Black Lives Matter



  • Are you open?
    Do you have what I'm looking for?
    Is it sensibly priced?

    No fucks given whatsoever to what colour the shop is



  • @Siam said in Black Lives Matter:

    @JC this isn't a manipulation of an economic principle, it's a racial societal principle being mangled.

    Their use of the word "equity" is ironic

    This is proudly treating people differently based on skin colour and is every bit as egregious as the attitudes in the us pre MLK times, albeit the reasons and justifications offered are different yet equally flawed.

    A slippery slope and it's going to take decades (and blood) to relearn that someone's skin colour is the least interesting thing about them.

    Or, it’s proudly allowing people who choose to do so the opportunity to be treated differently. That’s another way of looking at it. There is nothing to suggest compulsion here, it asks for users to tag businesses that might like to add the icon.

    How is the reaction to this any different to the white saviours of Antica telling black Americans what is best for them?



  • @JC

    There’s a large list of attributes a business can select. Other similar ones include ‘women owned’ & ‘veteran-owned’

    I’d prefer no racial ones but this isn’t a big change



  • @JC we must acknowledge the present day context.

    Would this announcement pass the "what if the other colour said it" test?

    There's a nasty and unnecessary race conflict present already, getting more irrational, and this sort of stance is certainly provocative. All of these voices, and Antifa hypocrites, need to be questioned by way of solid principles.

    We're wilfully traversing further away from a colour blind world - surely the logical goal.



  • For anyone interested, here's a pretty amusing take on the "what if the other colour said it" test?

    This is a creditable example of the dysfunction of our current society. We're turning a blind eye to what we know is true. Right now, we can't be honest enough to truly help the people and groups in need.

    He also poses a great question early on; "do you really care if someone's racist?"



  • @Duluth said in Black Lives Matter:

    @JC

    There’s a large list of attributes a business can select. Other similar ones include ‘women owned’ & ‘veteran-owned’

    I’d prefer no racial ones but this isn’t a big change

    I guess some of the worst atrocities committed in human history have been along the lines of race, so when people see race being hyped up as an important defining characteristic they are rightly concerned.

    As you say this on its own isn't a huge deal, but in the context of what seems to be a renewed focus on racial differences - starting in the States and spreading to other western countries - people will naturally push back on it.

    It does feel like we're going backwards at the moment, and a lot of well intentioned initiatives are having some pretty obvious unintended consequences that are doing more harm than good.



  • @No-Quarter said in Black Lives Matter:

    @Duluth said in Black Lives Matter:

    @JC

    There’s a large list of attributes a business can select. Other similar ones include ‘women owned’ & ‘veteran-owned’

    I’d prefer no racial ones but this isn’t a big change

    I guess some of the worst atrocities committed in human history have been along the lines of race, so when people see race being hyped up as an important defining characteristic they are rightly concerned.

    As you say this on its own isn't a huge deal, but in the context of what seems to be a renewed focus on racial differences - starting in the States and spreading to other western countries - people will naturally push back on it.

    It does feel like we're going backwards at the moment, and a lot of well intentioned initiatives are having some pretty obvious unintended consequences that are doing more harm than good.

    Care to name one that was black vs white?
    Slavery doesn't count because EVERY race suffered that through history.



  • @Siam said in Black Lives Matter:

    @No-Quarter said in Black Lives Matter:

    @Duluth said in Black Lives Matter:

    @JC

    There’s a large list of attributes a business can select. Other similar ones include ‘women owned’ & ‘veteran-owned’

    I’d prefer no racial ones but this isn’t a big change

    I guess some of the worst atrocities committed in human history have been along the lines of race, so when people see race being hyped up as an important defining characteristic they are rightly concerned.

    As you say this on its own isn't a huge deal, but in the context of what seems to be a renewed focus on racial differences - starting in the States and spreading to other western countries - people will naturally push back on it.

    It does feel like we're going backwards at the moment, and a lot of well intentioned initiatives are having some pretty obvious unintended consequences that are doing more harm than good.

    Care to name one that was black vs white?
    Slavery doesn't count because EVERY race suffered that through history.

    Have you heard of South Africa?



  • @gt12 yeah, it's our shining example of how a strategy of truth and reconciliation can overcome an antiquated ideology. The footage of grievance hearings is moving and was a constructive solution to a complex situation. An example of progress.

