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@Siam said in Is this thing sustainable?:
@chimoaus loved his idea about giving kids time with no adult intervention.
There's a fucking lot of "I'm telling on you" in this day and age
It’s kind of a shame they are having to organise this when it was standard once upon a time. I was actually proud that my nephew walks to primary school on his own. It’s funny because getting a ride to school in a car was foreign when I went to school. You either caught the bus, walked or rode your bike.
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@chimoaus yep. Perhaps a gradual stepwise change starting at cannabis and opiates might be the most effective strategy.
Would love to learn how Portugal is in regards to their drug policy. Need objective info though, not info aligning to a particular narrative
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This vid makes some good points/observations.
Might not be relevant in your neighbourhood but there are some foreboding signs on a world scale, particularly the 2 western super states.
These are very different times than anything we've had in a couple of centuries in my opinion
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This interview could also be in the podcast thread.
It's Niall Ferguson (history professor and great commentator) being interviewed expertly by John Anderson in Aus.
It's A great conversation and expertly imparts knowledge. It simply makes you feel smarter for watching or listening to it. No ideology spruiking, (nothing like the above vid) just measured observations.
Worth an hour and a half of your time
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@siam said in [Is this thing sustainable?]
Just 2 years ago:
A little bit interesting opening a wee "time capsule"🙂
There are some great comments.
How are we tracking now?🤔
(/post/305026):
Earth
Us
The trajectory that the western world (we know most about that) is on looks to my layman eye to be due a calamity. The place feels imbalanced and unstable.
The systems and standards we've thrived with seem, suddenly, vulnerable.
What to think is going to happen in the next 10 -15 years?
Everything sweet?
Anyone see any big holes?
Disclaimers:
Been ruminating on getting fern input about our progress observations on this for a while.
Can a thread develop based on data and universal truths rather than conspiracy theories?
Solid observations would be preferable.
In our lifetimes of "everything gets better", could we be on the precipice of the down slide, like previous eras in long ago history?
A couple of things have been irksome to me of late.
Eric Weinstein has hinted at the frailty of the economics of the world. I don't know but it seems like there's a puppeteer pulling convenient strings somewhere, to stretch a metaphor. Seems like a lot of worthless stuff valued at a fortune. Weinstein's, "If only you knew" tone of voice triggered me. He's pretty honest.
And, Dan Carlin, I think, mused "If someone could design a fridge guaranteed to last 10 years, would it ever get to market?"
How do we keep up with such "demand" for consumer items? Raw products supply? Developing nations creating a bigger market? Raw products supply
Dunno.
Politics is rooted. Carlin, I like the historical insights, noted that when a 2 party government race gets stale or seesaws, (like most places now) the people look to a pragmatic, strong male figure to lead them out of the mire. US, Phillipines, Brazil etc? I think his reference was the 2nd world war lead up.
Oil's a fluffybunny no matter what way you look at it, unless you have some. How long do we keep chugging down that path? Where/who does the compromise come from?
Gargantuan profits at the expense of everything else seems to be the order of the day. How does that change?
The sobering thought that a week of no internet would be an historical moment. A month and the whole planet's changed forever, no? Ditto electricity. We're a bit vulnerable aren't we?
Islam's not going away in the west. Therefore that pusy scab's not going away without a punch up.
SJWs and lefty dickheads will probably run out of steam. Dunno, hope so.
Environment is too big to be definitive on anything. Like trying to fix a tank with no tools, only bare hands. Won't budge it fuck all but if everyone contributed you could achieve something. Everyone would have to be on board I reckon.
Anyway this thread is for no disputes, more for solid info based musings on our path for the next 20 years. Obviously, I know fuck all but above a few areas to frame some thoughts on. There'll be more I hope.
Lastly I'm not trying to go all henny penny, or indeed chicken little on you, just stuck in my echo chamber with a deep confusion of how everything keeps afloat.
No use dwelling morbidly on the future. Better to focus on a good life now, but it's useful to keep an ear open on what folks can see.
