Aussie Rugby



  • Yeah it's all pretty fcked hey. Stopped reading about it frankly. What a cluster.



  • @barbarian said in Aussie Rugby:

    Yeah it's all pretty fcked hey. Stopped reading about it frankly. What a cluster.

    That applies to the entire world ATM!



  • @barbarian said in Aussie Rugby:

    Yeah it's all pretty fcked hey. Stopped reading about it frankly. What a cluster.

    But you and @mariner4life know where it is coming from, right? Let's look at the articles:

    https://www.news.com.au/sport/rugby/rugby-australia-set-to-axe-ceo-raelene-castle-and-bring-in-former-skipper-phil-kearns/news-story/1d93ab9d06a6fd49d75f42727b53ad70

    A tumultuous 12-months has put the writing on the wall for Rugby Australia’s CEO Raelene Castle according to reports, with a former skipper set to step in.

    Time looks to have run out on Raelene Castle’s tenure as Rugby Australia CEO.

    Reports have indicated ...
    with the final nail in the coffin for Castle being the failed bid to secure a new broadcast deal.
    Reports indicate Castle may be lucky to survive the weekend.

    https://www.news.com.au/sport/rugby/rugby-australia-and-raelene-castle-slammed-for-delusional-management/news-story/5080f6c6007c9dfc8d3ca62cb8e99582

    Raelene Castle’s days as Rugby Australia CEO appear numbered, a growing number of reports suggesting there is mounting pressure for a leadership change within the struggling sporting organisation.
    “They must be kidding. Gave themselves a score of 20/25 for participation … For igniting passion in the game they gave a score of 21/25,” a correspondent told The Australian.
    Another source told The Australian, “People are amazed (Castle) has hung on this long, everyone knows it has to come to an end soon,” and the coming few days could be pivotal for the RA CEO.

    The always execrable Christy (not a girl) Doran chimes in with some of his own rubbish

    https://www.foxsports.com.au/rugby/exclusive-embarrassing-contract-gaffe-cost-castles-ra-huge-payout-for-wallabies-legend/news-story/600f34bb84b45e0bcb54d3d4b255e22e

    Exclusive: In yet another shambolic clerical error, sources say that Rugby Australia was forced to pay Wallabies hall of famer Stephen Larkham hundreds of thousands of dollars after then-coach Michael Cheika sacked him as his assistant in late 2018.

    This of course is led by the following photo:

    bb911c5a-86a6-472b-8673-5f93bb238ab9-image.png

    And then the fucking circle jerk from Alan Jones, Phil Kearns, and Rod Kafer - the latter 2 drawing a paycheque from Murdoch and/or sucking the broadcast establishment's dick.

    Gee... the abusive lover - FoxSports - spurned, suddenly turns nasty 🙄 Whatever. Been happening for months.



  • @mariner4life said in Aussie Rugby:

    I just read Castle will be sacked this weekend and replaced by Kearns?

    So long Australian rugby, at least you will always have the 90s

    You could almost understand the panic in Australian Rugby right now, but given the projections of the loss they expect to incur over this year with no product, it's a bit harsh to blame the current board. This train wreck has its formulation well over a decade ago.



  • In the event this does come to pass, I wonder how many clubs I can convince to cease payment of the RA "levy"? 🤔



  • @antipodean said in Aussie Rugby:

    You could almost understand the panic in Australian Rugby right now, but given the projections of the loss they expect to incur over this year with no product, it's a bit harsh to blame the current board. This train wreck has its formulation well over a decade ago.

    And even if we employed the best possible governance and made all the right decisions in the last decade, we'd STILL be rooted to a certain extent. Not that I'm excusing past decision-makers, rather highlighting how challenging this situation is.



  • @barbarian said in Aussie Rugby:

    @antipodean said in Aussie Rugby:

    You could almost understand the panic in Australian Rugby right now, but given the projections of the loss they expect to incur over this year with no product, it's a bit harsh to blame the current board. This train wreck has its formulation well over a decade ago.

    And even if we employed the best possible governance and made all the right decisions in the last decade, we'd STILL be rooted to a certain extent. Not that I'm excusing past decision-makers, rather highlighting how challenging this situation is.

    🤔



  • 🤔



  • @rotated said in Aussie Rugby:

    Any tips for Ralene on how to handle this one Alan Joyce or have you got enough issues of your own?

    World class virtue signalers, piss poor administrators.

    Oh that they are.

    "Earlier this week Castle indicated she will take a 50 per cent pay cut (she will now earn $400,000 a year) and stood down 100 of her fellow Rugby Australia staff members for three months."