    Maybe apartheid south Africa doesn't stand out as an atrocity to my definition

    I reckon that most human atrocities are committed in the name of, empire building, religion and intra race conflicts ( nazis, Rwanda, ). Tribalism usurps skin colour as a reason to commit atrocities throughout history as far as I can see



  • @Siam said in Black Lives Matter:

    yeah, it's our shining example of how a strategy of truth and reconciliation can overcome an antiquated ideology

    And replace it with almost exactly the same thing - but this time call it "Affirmative Action"

    Selection for anything based on skin colour is simply wrong.



  • @Victor-Meldrew yep, though that few years after the reconciliation process, the brief hope of the rainbow nation was a real positive. Then it turned racist again.

    To my outsider eyes anyway.



  • @MiketheSnow said in Black Lives Matter:

    Are you open?
    Do you have what I'm looking for?
    Is it sensibly priced?

    No fucks given whatsoever to what colour the shop is

    It's the patronising "People with black skin can't run businesses successfully so it's up to us virtuous white-skinned people to help them out" approach which is so fucked-up.

    If I were running a successful black business, I'd find it bloody demeaning



  • @Siam said in Black Lives Matter:

    @Victor-Meldrew yep, though that few years after the reconciliation process, the brief hope of the rainbow nation was a real positive. Then it turned racist again.

    To my outsider eyes anyway.

    Loads of good stuff going on in Africa. Mainly in places where they generally don't give two stuffs about skin colour.



  • @Siam said in Black Lives Matter:

    @JC we must acknowledge the present day context.

    Would this announcement pass the "what if the other colour said it" test?

    There's a nasty and unnecessary race conflict present already, getting more irrational, and this sort of stance is certainly provocative. All of these voices, and Antifa hypocrites, need to be questioned by way of solid principles.

    We're wilfully traversing further away from a colour blind world - surely the logical goal.

    I’m not denying there is a big problem with the current focus on colour, and many things wrong with the arguments that are used. This, though? Not so much.

    This is a data point that is a binary-state fact. It can be used positively, negatively or not at all. Like most things. Is your problem that it is untrue or that you don’t like that it is publicised?

    Even if you think it’s provocative (I don’t agree BTW), there are a good many people on here, including myself, who reject the very idea that things must be stopped because they provoke people. Provocation, like offence, is in your head. Nobody is making you buy from black businesses, or even requiring you to check. Nobody is making you google businesses at all.

    I have real concerns about a restrictive hard-left agenda but I’ll save my outrage for the very many parts of it that are grounded in shallow ideology rather than facts.



  • @JC said in Black Lives Matter:

    @Siam said in Black Lives Matter:

    @JC we must acknowledge the present day context.

    Would this announcement pass the "what if the other colour said it" test?

    There's a nasty and unnecessary race conflict present already, getting more irrational, and this sort of stance is certainly provocative. All of these voices, and Antifa hypocrites, need to be questioned by way of solid principles.

    We're wilfully traversing further away from a colour blind world - surely the logical goal.

    I’m not denying there is a big problem with the current focus on colour, and many things wrong with the arguments that are used. This, though? Not so much.

    This is a data point that is a binary-state fact. It can be used positively, negatively or not at all. Like most things. Is your problem that it is untrue or that you don’t like that it is publicised?

    Even if you think it’s provocative (I don’t agree BTW), there are a good many people on here, including myself, who reject the very idea that things must be stopped because they provoke people. Provocation, like offence, is in your head. Nobody is making you buy from black businesses, or even requiring you to check. Nobody is making you google businesses at all.

    I have real concerns about a restrictive hard-left agenda but I’ll save my outrage for the very many parts of it that are grounded in shallow ideology rather than facts.

    You don't think it's provocative? Would your opinion hold if a company had a little logo saying "White Owned"?



  • @voodoo I’m not going to get into debating straw men, sorry.



  • @JC good post, thanks . With what you've explained, it reminds me of the free speech principle where even if you hate what's spoken, the principle to have it heard is rock solid, and offence begins and ends with the individual, and their choice.

    I think my hypersensitivity to this callow racial dividing can't stop me glancing at that big elephant in the room when these "initiatives" arise.



  • @Siam I just think that facts can be misrepresented, misused or ignored, but it doesn’t stop them from being facts. These are apparently black owned businesses. Most people will ignore that fact. Some will use it affirmatively to help their community prosper, as I do with preferring local businesses, or even negatively because they dislike any non-black owned businesses. Others will use the fact to avoid the businesses, either on a point of principle, or from actual prejudice. I’m comfortably in the “ignore” bracket and assume that the vast majority of others are too.