Instinct, nothing else really, nags that we're due a shake up soon. Haven't had one for 80 odd years. Looks like we're all spoiling for some outrage. Won't be a war I dont think but a depression? Dunno
@NTA and @Calf piqued my interest in some things they said in another thread. I hope they won't mind me quoting:
*At the same time, the bigger picture for me is the general theme of the way society is going in western countries. Professional politics is giving us a system that is not representative. The systems we've got are inbred, but still smart enough to let just enough controversy off the leash in order to keep us focussed on arguing little shit, instead of the big stuff.
As @Calf said: housing, finances, bankruptcies, corruption (which is going to happen, but seems to be growing), health, education, etc*.
So what's up you reckon?
She'll be right, it always is, OR anyone see any upcoming icebergs?
All observations and opinions welcome 🙂
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I'll have a go at some thoughts. Which I'm sure leaves everybody surprised ...
Covid has changed a huge amount of things obviously.
@siam said in Is this thing sustainable?:
The trajectory that the western world (we know most about that) is on looks to my layman eye to be due a calamity. The place feels imbalanced and unstable.
I think it feels even worse now to be honest. Although a lot of that is due to more information being available, and people spending more time on listening to other opinions.
The systems and standards we've thrived with seem, suddenly, vulnerable.
What to think is going to happen in the next 10 -15 years?
Everything sweet? >
Anyone see any big holes?The existence of twitter I believe has been the biggest hole in this planets existence. That is not a new opinion though!
In our lifetimes of "everything gets better", could we be on the precipice of the down slide, like previous eras in long ago history?
Unequivocally.
Eric Weinstein has hinted at the frailty of the economics of the world. I don't know but it seems like there's a puppeteer pulling convenient strings somewhere, to stretch a metaphor. Seems like a lot of worthless stuff valued at a fortune. Weinstein's, "If only you knew" tone of voice triggered me. He's pretty honest.
The puppeteer had some fun in the last year didn't (s)he!
How do we keep up with such "demand" for consumer items? Raw products supply? Developing nations creating a bigger market? Raw products supply
Supply and demand still works. The emergence of China has put colossal strain on resources & supply chains across almost every facet, however the building blocks are still there. People don't need the colossal amount of shit they acquire.
Politics is rooted. Carlin, I like the historical insights, noted that when a 2 party government race gets stale or seesaws, (like most places now) the people look to a pragmatic, strong male figure to lead them out of the mire. US, Phillipines, Brazil etc? I think his reference was the 2nd world war lead up.
Im no history buff, but it does feel like we are heading towards another war, of sorts. Politics is rooted because the left and right don't listen to each other anymore. People exist in their echo chambers and simply discredit anybody who disagrees with them. A left right debate is supposed to make you think, not make you angry. Quite a few of us here mock the Guardian consistently, and it should be mocked on many of it's left wing / far left articles. However, it should still be read to understand the basic positioning of those on the other side of the political spectrum.
I also don't feel that people listen so much anymore to learn, but listen to respond.
Oil's a fluffybunny no matter what way you look at it, unless you have some. How long do we keep chugging down that path? Where/who does the compromise come from?
I think we are moving on from oil in a lot of ways. I'm unconvinced on how this affect other supply chains, but the experts seem to need not be worried. So maybe I shouldn't either.
Gargantuan profits at the expense of everything else seems to be the order of the day. How does that change?
I don't think I agree with this anymore. Sustainability is extremely important & although profits will still dictate the majority of corporate strategy, there are huge strides being taken in other areas. So it's no longer at the expensive of everything. Just most things ....
The sobering thought that a week of no internet would be an historical moment. A month and the whole planet's changed forever, no? Ditto electricity. We're a bit vulnerable aren't we?
Even more so now.
Islam's not going away in the west.
Not going down this path. Removed your colour comment ...
SJWs and lefty dickheads will probably run out of steam. Dunno, hope so.
Completely disagree. This is only going to get worse. Racial commentators here in the UK are really stoking the fire in the interest of "raising awareness". It's really bad. It's going to implode into racewars soon, no doubt about it.
