Coronavirus - New Zealand
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The numbers arriving at our borders in the past week seem to be increasing massively, especially from India, surely it is only a matter of time before the is an Indian mutation to deal with?
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@canefan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@rapido said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
Auckland higher percentage gone on second doses in Counties-Manukau.
What the fark is going on???!!!
That 'Other Sites' number is the NZDF personnel I think.
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@dogmeat said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@donsteppa maybe but impossible to enforce. How many people live in Waitemata but work in Auckland etc.
Even an Auckland lockdown is impossible to enforce. Completely relies on public buy in, same as it would be for a North Shore lockdown.
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@kirwan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
Even an Auckland lockdown is impossible to enforce. Completely relies on public buy in, same as it would be for a North Shore lockdown.
For sure, but we do have easier places to enforce. The bridge, the tunnels. They were all miles away from the problem areas and businesses suffered that needn't have.
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@snowy said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@kirwan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
Even an Auckland lockdown is impossible to enforce. Completely relies on public buy in, same as it would be for a North Shore lockdown.
For sure, but we do have easier places to enforce. The bridge, the tunnels. They were all miles away from the problem areas and businesses suffered that needn't have.
City of sails.....
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@snowy said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
Pretty much all of our cases are coming from the airport so they are focusing there and working outwards to Manukau, etc. The rest of the country haven't had any issues anyway so why would they get vaccinated (in a rush). Start at the root of the problem and work outwards seems logical.
AT the risk of being a dog with a bone on this subject ....
Isn't that what they've done (with the excess capacity)?
They started at Auckland, at some point 100% of all vaccinations were in Auckland. But there are 1000s and 1000s of health professionals and facilities around the country that can't move to Auckland.
I'd probably look at it as 2 separate rollouts.
The 'surge' rollout where the excess or mobile capacity is moved to Auckland. Clearly this is happening judging by the Counties Manukau stats. Whether it is fast enough or what they are doing to increase velocity etc, sure, there's a conversation in that.Then there is the 'normal' rollout. The aged GPs -or the youngish GPs, nurses, pharamacists etc with kids, clinics and lives they can't just upsticks from and relocate to Auckland for a month.
The rollout isn't going to be even across the board.
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@kirwan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@snowy said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@kirwan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
Even an Auckland lockdown is impossible to enforce. Completely relies on public buy in, same as it would be for a North Shore lockdown.
For sure, but we do have easier places to enforce. The bridge, the tunnels. They were all miles away from the problem areas and businesses suffered that needn't have.
City of sails.....
Yeah. As you said people have to "buy in" but the lockdown dimensions are a bit different.
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@snowy said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@kirwan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@snowy said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@kirwan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
Even an Auckland lockdown is impossible to enforce. Completely relies on public buy in, same as it would be for a North Shore lockdown.
For sure, but we do have easier places to enforce. The bridge, the tunnels. They were all miles away from the problem areas and businesses suffered that needn't have.
City of sails.....
Yeah. As you said people have to "buy in" but the lockdown dimensions are a bit different.
Yeah, just pointing out stupid it is to lockdown "Auckland". It's completely unenforceable, as you could see by people leaving before the deadline.
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@rapido said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@snowy said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
Pretty much all of our cases are coming from the airport so they are focusing there and working outwards to Manukau, etc. The rest of the country haven't had any issues anyway so why would they get vaccinated (in a rush). Start at the root of the problem and work outwards seems logical.
AT the risk of being a dog with a bone on this subject ....
Isn't that what they've done (with the excess capacity)?
They started at Auckland, at some point 100% of all vaccinations were in Auckland. But there are 1000s and 1000s of health professionals and facilities around the country that can't move to Auckland.
I'd probably look at it as 2 separate rollouts.
The 'surge' rollout where the excess or mobile capacity is moved to Auckland. Clearly this is happening judging by the Counties Manukau stats. Whether it is fast enough or what they are doing to increase velocity etc, sure, there's a conversation in that.Then there is the 'normal' rollout. The aged GPs -or the youngish GPs, nurses, pharamacists etc with kids, clinics and lives they can't just upsticks from and relocate to Auckland for a month.
The rollout isn't going to be even across the board.
We might be at the same point here. I think that is what they are doing.
The health professionals in the rest of the country aren't at any risk if we chop it off at the source though, so work outwards from there.
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@kirwan I get where you are coming from but disagree that it is stupid to lockdown Auckland.