    What did $800,000 per annum produce? A hundred clerks preparing PowerPoint presentations on “brand recognition”, “employee engagement”, “fan engagement”, “towards zero emissions”, “diversity and inclusion”? They couldn't have fitted a dozen clerks in the comfortable Rugby Place in the CBD, from which modest base the Qantas Competitive Wallabies won lots of times.

    You've got to wonder by what measure a nexus exists between 100 staff and $800,000 and a half dozen or so matches a year plus an end of year tour which looks after itself - booked in advance by the client's travel agent, every little detail, and managed in the field by the team manager. My son's First XV scrum half went from school to be Wallabies "bag man" for several years (foregoing his opportunity to go on to Eastwood Colts with his team-mates) including the '91 World Cup and he did most of the daily legwork on their tours.

    Whole families manage to travel to Disneyland USA and back without having to take their life coach with them.

    KPI driven triple bottom line fantasies with multi-million dollar negative results.

    Once the dill is punted the "they can’t handle a strong woman/sacked for being a woman" meme will get a run. On the very same day that the Australian Prime Minister will be torn to shreds because his decisions don't suit this lobby or that, and on which not one person will come forward to excuse his actions on the sole basis that he is a bloke.



  • @NTA said in Aussie Rugby:

    In the event this does come to pass, I wonder how many clubs I can convince to cease payment of the RA "levy"? 🤔

    Gee - I recall when Brett Papworth, President of Eastwood Rugby, put something like that forward and was dismissed here as an old fool who had no idea at all about the modern game. 😋



  • @Mick-Gold-Coast-QLD said in Aussie Rugby:

    @NTA said in Aussie Rugby:

    In the event this does come to pass, I wonder how many clubs I can convince to cease payment of the RA "levy"? 🤔

    Gee - I recall when Brett Papworth, President of Eastwood Rugby, put something like that forward and was dismissed here as an old fool who had no idea at all about the modern game. 😋

    Personally speaking, I dismiss him because he's in charge of a club that can't even balance its own books.

    The problem with Pappy's circular argument on rugby in Australia is the same problem Kearns, Poidevin, etc hang their hat on: "Club Rugby gave us 2 World Cups!"

    Which appeals to the dim old farts who mutter into their beer about someone not being from the right school or "a good rugby man" being needed to run things.

    There is a lot of waste in rugby, but if anyone seriously believes the grift at head office stops with the appointment Kearns, they've not been paying attention.



  • Dave Rennie might be having a closer look at his contract and if it has any release clause.



  • @Bovidae said in Aussie Rugby:

    Dave Rennie might be having a closer look at his contract and if it has any release clause.

    He took over the Poo when the coach just left ... the Poo! I think he likes getting shit and trying to mould it into diamonds.



  • But I'm sure he would want to have a good relationship with the CEO.



  • @Bovidae said in Aussie Rugby:

    But I'm sure he would want to have a good relationship with the CEO.

    True ...



  • @Nepia it's momentarily saved you an awkward decision come Bledisloe time



  • @Toddy said in Aussie Rugby:

    @Nepia it's momentarily saved you an awkward decision come Bledisloe time

    No it hasn't - that's just stupid.



  • @Nepia well you do have history of team hopping



  • @Toddy said in Aussie Rugby:

    @Nepia well you do have history of team hopping

    Franchise rugby, not representative rugby.

    (Although if Hammett ever gets promoted to AB coach I'll get back to you.)



  • @NTA

    "Which appeals to the dim old farts who mutter into their beer ..."

    Do you have any time for “good rugby men” who work endlessly to organise their clubs; allocate jobs to office holders and rouseabouts; collect registration fees and insurance dues from players who avoid paying because they're always broke; arrange jerseys and food and water and sideline medicos and referees; take the field unfit when the thirds are short because the tight head slept in; go to work to babysit keen youngsters and bludgers with rights; look after their young family; commence a season colliding with an extraordinary external crisis and suddenly get crook and hospitalised with a dicky heart when they really don't have time for that; who then must find their way back to health while planning a solution for long term club survival?

    Or is that a phenomenon which simply did not occur before the turn of the century?

    "the right school" - life at Summer Heights High at the hands of that horrid Chris Lilley must have been quite awful. I trust you lose that chip on your shoulder before the time comes when you are summarily dismissed as "dim" and "old" and irrelevant, you'll have your time cut out controlling your temper on that alone.

    I do recall our lot discussing schools when we were young fathers. We must have had the time to do that last century because putting 120 or 140 young fellas on the paddock each weekend just happened without us having to make any effort at all. I read that on the Fern somewhere.