Environment is too big to be definitive on anything. Like trying to fix a tank with no tools, only bare hands. Won't budge it fuck all but if everyone contributed you could achieve something. Everyone would have to be on board I reckon.
Just China & the US to go. There is enough extreme wokeness in the US For this to happen there. China, not so much.
Anyway this thread is for no disputes, more for solid info based musings on our path for the next 20 years. Obviously, I know fuck all but above a few areas to frame some thoughts on. There'll be more I hope.
Does my opinion count as solid info .... ?
Lastly I'm not trying to go all henny penny, or indeed chicken little on you, just stuck in my echo chamber with a deep confusion of how everything keeps afloat. No use dwelling morbidly on the future. Better to focus on a good life now, but it's useful to keep an ear open on what folks can see.
Absolutely agree. But what I see, isn't good.
Instinct, nothing else really, nags that we're due a shake up soon. Haven't had one for 80 odd years. Looks like we're all spoiling for some outrage. Won't be a war I dont think but a depression? Dunno
Definitely a depression, but economies, systems and technology are much better now to bounce back. You just need a large percentage to be on board. But it seems the larger percentage is more interested in other things.
@NTA and @Calf piqued my interest in some things they said in another thread. I hope they won't mind me quoting:
*At the same time, the bigger picture for me is the general theme of the way society is going in western countries. Professional politics is giving us a system that is not representative. The systems we've got are inbred, but still smart enough to let just enough controversy off the leash in order to keep us focussed on arguing little shit, instead of the big stuff.It's not representative of the younger generation, agreed. But just because they are shouting the loudest, it doesn't mean they are the majority.
So what's up you reckon? She'll be right, it always is, OR anyone see any upcoming icebergs? All observations and opinions welcome 🙂
I'm not optimistic.
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@majorrage I'm certainly not going to reference my thoughts of 2 years ago, although pleased to say my knowledge of mentioned issues has improved over 2 years.
Not so sure about the outlook for the planet though.
Violence and authority policing are in our future in no small way.
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@majorrage said in Is this thing sustainable?:
@siam said in Is this thing sustainable?:
SJWs and lefty dickheads will probably run out of steam. Dunno, hope so.
Completely disagree. This is only going to get worse. Racial commentators here in the UK are really stoking the fire in the interest of "raising awareness". It's really bad. It's going to implode into racewars soon, no doubt about it.
I watched this the other day and it's enlightening the conclusion that Trevor Phillips has come to. For those that are unaware Trevor has been fighting the good fight against racism forever. He was made head of the Commission for Racial Equality in 2003, and on its abolition in 2006 was appointed full-time chairman of its successor the Equality and Human Rights Commission (EHRC)
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Love this. I have a few opinions and thoughts I might get the laptop out to hammer in later while I am losing money on horses. I find myself disillusioned.
Most of my shit will probably be pulled apart in seconds but I'm not worried. Also as just mentioned, be better over a few beers
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i really should be working, but the War thread prompted me
Is this sustainable? I don't know how it could be, except for the fact that the average joe seems to have less control over shit than ever.
Our current iteration of Shareholder Returns capitalism is creating an ever increasing divide in society i am sure of it. I look at a company like Amazon, and it looks, from the outside, to be everything that is wrong with the current set up. Bezos has more money than fucking god. Yes, i know it's all on paper, but that level of wealth is actually obscene. And Amazon is by all accounts a shitty company. That wealth of Bezos is built on squashing smaller companies, paying their staff fuck all, passing the benefits of efficiencies to the owners, and generally acting in a shitty way. All power to him, the bloke is obviously a fucking genius, and pretty much nothing he is doing is illegal. Does his company pay their fair share of tax? don't be fucking stupid.
Amazon is one example. But there are countless, countless others where the over-riding drive of providing benefit to shareholders is actually detrimental to society as a whole. And in the main it is making the few very rich at the expense of the vast majority. Again, nothing new, but i feel like it is getting worse. And someone always says "oh but your Super fund gets bigger" but i bet the regulations say my Super fund isn't allowed to invest in Amazon.
