Coronavirus - New Zealand
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heard last night on the radio that the 6 "shot bro" buses that are gonna help us ramp up the vaccine rates have delivered in a week a grand total of.....
...400 vaccines.. that's not even 10 a day per bus.
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The Fern is the closest I get to reading social media.
Life's too short and I really don't need to know when people have had a dump.
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@williethewaiter said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
heard last night on the radio that the 6 "shot bro" buses that are gonna help us ramp up the vaccine rates have delivered in a week a grand total of.....
...400 vaccines.. that's not even 10 a day per bus.
Had to be tried though. The message was that certain groups found getting to a vax destination too hard and this 'solution ' was being called for by all sides. I think Judith Muldoon called for it the day it started.
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@williethewaiter arent they all in Auckland?
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@dogmeat said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
I'm just pissed that when I got my jab yesterday I wasn't offered a bacon butty.
I would have driven to New Plymouth for itt bar the border lockdown.
I mis-read that as 'tit' and thought 'stripper jab busses' -- you'll get a certain demographic for sure.
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@dogmeat said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
As I said I appreciate the above is not true for everyone and there are really sad cases of families being unable to reunite etc - many of which have been shared here. I genuinely feel for these people, but what's the alternative? NZ are not in a position to open the borders (yet) to everyone because our health system won't cope.
MIQ is only a thing because that's the REAL scandal no one seems to be calling out imho ... healthcare. Presumably decades of cutting and under-investment?
Returnees are victims of the root cause.
I don't think having MIQ is unfair, I don't think capacity limits or issues are unfair. But not putting up a roadmap is unfair.
I'm an adult, just tell me reality so I can deal with it and plan accordingly. That's what adults do.
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@l_n_p said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@dogmeat said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
As I said I appreciate the above is not true for everyone and there are really sad cases of families being unable to reunite etc - many of which have been shared here. I genuinely feel for these people, but what's the alternative? NZ are not in a position to open the borders (yet) to everyone because our health system won't cope.
MIQ is only a thing because that's the REAL scandal no one seems to be calling out imho ... healthcare. Presumably decades of cutting and under-investment?
Returnees are victims of the root cause.
I don't think having MIQ is unfair, I don't think capacity limits or issues are unfair. But not putting up a roadmap is unfair.
I'm an adult, just tell me reality so I can deal with it and plan accordingly. That's what adults do.
Totally agree about the healthcare. I mentioned earlier in the thread that I would like to see focus on an even stronger drive to vaccinate and getting the health system ready.
As for the other, I see your frustration but there is a roadmap. Currently it reads 'we have limited spaces so good luck getting a spot'. You can plan around that for now. I don't see that will change except due to parameters you have no control over anyway so again, no way of 'planning'.
I'd also prefer a priority system, but if I made it 'coming back for a family BBQ' (no insult intended) would be well down the list. -
@crucial said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@l_n_p said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@dogmeat said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
As I said I appreciate the above is not true for everyone and there are really sad cases of families being unable to reunite etc - many of which have been shared here. I genuinely feel for these people, but what's the alternative? NZ are not in a position to open the borders (yet) to everyone because our health system won't cope.
MIQ is only a thing because that's the REAL scandal no one seems to be calling out imho ... healthcare. Presumably decades of cutting and under-investment?
Returnees are victims of the root cause.
I don't think having MIQ is unfair, I don't think capacity limits or issues are unfair. But not putting up a roadmap is unfair.
I'm an adult, just tell me reality so I can deal with it and plan accordingly. That's what adults do.
As for the other, I see your frustration but there is a roadmap. Currently it reads 'we have limited spaces so good luck getting a spot'. You can plan around that for now. I don't see that will change except due to parameters you have no control over anyway so again, no way of 'planning'.
That's not a roadmap. Well it isn't a roadmap that any successful enterprise would use.
That is a point of time report not a map.
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@crucial That's not a roadmap ...
You do know it's okay for a Government to put up a high-level roadmap with dates and some phases and say it's all subject to change because Covid situations are fluid? ... that's normal big-organization stuff let alone government. State their key assumptions and constraints and controls locally and on MIQ/imported infections that NZ can handle/ cannot handle. Reference healthcare capacity in the constraints etc. Talk surge capacity. 10 slides, max.
Anyway would nice to have something that can inform me when MIQ might be dropped (or if it ever will be?)
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Shaun Hendy on presser giving latest modelling
Vax alone won't give herd immunity at 90% of over 5's
However if you add in
Masks
Rapid Tests
Social Distancing
Contact Tracing
Limited border controlsyou can make it no worse than seasonal flu without lockdowns
However if we achieve only 80% of 5+ and relied only on vax modeling says 60K cases and 7K deaths p.a. so we would need to retain lockdowns
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@dogmeat said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
However if we achieve only 80% of 5+ and relied only on vax modeling says 60K cases and 7K deaths p.a. so we would need to retain lockdowns
IF the models are correct, then that's the discussion we have. There are tradeoffs - and you better align the cost of 7,000 deaths with the spend on Pharmac, road safety, etc. Ideally we pick the 'best' option.
again, IF the modelling is correct. The track record hasn't been super flash. Useful, but not definitive.