It is stupid to believe a lockdown can be totally enforced, but without a 'lockdown' you allow the virus to spread unchecked.
Yes you rely on the goodwill of the people but Akl - 1.6 Mill? A few thousand assholes flouted the intent of the lockdown. For me that is a pretty successful result - purely from a health perspective.
You can argue the semantics but Please stay at home for the good of the granny in Gore just doesn't have the same cachet as L.O.C.K.D.O.W.N.
Where I think there is definitely a valid argument is over the boundaries. Police seem to have moved these slightly each lockdown so I agree there needs to be a more commonsense approach.
The boundary does have to be rural otherwise its too easy to circumvent but communities should not be cut in half.
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@Snowy
But there are 2 different goals.There's
- the chop it off at source to prevent outbreaks (and lockdowns).
- the achieve herd immunity through vaccination so entire country including borders can open.
There are some resources that can be relocated to achieve the first quicker, but there are also a lot of resources available for the second that simply can't or won't be moved to achieve the first quicker.
You don't leave those other resources idle because we are starting form the centre to achieve the first.
Multi-tasking ....
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@kirwan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@snowy said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@kirwan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@snowy said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@kirwan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
Even an Auckland lockdown is impossible to enforce. Completely relies on public buy in, same as it would be for a North Shore lockdown.
For sure, but we do have easier places to enforce. The bridge, the tunnels. They were all miles away from the problem areas and businesses suffered that needn't have.
City of sails.....
Yeah. As you said people have to "buy in" but the lockdown dimensions are a bit different.
Yeah, just pointing out stupid it is to lockdown "Auckland". It's completely unenforceable, as you could see by people leaving before the deadline.
No argument there. Just the boundaries and what defines Auckland.
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@taniwharugby said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
The numbers arriving at our borders in the past week seem to be increasing massively, especially from India, surely it is only a matter of time before the is an Indian mutation to deal with?
- NZ is imposing restrictions on flights arriving from India from 4pm April 11 due to the high number of cases emerging.
- The temporary pause will be in place until April 28.
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@rapido said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Snowy
But there are 2 different goals.There's
- the chop it off at source to prevent outbreaks (and lockdowns).
- the achieve herd immunity through vaccination so entire country including borders can open.
There are some resources that can be relocated to achieve the first quicker, but there are also a lot of resources available for the second that simply can't or won't be moved to achieve the first quicker.
You don't leave those other resources idle because we are starting form the centre to achieve the first.
Multi-tasking ....
Yes. The second is probably lacking but the priorities seem to be about right.
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The ban covers all travellers, including New Zealand citizens and permanent residents.
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@snowy said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@rapido said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Snowy
But there are 2 different goals.There's
- the chop it off at source to prevent outbreaks (and lockdowns).
- the achieve herd immunity through vaccination so entire country including borders can open.
There are some resources that can be relocated to achieve the first quicker, but there are also a lot of resources available for the second that simply can't or won't be moved to achieve the first quicker.
You don't leave those other resources idle because we are starting form the centre to achieve the first.
Multi-tasking ....
Yes. The second is probably lacking but the priorities seem to be about right.
The other element is not rushing in on the vaccines until the stats come through from other countries. I think that is fairly prudent considering that we haven't been at risk and can afford to wait and see.
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@crucial said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
The other element is not rushing in on the vaccines until the stats come through from other countries. I think that is fairly prudent considering that we haven't been at risk and can afford to wait and see.
We've already bought the majority of them so pretty committed already.
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@snowy I thought that we have placed orders - not purchased. We have multiple orders far more than we need.
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@dogmeat said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@snowy I thought that we have placed orders - not purchased. We have multiple orders far more than we need.
Some contractual issues there I guess. Have we paid? What is the deal for the order? Deposits? Etc.
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@dogmeat yeah they said that on TV this morning, they have placed orders, but these still need to get approval, so I guess the contracts are subject to approvals (which must be a common thing?)
But they also said NZ (and Aus) were in the unique position of being able to be a bit more cautious in thier roll outs and see the reactions worldwide and track everything better.
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@taniwharugby said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
But they also said NZ (and Aus) were in the unique position of being able to be a bit more cautious in thier roll outs and see the reactions worldwide and track everything better.
Yes because these other tin pot nations can't be trusted to adequately test and verify the safety and veracity of these vaccines. I'm astonished they managed to spell vaccine let alone make some. Best to be safe and wait until they get around to sending us some we can test ourselves.
