penalities against Ireland according to commentaries:

    • 70m Penalty - Murray offside (including advantage for another offside)
    • 65m Penalty - ruck penalty
    • 52m Penalty? (Tamura misses goal)
    • 37m Penalty?
    • 35m Penalty - Scrum penalty
    • 32m Penalty - Murray holds on in the ruck
    • 24m Penalty?
    • 16m Penalty - Stander offside
    • 3m Penalty? (Tamura misses goal)

    2 of the 4 offside penalties identified in that list. Both looked offside to me in real time. There were 3 offsides within the 70th minute advantage alone. The Stander offside penalty was for not retiring far enough, not for 'getting off the line' too fast.



  • @Rapido I agree that it is not helpful for the Powerd that be to throw their refs under the bus. They need to ref with confidence, not fear of recriminations



  • @canefan said in RWC: Japan v Ireland (Pool A):

    @Rapido I agree that it is not helpful for the Powerd that be to throw their refs under the bus. They need to ref with confidence, not fear of recriminations

    That is all true.
    They could have tried picking more competent ones rather than criticising the ones they chose.



  • @canefan said in RWC: Japan v Ireland (Pool A):

    @Rapido I agree that it is not helpful for the Powerd that be to throw their refs under the bus. They need to ref with confidence, not fear of recriminations

    But it probably isnt a case of ref being thrown under bus by his bosses. Expect it's a fairly normal review where Irish coach has decided to reveal to Irish media the selected answers to questions that suited him.

    This isnt a full public review.

    Even with all the above, IMO, I'm guessing its "yeah, maybe that was close, depends when you decide ball is out" sort of answers. Portrayed as 100% fact. Because my eyes didn't see any 100% wrong offside calls.



  • I really like Joe Schmidt. As a BoP fan, the Cotter/Schmidt years were some of the most enjoyable rugby viewing I have ever had.

    Unlike some, I do actually admire his/Ireland's coaching game plan & style.
    Without wanting to disrespect Irish backs (Ringrose, Stockdale etc are excellent), Imagine what his approach and coaching could do with a team like Georgia. Could increase their scoring potential by double with Schmidt accuracy in planned backline moves and aerial plays.

    I concede he must be under immense pressure and be extremely frustrated.



  • @Rapido said in RWC: Japan v Ireland (Pool A):

    I concede he must be under immense pressure and be extremely frustrated.

    Tough job, no doubt, and a lot of scrutiny just like the refs.

    Interesting that he picked out a particularly poor ref (AR in that case) to criticise, albeit to try and influence him for their next match like many coaches do these days.



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  • @Duluth said in RWC: Japan v Ireland (Pool A):

    @jegga

    PotHale?

    I think it's always been the same account, he just changed names

    Absolutely correct, Duluth.

    Reports of my demise have been greatly appreciated.


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