    It mostly involved a well lubricated spirited argument between us Irish Catholics whether our sons were better off going to the Marist Brothers at Joeys, De La Salle Brothers at Oakhill or the Christian Brothers at Riverview. Yes, evil Christians all – the horror. The other half of the school families were long term local Lebanese and they couldn’t believe how us madmen could argue that issue year after year. They led such generous families, who were proud to lay claim to rugby in large part because of Nick Shehadie.

    Always someone would try to drag John Cootes into the brawl, because he knew a bit about that sort of thing, but he’d just sit and smile and sneak another durry off me while his wife wasn’t watching. Neither Cootes nor Ballesty nor Mathers complained about the demands of the further work they had to do for the game in retirement.

    Brett Papworth? A brace of knowledgeable business savvy members say you are wrong squared but this is the internet so no-one will know that.

    His fellow board members include Ian Williams (a Qantas Winning Wallaby) who was next after Campese to head overseas for a handsome fee, in Japan. We were not happy. He re-emerged years later as the forward scout for the first of the big law practices entering Japan – made a fortune as senior partner. He’s an old fuddy duddy in his mid-50s now, fluent in their language, with a reputation for excellence in the serious end of the law business. His standing with Japanese fans is so good that the organisers insisted he return to feature in their World Cup promotional campaigns. He is quite lucid, doesn’t “mutter”. What would Williams and Papworth know?

    The Club owns its own ground in an Eastwood-Epping back street, surrounded by houses – TG Milner Field - training grounds, a lawn bowling club and a swathe of off street parking. Milner houses a fabulous club which fed and watered us during our best years – all afternoon a la carte lunches ending at kick out o'clock. Then along came FBT, RBT and the pokies and complaints from the surrounding houses. That was followed by fundamental demographic change, sudden and rapid. The area changed from what the real estate agents used refer to as “Vatican circle” (surrounding a leading parish church and school) to a Korean enclave and then Chinese.

    Eastwood’s junior clubs halved in less than 20 years. Brett’s junior club, for which he has toiled throughout his adult life, died in 2017, as did ours. Matt Burke’s St Gerard Majella has gone. There are now seven junior clubs from Ryde to Dural, 30 odd kilometres – we had a dozen all but in sight of each other! Eastwood Rugby must relocate 30 kilometres north west to the epicentre of a rugby friendly population. They will sell Milner for $30 million odd to finance that, it is taking time because they take that responsibility seriously. How would you manage all those things differently?

    Your remarks about his financial mis-management are disingenuous, mere embroidery, without anything of substance to support them. Easy innit?

    Let me know of your experience in dealing with paradigm shift in a community sporting environment. What has Papworth’s Board done so badly, that you would not have done?

    On Kearns – I made no comment on that.

    I will note he had his Arts-Economics degree before his first Wallaby jersey. In that he is disciplined like Snaky Smith, Brendan Cannon, Farr-Jones, Brett Robinson, Doug Howlett, Ewen Mackenzie, Marty Roebuck and Jannie du Plessis. He has operated successfully in the finance industry since rugby retirement; been financially successful in his private investment activities; and a community fun run he initiated 20 years ago has raised $30 million for medical equipment in childrens hospitals. Kearns came up with that idea while he was waiting in outpatients with his son and spotted a need. He makes no comment about that in rugby media presumably because they are not a profitable target.

    He plays a role in television commentary which meets broadcast objectives perfectly well, amusing himself at the vitriol from the easily fooled. Greg Martin is the same - he has been on a ratings winning breakfast radio crew in Brisbane for years and knows what works.

    In what characteristic does Phil Kearns not meet your standards?

    He’d be mad to take the role I say, it is a poisoned chalice. Australian rugby’s next victim will be Dave Rennie, then they will go after the new ARU CEO.



  • @Mick-Gold-Coast-QLD said in Aussie Rugby:

    @NTA

    "Which appeals to the dim old farts who mutter into their beer ..."

    Do you have any time for “good rugby men” who work endlessly to organise their clubs; allocate jobs to office holders and rouseabouts; collect registration fees and insurance dues from players who avoid paying because they're always broke; arrange jerseys and food and water and sideline medicos and referees; take the field unfit when the thirds are short because the tight head slept in; go to work to babysit keen youngsters and bludgers with rights; look after their young family; commence a season colliding with an extraordinary external crisis and suddenly get crook and hospitalised with a dicky heart when they really don't have time for that; who then must find their way back to health while planning a solution for long term club survival?

    Or is that a phenomenon which simply did not occur before the turn of the century?