Industries like banking and insurance are essentials in modern society, but are getting more and more difficult to access because they should involve risk, and risk is bad for shareholder returns (and bonuses, lets not overlook that fact). Health insurance in Aus gets fucking outrageous every single year because they need to maintain that profit. It might hit a tipping point soon enough because the profitable young people are getting out, leaving the unprofitable old people on the books.
My completely uniformed opinion is that the efficiencies we are creating through technology are benefiting a small number of people while leaving an enormous amount behind. Wage growth was stagnant before 2020 proper fucked everything (except for those really rich fluffybunnies who made a fuck ton more), there are less and less opportunities for young people to earn a living. Costs continue to rise (not CPI, fuck that as a measure) for shit people actually spend on, houses, food, insurance, fuel but incomes do not.
And who is there to change anything? Certainly not our elected representatives, who not only are powerless to enact real change, but can't see beyond the next opinion poll, let alone election cycle. People have no power to change anything, but worse than that, can't even ask the right questions. Because we are too easily distracted by the wrong shit. My conspiracy theory is that the culture war is fueled by the "global elite" to keep the plebs fighting among themselves so the status quo is maintained in perpetuity
gah, this is a rambling rant of baseless crap. I am severely disillusioned with Western society at the moment, and my strongly capitalism first ideals are being eroded as i see more and more that the system is failing more and more people.
Feel free to hack this to bits and make me feel better
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I don't discount some of the major threats at the moment, but Western Civilisation has also proven surprisingly resilient in recent centuries. In the 20th Century alone:
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In early 1914 we'd have been morsing the TSF exchange about the dasterdly Kaiser and his Teutonic threat to all we hold dear
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In 1928 we'd have been writing early Disgusted of Tumbridge Wells style letters to the TSF Chronicle about the early signs of financial meltdown, while lamenting growing unequal wealth distribution, and wondering how the stock market could still keep soaring.
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In 1938 arguments would have turned to drunken brawling in The Silver and Fern over whether Chamberlain has achieved peace in our time, or instead sold out 'the survival of Christian civilization ... the long continuity of our institutions, and [the] Empire'
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In 1946 fireside chats with Ferners would have agonised over the future of the atomic bomb, the evil intentions of Stalin, and the iron curtain. While also hailing the impact of "the bikini as the "atom bomb of fashion"" for the Hawt PG13 wall near the Gents in The Silver and Fern.
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In 1975 the end of the Vietnam war would have generated fresh concerns about the spread of communism, Domino Theory, and the fall of Western Civilisation over ferocious games of Pong near the pool table in The Silver and Fern.
I suppose on the law of averages something will eventually bring the Western World completely down. But then, it has been surprisingly durable too. In some of those cases above things did go catastrophically wrong... but each time we came out the other side, eventually, in reasonable shape.
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@donsteppa delete the last line, the whole things is worth reading
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@kiwiwomble said in Is this thing sustainable?:
@donsteppa delete the last line, the whole things is worth reading
Done It was a "tl;dr" line for anyone wondering...
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@donsteppa no way we are on the way out. And there is still a lot of cool shit happening that are causes for optimism.
But there are parts of our future i struggle to wrap my head around.
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@mariner4life said in Is this thing sustainable?:
@donsteppa no way we are on the way out. And there is still a lot of cool shit happening that are causes for optimism.
But there are parts of our future i struggle to wrap my head around.
so
future? yes
what does it looking? next to no idea
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It'll never be the end of the world but it's a shame (and a backwards step) if the kids grow up in a regulated, sanitized, less carefree existence, with adult concepts constantly foistered upon them.
But then again does a battery hen know of the life a free range hen lives?🙂
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I'm an optimist. Reckon we will be fine until that asteroid hits or that zombie virus arrives
Enjoyed this podcast if anyone is interested
Is this thing sustainable?