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@dogmeat said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
Shaun Hendy on presser giving latest modelling
Vax alone won't give herd immunity at 90% of over 5's
However if you add in
> Masks
Rapid Tests
Social Distancing
Contact Tracing
Limited border controlsyou can make it no worse than seasonal flu without lockdowns
However if we achieve only 80% of 5+ and relied only on vax modeling says 60K cases and 7K deaths p.a. so we would need to retain lockdowns
I'm more interested in how many people would die at 90% if we don't all live as anti-social hermits in perpetuity.
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@nzzp although most of the modelling is around 'worst case' scenarios aren't they, which seems to be what they share with the public, assume at higher level they do other modelling too.
We know lockdowns aren't sustainable and won't keep it out, we won't get to 90% vaccination...so what's next option
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@l_n_p said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@crucial That's not a roadmap ...
You do know it's okay for a Government to put up a high-level roadmap with dates and some phases and say it's all subject to change because Covid situations are fluid? ... that's normal big-organization stuff let alone government. State their key assumptions and constraints and controls locally and on MIQ/imported infections that NZ can handle/ cannot handle. Reference healthcare capacity in the constraints etc. Talk surge capacity. 10 slides, max.
Anyway would nice to have something that can inform me when MIQ might be dropped (or if it ever will be?)
I don't get your logic. Let's say that the govt laid out a plan that had 90% vaccination rates complete by end of January at which time MIQ would drop to 5 days for vaccinated travellers, freeing up many rooms with higher turnover.
Then you start planning a trip for next March. Save your pennies, book a flight, tell everyone, get leave organised etc
We don't reach the target so it's pushed back a month as per the stated roadmap meaning that your MIQ booking has now been lost and you have to replan.
Then we get an outbreak via a vaccinated traveller etc etc etcWhere has this stated roadmap got you? A better place?
This is a constantly changing situation and moves forward get made step by step as and when an opening to do so arises, not when planned months ago.
I'm sorry if I seem harsh but I used to have to deal with similar situations daily from expats in situations overseas. The reality is that if you live away from family in another country you can't always have things work out. I myself missed two funerals, one for my grandmother and that was simply due to the logistics of me getting back holding things up for everyone else. Just this year my son and partner were stuck in the UK having decided to ride out the first lockdown there where at least they had income but their visas then didn't have much longer to run. It was three weeks of 24hr monitoring of the booking site to land a spot that was then 6 weeks away.
You live in another country to your loved ones and you simply have to take it on the chin.It's shit but shit happens. There are always those worse off.
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@crucial said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@l_n_p said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@crucial That's not a roadmap ...
You do know it's okay for a Government to put up a high-level roadmap with dates and some phases and say it's all subject to change because Covid situations are fluid? ... that's normal big-organization stuff let alone government. State their key assumptions and constraints and controls locally and on MIQ/imported infections that NZ can handle/ cannot handle. Reference healthcare capacity in the constraints etc. Talk surge capacity. 10 slides, max.
Anyway would nice to have something that can inform me when MIQ might be dropped (or if it ever will be?)
I don't get your logic. Let's say that the govt laid out a plan that had 90% vaccination rates complete by end of January at which time MIQ would drop to 5 days for vaccinated travellers, freeing up many rooms with higher turnover.
Then you start planning a trip for next March. Save your pennies, book a flight, tell everyone, get leave organised etc
We don't reach the target so it's pushed back a month as per the stated roadmap meaning that your MIQ booking has now been lost and you have to replan.
Then we get an outbreak via a vaccinated traveller etc etc etcWhere has this stated roadmap got you? A better place?
This is a constantly changing situation and moves forward get made step by step as and when an opening to do so arises, not when planned months ago.
I'm sorry if I seem harsh but I used to have to deal with similar situations daily from expats in situations overseas. The reality is that if you live away from family in another country you can't always have things work out. I myself missed two funerals, one for my grandmother and that was simply due to the logistics of me getting back holding things up for everyone else. Just this year my son and partner were stuck in the UK having decided to ride out the first lockdown there where at least they had income but their visas then didn't have much longer to run. It was three weeks of 24hr monitoring of the booking site to land a spot that was then 6 weeks away.
You live in another country to your loved ones and you simply have to take it on the chin.It's shit but shit happens. There are always those worse off.
What a wet and weak reposnse.
Nothing wrong with actually providing what they see as a roadmap so that everyone internally and externally, economically and individually, can plan/budget on. We all know things can change but have a map of how they see it now.
Not it sucks but deal with it. That's not leading that is just weakness.
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@hooroo what's the point of planning and budgeting on something that has a slim chance of going to plan? You'd then have everyone bitching and moaning about how they had spent money, arranged functions etc etc and it changed on them.
Giving false hope isn't good leadership either.
I do think that there may be a bit more of a plan soon though hence the modelling being done on vaccination rates etc. There is a need to create a carrot instead of just pointing to the stick.
I wouldn't be making plans on it though. Way too much can happen.