    "the right school" - life at Summer Heights High at the hands of that horrid Chris Lilley must have been quite awful. I trust you lose that chip on your shoulder before the time comes when you are summarily dismissed as "dim" and "old" and irrelevant, you'll have your time cut out controlling your temper on that alone.

    I do recall our lot discussing schools when we were young fathers. We must have had the time to do that last century because putting 120 or 140 young fellas on the paddock each weekend just happened without us having to make any effort at all. I read that on the Fern somewhere.

    It mostly involved a well lubricated spirited argument between us Irish Catholics whether our sons were better off going to the Marist Brothers at Joeys, De La Salle Brothers at Oakhill or the Christian Brothers at Riverview. Yes, evil Christians all – the horror. The other half of the school families were long term local Lebanese and they couldn’t believe how us madmen could argue that issue year after year. They led such generous families, who were proud to lay claim to rugby in large part because of Nick Shehadie.

    Always someone would try to drag John Cootes into the brawl, because he knew a bit about that sort of thing, but he’d just sit and smile and sneak another durry off me while his wife wasn’t watching. Neither Cootes nor Ballesty nor Mathers complained about the demands of the further work they had to do for the game in retirement.

    Brett Papworth? A brace of knowledgeable business savvy members say you are wrong squared but this is the internet so no-one will know that.

    His fellow board members include Ian Williams (a Qantas Winning Wallaby) who was next after Campese to head overseas for a handsome fee, in Japan. We were not happy. He re-emerged years later as the forward scout for the first of the big law practices entering Japan – made a fortune as senior partner. He’s an old fuddy duddy in his mid-50s now, fluent in their language, with a reputation for excellence in the serious end of the law business. His standing with Japanese fans is so good that the organisers insisted he return to feature in their World Cup promotional campaigns. He is quite lucid, doesn’t “mutter”. What would Williams and Papworth know?

    The Club owns its own ground in an Eastwood-Epping back street, surrounded by houses – TG Milner Field - training grounds, a lawn bowling club and a swathe of off street parking. Milner houses a fabulous club which fed and watered us during our best years – all afternoon a la carte lunches ending at kick out o'clock. Then along came FBT, RBT and the pokies and complaints from the surrounding houses. That was followed by fundamental demographic change, sudden and rapid. The area changed from what the real estate agents used refer to as “Vatican circle” (surrounding a leading parish church and school) to a Korean enclave and then Chinese.

    Eastwood’s junior clubs halved in less than 20 years. Brett’s junior club, for which he has toiled throughout his adult life, died in 2017, as did ours. Matt Burke’s St Gerard Majella has gone. There are now seven junior clubs from Ryde to Dural, 30 odd kilometres – we had a dozen all but in sight of each other! Eastwood Rugby must relocate 30 kilometres north west to the epicentre of a rugby friendly population. They will sell Milner for $30 million odd to finance that, it is taking time because they take that responsibility seriously. How would you manage all those things differently?

    Your remarks about his financial mis-management are disingenuous, mere embroidery, without anything of substance to support them. Easy innit?

    Let me know of your experience in dealing with paradigm shift in a community sporting environment. What has Papworth’s Board done so badly, that you would not have done?

    On Kearns – I made no comment on that.

    I will note he had his Arts-Economics degree before his first Wallaby jersey. In that he is disciplined like Snaky Smith, Brendan Cannon, Farr-Jones, Brett Robinson, Doug Howlett, Ewen Mackenzie, Marty Roebuck and Jannie du Plessis. He has operated successfully in the finance industry since rugby retirement; been financially successful in his private investment activities; and a community fun run he initiated 20 years ago has raised $30 million for medical equipment in childrens hospitals. Kearns came up with that idea while he was waiting in outpatients with his son and spotted a need. He makes no comment about that in rugby media presumably because they are not a profitable target.

    He plays a role in television commentary which meets broadcast objectives perfectly well, amusing himself at the vitriol from the easily fooled. Greg Martin is the same - he has been on a ratings winning breakfast radio crew in Brisbane for years and knows what works.

    In what characteristic does Phil Kearns not meet your standards?

    He’d be mad to take the role I say, it is a poisoned chalice. Australian rugby’s next victim will be Dave Rennie, then they will go after the new ARU CEO.

    TL;DR



  • @Mick-Gold-Coast-QLD said in Aussie Rugby:

    Do you have any time for “good rugby men” who work endlessly to organise their clubs;

    Yeah. Me! Though to be fair, we actually run our club at break even; we'd do better, but about 50% of our revenue goes to charity every year, so... 🤷

    (BTW the entire Millner complex was leased to the RSL in the first place because of decades of mismanagement, including the club nearly going broke several times. Then they sold it to shore up more failures. Those are the facts).



