Best T20 XI - General Chat



  • While we're at it, let's do a T20 side.

    This one is a bit trickier to put rules around due to the different criteria required. We need 5 bowlers minimum, and good allrounders are a precious commodity.

    They must have actually played T20 cricket, so no shoehorning messers Hadlee or Crowe into the side.

    We'll break the nominations into categories - batsmen, keeper, allrounders & bowlers.

    For the purposes of this exercise, we will consider an all rounder anyone who is regularly used to bowl during a game and can a also do a decent job with the bat. In this instance, Kane is not an allrounder, he is a batsmen who very occasionally rolls the arm over.

    Like the test XI, players can be nominated in more than one category. Eg - McCullum or Phillips who could both be in the batsmen or keeper category. If a such player receives enough votes to fill more than one spot in the final team, they will take the spot they have received the highest number of votes in. Their other spot will go the person with the next highest number of votes in that category.

    Once nominations are in, I'll decide on the best course of action for voting - whether this be in categories, or just one big poll (bearing in mind there is a max of 23 options per poll)

    And like the test XI, I'll clear up/make up any other rules along the way as I see fit 😉



  • These polls feel like they're a couple years early - we have some genuine world class players just coming on stream that would be nominated, but they don't have the body of work behind them to be justified nominations. In both test and T20I.

    Possibly always the case, but feels more so atm. Recency bias mayhaps?



  • @delicatessen probably a fair point.
    We did do the same thing 5 or so years ago, and some guys like Latham, BJ etc were in the ‘maybe in a few years camp’

    Great position to be in to have current players entering these conversations.



  • (MN5 puts on his grumpy old man hat )

    I've had a look over the threads and some names nominated just scream "average cricketer" to me......Styris, N McCullum, Santner, Butler, Franklin and any number of others. 20/20 is just so shits and gigs and while I get it is massively popular and lucrative I just struggle to take it that seriously compared to to the other two formats. I take an interest if a player I like does well in the IPL but aside from that ? it doesn't mean a great deal.

    Who'd want to be a bowler with edges flying for six on account of meaty bats and short boundaries ? Remember when a six was actually earnt ?

    When Test Cricket is bad it's fucken bad and I'm not denying that, no one likes it when it's meandering to no result......but when it's at it's best there is no format that comes remotely close. Test records are what matter most which is why Virat Kohli has to take second place to Steve Smith for worlds best batsman at the moment in my opinion.



  • i struggle to care about international T20 cricket.

    but i have seriously come around to the "club" level comps. I love the big bash, and having it on every night is cool. And i am starting to "get it" as well. When a guy walks out and his average is 35 i now think "fuck that's pretty impressive". And i seriously think it's been good for the game. The skill level of the very modern player is off the charts, even compared to the champions of our vintage. The shots they can play while batting, the variations they can bowl, but most importantly the fielding that is pulled off can be incredible.

    Watching Glen Maxwell in full flight is something to behold. I watch Dan Christian single handedly win the Sixers a game the other night by hitting a 15-ball 50, against one of the canniest short form bowlers in the game.

    T20 is good for cricket.



  • @mariner4life said in Best T20 XI - General Chat:

    i struggle to care about international T20 cricket.

    but i have seriously come around to the "club" level comps. I love the big bash, and having it on every night is cool. And i am starting to "get it" as well. When a guy walks out and his average is 35 i now think "fuck that's pretty impressive". And i seriously think it's been good for the game. The skill level of the very modern player is off the charts, even compared to the champions of our vintage. The shots they can play while batting, the variations they can bowl, but most importantly the fielding that is pulled off can be incredible.

    Watching Glen Maxwell in full flight is something to behold. I watch Dan Christian single handedly win the Sixers a game the other night by hitting a 15-ball 50, against one of the canniest short form bowlers in the game.

    T20 is good for cricket.

    You make some good points. I think the crossover to longer forms in terms of inventiveness while batting is good for the game as is players fitness and conditioning. There’s also far less ( if any ) bad fielders and number 11s know how to hold a bat far better than the old days.

    I still think by it’s nature it’s far too geared towards batsmen though.



  • of course there is, but listening to Ponting the other night, apparently the statistics say overwhelmingly that if you lose 3 early wickets you generally lose the game, so there is still huge incentive to take wickets. And one good spell can change a game. It's why good bowlers are still valued.

    What needs to change is the mindset. Some days even good bowlers are going to get pumped.

    I find myself wondering what would happen to Glen McGrath these days. Putting the ball in the same place over and over is generally a recipe for getting pumped over the rope. You need variation in pace, angle, release point... There is no rocking up and rolling through a spell.

    As a bowler, i used to hate it. But now i enjoy watching a guy thinking his way through an over.



  • @mariner4life said in Best T20 XI - General Chat:

    of course there is, but listening to Ponting the other night, apparently the statistics say overwhelmingly that if you lose 3 early wickets you generally lose the game, so there is still huge incentive to take wickets. And one good spell can change a game. It's why good bowlers are still valued.

    What needs to change is the mindset. Some days even good bowlers are going to get pumped.

    I find myself wondering what would happen to Glen McGrath these days. Putting the ball in the same place over and over is generally a recipe for getting pumped over the rope. You need variation in pace, angle, release point... There is no rocking up and rolling through a spell.

    As a bowler, i used to hate it. But now i enjoy watching a guy thinking his way through an over.

    The thing that irks me the most is mis hits that go for six. Modern bats and shorter boundaries are a massive part of this happening. Big hitters of the old days like Beefy, Richards and Chris’s dad Lance fucken earnt those sixes far more than guys nowadays.