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@snowy said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@dogmeat said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@snowy I thought that we have placed orders - not purchased. We have multiple orders far more than we need.
Some contractual issues there I guess. Have we paid? What is the deal for the order? Deposits? Etc.
I don't know how it works but my understanding as news came out was that we placed provisional orders based on approval by Medsafe. When the Pfizer one was approved we then secured/paid for doses.
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@antipodean seems daft, but we have so many Facebook Scientists out there these days, you need to be very careful.
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@antipodean Given the restrictions Oz has introduced around the Astra-Zeneca......
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@dogmeat said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@antipodean Given the restrictions Oz has introduced around the Astra-Zeneca......
I wouldn't be taking guidance from those muppets given their demonstrated incompetence of the last year. It's the one vaccine that has domestic production available, so limiting its use will further delay the vaccination of Australians, prolonging this ridiculous public policy response. Despite being told we were 'in front of the queue' for vaccines, it's patently obvious we're not.
Then there's the arbitrary nature of the restriction which is different to other nations. All for an unbelievably rare risk.
Perhaps if covid-19 is going to kill you and the vaccine is going to kill you, the world is trying to tell you something.
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@antipodean said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@dogmeat said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@antipodean Given the restrictions Oz has introduced around the Astra-Zeneca......
I wouldn't be taking guidance from those muppets given their demonstrated incompetence of the last year. It's the one vaccine that has domestic production available, so limiting its use will further delay the vaccination of Australians, prolonging this ridiculous public policy response. Despite being told we were 'in front of the queue' for vaccines, it's patently obvious we're not.
Then there's the arbitrary nature of the restriction which is different to other nations. All for an unbelievably rare risk.
Perhaps if covid-19 is going to kill you and the vaccine is going to kill you, the world is trying to tell you something.
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These sort of incidents are the tip of the iceberg I suspect
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@canefan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
These sort of incidents are the tip of the iceberg I suspect
That has been common in the US, and I suspect in other countries too.
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For those in the know, I'm sure this doesn't come as any surprise
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FFS - They're agency staff. One of the advantages of using agencies is you get to set the rules. The agency is the employer, if they want your business - they comply.
Too much namby pamby, angsty wringing of hands. Should be "sorry x hasn't had their jab and y hasn't been available to be tested, we don't want them back tomorrow".
Suspect that given MBIE were going to phase out agency staff months ago, they can't actually recruit enough bodies to work for shit money at the COVID front line.
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@dogmeat said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
FFS - They're agency staff. One of the advantages of using agencies is you get to set the rules. The agency is the employer, if they want your business - they comply.
Too much namby pamby, angsty wringing of hands. Should be "sorry x hasn't had their jab and y hasn't been available to be tested, we don't want them back tomorrow".
Suspect that given MBIE were going to phase out agency staff months ago, they can't actually recruit enough bodies to work for shit money at the COVID front line.
Money and a shit job. It's a complete boredom job for little money.
In retrospect MBIE (or MoH) should have set up better controls over the jabs. At the time, because the request for them came via the staff and agencies the assumption was that everyone would be queuing up or anti-jabbers. They didn't take into account the slack arses. -
@bovidae said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@canefan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
These sort of incidents are the tip of the iceberg I suspect
That has been common in the US, and I suspect in other countries too.
What has? Vaccine waste? Probably. However this is a clickbait headline. The person did take to social media, but because they didn't understand that there were already systems in place to make sure that oversupply was used.
It does happen. I guess it's a logistics error or something. Mrs C got her jab a couple of weeks ago from an excess.It's pretty easy to make sure it isn't wasted by inviting those down the list that you have quick access to (such as families or workers) -
@crucial Using SM to vaccinate members of the public if there are vials of vaccine that have been thawed and need to be used ASAP.
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@bovidae said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@crucial Using SM to vaccinate members of the public if there are vials of vaccine that have been thawed and need to be used ASAP.
In this case it was use of SM to cause a problem because some Karen thought that she could manage the situation before actually checking her facts.
The DHB did have a system in place to make sure that excess was used. She got a bunch of people to turn up uninvited. -
Vaccination data updated for the week.
Ahead of target, but I suspect, or have read that their targets are very flexible, and 'constantly updated'.
Anyway. 36,000 vaccinations up since 7 days ago.