  • Yeah @NTA what's your position on guys who donate everything to keep clubs alive? Huh? Huh?

    You blokes, who sit on your committees, trying to provide a place for guys to play, you sicken me



  • Geoff says it pretty much how I see it, from the outside admitedly

    https://www.theroar.com.au/2020/04/06/the-wrap-rugbys-ugly-in-fighting-just-got-uglier/



  • @Machpants said in Aussie Rugby:

    Geoff says it pretty much how I see it, from the outside admitedly

    https://www.theroar.com.au/2020/04/06/the-wrap-rugbys-ugly-in-fighting-just-got-uglier/

    Bang on. And while the rights value heads lower, the players should realise they get paid less when that happens.

    Not the time to be pissing into the tent.





  • She seems to have survived the weekend. At least a few days longer than the News Corp mob were howling for.



  • @Bovidae

    Fuck'im. Hope he gets Kearns.



  • @booboo said in Aussie Rugby:

    She seems to have survived the weekend. At least a few days longer than the News Corp mob were howling for.

    what a miracle 🙄



  • @gt12 said in Aussie Rugby:

    @Bovidae

    Fuck'im. Hope he gets Kearns.

    Really? Did you feel the same about Henry, Gatland and Schmidt?

    If it's going to be a Randwick takeover let them go down in flames by themselves.



  • @Bovidae said in Aussie Rugby:

    @gt12 said in Aussie Rugby:

    @Bovidae

    Fuck'im. Hope he gets Kearns.

    Really? Did you feel the same about Henry, Gatland and Schmidt?

    If it's going to be a Randwick takeover let them go down in flames by themselves.

    Plenty felt the same about Deans. It's different going to be coach of Aussie or SA. Perhaps even England.



  • @Kirwan But Deans is a Cantab, so of course we hate him! 😉



  • @Bovidae said in Aussie Rugby:

    @gt12 said in Aussie Rugby:

    @Bovidae

    Fuck'im. Hope he gets Kearns.

    Really? Did you feel the same about Henry, Gatland and Schmidt?

    If it's going to be a Randwick takeover let them go down in flames by themselves.

    No, no, and not really.

    Coaching up North and coaching the Aussies to take back the Bledisloe are very different things to me. He had plenty of choices of job, good on him for maximizing his revenue, but also - fuck him.



  • SA is the biggest rival to me so I don't feel the same about whoever coaches Aussie.

    And remember Rennie was my choice to coach the ABs.



  • @Bovidae said in Aussie Rugby:

    SA is the biggest rival to me so I don't feel the same about whoever coaches Aussie.

    And remember Rennie was my choice to coach the ABs.

    Mine too.

    But, not now now; he’s in it for the money and that’s fine.

    His chance has come and gone - he’ll go to Japan or wherever next to further cash in, perhaps England or another major team, but he won’t coach the ABs.



  • Going out on an unpopular limb here, but I actually don't think Kearns would be that bad as CEO.

    1. He is smart. Maybe not a genius, but definitely smart enough to know what he doesn't know. He'll put smart people around him, his ego isn't so big that he will try to do it himself.

    2. He has a massive roladex - yes, jobs for the boys etc, but if he needs to speak to a CEO in Sydney or Melbourne, or get a charity fundraiser going, he can open the door. That's definitely useful.

    3. He's a decent guy - yeah, I know some of you have different views, heard different stories, but 90% of folk I know have a positive view of him being a decent (but deviant) bastard, including my personal experience with him.

    4. Media - they'll give him massive reign to get stuff done. While this isn't always optimal, I think sometimes a bit of runway makes a massive difference. He'll get this. Just having fuckwits like Alan Jones off his back will give him huge breathing space.



  • @voodoo That last point certainly matters more than it seems - wasting time on PR to deal with constant sniping from the media has to diminish performance just from having to waste attention on it.



  • @voodoo so he'd be complicit in the campaign against RA to continue the very problem it faces; underfunded and ring fenced media.



  • @antipodean mate, I dunno. I'm not privy to all the minutiae of it all. I just dont think he'd be the worst choice



  • @voodoo said in Aussie Rugby:

    Going out on an unpopular limb here, but I actually don't think Kearns would be that bad as CEO.

    1. He is smart. Maybe not a genius, but definitely smart enough to know what he doesn't know. He'll put smart people around him, his ego isn't so big that he will try to do it himself.

    Is he?

    He's a terrible commentator. One-eyed and perpetually hard done by. He was still whinging about Richie McCaw's cheating a couple of seasons after Richie had retired.

    Doesn't preclude him from being a good CEO, but not someone who'd be near the top of my list.


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