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  • The People's Front of Judea or the Judean People's Front?



  • @MiketheSnow said in Black Lives Matter:

    The People's Front of Judea or the Judean People's Front?

    BLM : The refuge of choice for the terminally enraged.



  • Reporting the factual news is now racist and offensive.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-53657013



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  • @Catogrande said in Black Lives Matter:

    Reporting the factual news is now racist and offensive.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-53657013

    How the fuck is Tarantino getting a bye on all of this?



  • Wow what a surprise



  • @No-Quarter said in Black Lives Matter:

    Wow what a surprise

    Police numbers are not the problem, it's the relationship with the community that they think needs work. BLM want to blow the whole thing up







  • From that article ^^^

    my new book ... out on Tuesday
    

    Makes it hard to take his conclusions at face value.



  • @MiketheSnow said in Black Lives Matter:

    @Catogrande said in Black Lives Matter:

    Reporting the factual news is now racist and offensive.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-53657013

    How the fuck is Tarantino getting a bye on all of this?

    Classic story about the filing of that scene ...

    Regarding the Django Unchained shoot, Foxx recalled DiCaprio fretting about saying the n-word over and over in character. “It’s tough for me to say this,” Foxx said DiCaprio told him on the set. But Samuel Jackson encouraged DiCaprio to set his concerns aside.

    “Get over it, motherf—-r,” Foxx recalled Jackson saying. “It’s just another Tuesday, motherf—-r. I don’t give a f— about these motherf—-rs. Look who I am.” Foxx seconded that motion, telling DiCaprio to think from the point-of-view of slave-owner.

    https://www.cheatsheet.com/entertainment/how-samuel-l-jackson-told-leo-dicaprio-to-handle-the-n-word-on-django-unchained.html/



  • @junior said in Black Lives Matter:

    @MiketheSnow said in Black Lives Matter:

    @Catogrande said in Black Lives Matter:

    Reporting the factual news is now racist and offensive.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-53657013

    How the fuck is Tarantino getting a bye on all of this?

    Classic story about the filing of that scene ...

    Regarding the Django Unchained shoot, Foxx recalled DiCaprio fretting about saying the n-word over and over in character. “It’s tough for me to say this,” Foxx said DiCaprio told him on the set. But Samuel Jackson encouraged DiCaprio to set his concerns aside.

    “Get over it, motherf—-r,” Foxx recalled Jackson saying. “It’s just another Tuesday, motherf—-r. I don’t give a f— about these motherf—-rs. Look who I am.” Foxx seconded that motion, telling DiCaprio to think from the point-of-view of slave-owner.

    https://www.cheatsheet.com/entertainment/how-samuel-l-jackson-told-leo-dicaprio-to-handle-the-n-word-on-django-unchained.html/

    There’s nothing not to love about Django. What a movie.





  • @Bones said in Black Lives Matter:

    https://www.mirror.co.uk/3am/celebrity-news/ant-middleton-quits-royal-navy-22494471

    What a great quote from that a article. Not

    "Channel 4 have to go through a process of educating and making sure Ant Middleton takes the right side of history."

    I am really getting to fucking hate all these preachy fluffybunnies and the way they are infecting every strata of our society. fluffybunnies.

    Edit: And I would really like the fluffybunny filter turned off just for this post. I feel that strongly.





  • @Bones said in Black Lives Matter:

    Should probably segregate medical care eh.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/aug/17/black-babies-survival-black-doctors-study

    Less than 3 minutes on the web and you find 42% of the doctors in Florida (where the research was from) are non-white - but it's only the white doctors and their "unconscious racism" who are at fault according to the Guardian.

    Either they have given up hiding their agenda or it's just lazy journalism. Probably both.



  • Billy Vuinpola, like his pal Israel Folau, has criticised Black Lives Matters:

    https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2020/aug/19/black-lives-matter-at-odds-with-my-religious-beliefs-says-billy-vunipola



  • More from Billy Vunipola here.

    https://www.bbc.com/sport/amp/rugby-union/53838242?__twitter_impression=true

    He is entitled to his opinion, but I disagree.



  • @sparky isn't his opinion that it doesn't line up with his beliefs? What do you disagree with?



  • @Bones I don't see the overall aims of BLM as anti-Christian. That is where I disagree with Billy V.

    But it's a choice. I am fine with him or anyone else not kneeling if they didn't want to.

    I really doubt whether Billy V kneels or not influences the decline of racism in the UK.


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