    McGrath is one of the best pace bowlers ever but perhaps his game wouldn’t suit 20/20 nowadays. There’s no shame in that, our boy Wags has never played one for NZ or ( surprisingly ) an ODI.



  • @MN5 said in Best T20 XI - General Chat:

    @mariner4life said in Best T20 XI - General Chat:

    of course there is, but listening to Ponting the other night, apparently the statistics say overwhelmingly that if you lose 3 early wickets you generally lose the game, so there is still huge incentive to take wickets. And one good spell can change a game. It's why good bowlers are still valued.

    What needs to change is the mindset. Some days even good bowlers are going to get pumped.

    I find myself wondering what would happen to Glen McGrath these days. Putting the ball in the same place over and over is generally a recipe for getting pumped over the rope. You need variation in pace, angle, release point... There is no rocking up and rolling through a spell.

    As a bowler, i used to hate it. But now i enjoy watching a guy thinking his way through an over.

    The thing that irks me the most is mis hits that go for six. Modern bats and shorter boundaries are a massive part of this happening. Big hitters of the old days like Beefy, Richards and Chris’s dad Lance fucken earnt those sixes far more than guys nowadays.

    McGrath is one of the best pace bowlers ever but perhaps his game wouldn’t suit 20/20 nowadays. There’s no shame in that, our boy Wags has never played one for NZ or ( surprisingly ) an ODI.

    if you hit the ball 85+ metres you have fucking earned it.



  • Polls are up.

    Unsurprisingly there are not too many nominations for this team, so it'll be split into 2x polls.

    It's entirely up to the individual on the final make up of their team - ie if you're really mad enough you could fill your team with a keeper and 10 all rounders/bowlers.
    The only rules are you must have a minimum of 5 allrounders or bowlers, and you must pick at least one keeper.

    I'm guessing there will be an obvious 8 or 9 certainties emerge, with a handful of fringe players to make up the final spots, so here is how I plan on finalising the XI:

    1x keeper
    3x specialist batsmen (one of which can be a keeper if they poll high enough)
    5x allrounder/bowlers

    This leaves 2 places open for the 'next bests', from either poll. It also allows me to adjust the team for balance - eg we're not going to play 4 spinners for instance.



  • @mariner4life said in Best T20 XI - General Chat:

    of course there is, but listening to Ponting the other night, apparently the statistics say overwhelmingly that if you lose 3 early wickets you generally lose the game, so there is still huge incentive to take wickets. And one good spell can change a game. It's why good bowlers are still valued.

    What needs to change is the mindset. Some days even good bowlers are going to get pumped.

    I find myself wondering what would happen to Glen McGrath these days. Putting the ball in the same place over and over is generally a recipe for getting pumped over the rope. You need variation in pace, angle, release point... There is no rocking up and rolling through a spell.

    As a bowler, i used to hate it. But now i enjoy watching a guy thinking his way through an over.

    I'm pretty sure McGrath would have developed a decent array of variations. He was reasonably talented.



  • @booboo said in Best T20 XI - General Chat:

    @mariner4life said in Best T20 XI - General Chat:

    of course there is, but listening to Ponting the other night, apparently the statistics say overwhelmingly that if you lose 3 early wickets you generally lose the game, so there is still huge incentive to take wickets. And one good spell can change a game. It's why good bowlers are still valued.

    What needs to change is the mindset. Some days even good bowlers are going to get pumped.

    I find myself wondering what would happen to Glen McGrath these days. Putting the ball in the same place over and over is generally a recipe for getting pumped over the rope. You need variation in pace, angle, release point... There is no rocking up and rolling through a spell.

    As a bowler, i used to hate it. But now i enjoy watching a guy thinking his way through an over.

    I'm pretty sure McGrath would have developed a decent array of variations. He was reasonably talented.

    Pffff. 380 wickets at 22... What did that guy know about short form bowling



  • Our best T20 XI is pretty conclusive.

    McCullum (wk)
    Guptill
    Munro
    Williamson
    Taylor
    Neesham
    Santner
    Vettori
    Southee
    Fergusson
    Boult



  • That's actually a really strong team



  • @Gunner said in Best T20 XI - General Chat:

    Our best T20 XI is pretty conclusive.

    McCullum (wk)
    Guptill
    Munro
    Williamson
    Taylor
    Neesham
    Santner
    Vettori
    Southee
    Fergusson
    Boult

    No Ish? Am surprised. I think.



  • @booboo said in Best T20 XI - General Chat:

    @Gunner said in Best T20 XI - General Chat:

    Our best T20 XI is pretty conclusive.

    McCullum (wk)
    Guptill
    Munro
    Williamson
    Taylor
    Neesham
    Santner
    Vettori
    Southee
    Fergusson
    Boult

    No Ish? Am surprised. I think.

    Agree.

    And is Taylor really a great T20 batter?



  • @nzzp said in Best T20 XI - General Chat:

    @booboo said in Best T20 XI - General Chat:

    @Gunner said in Best T20 XI - General Chat:

    Our best T20 XI is pretty conclusive.

    McCullum (wk)
    Guptill
    Munro
    Williamson
    Taylor
    Neesham
    Santner
    Vettori
    Southee
    Fergusson
    Boult

    No Ish? Am surprised. I think.

    Agree.

    And is Taylor really a great T20 batter?

    Form is temporary, class (in the form of mighty blows over cow corner) is permanent.


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