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    1993 Lions tour

    Sports Talk
    britishlions allblacks
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    • Duluth
      Duluth last edited by Duluth

      Someone has posted highlights of the entire 1993 Lions tour on youtube. Including all the provincial matches.

      I think this might have been posted on TSF a couple of years ago but its worthy of its own thread. Particularly as it seems the Sky pop up channel only has rights to the 2005 tour

      The VHS rip quality improves after the first few minutes

      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 8
      • MajorRage
        MajorRage last edited by

        Special memory for me as first every road trip to the final test with my Dad as one of the boys ... few beers in the car, and probably about 5,000 mentions of the word "fuck".

        A coming-of-age moment.

        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 3
        • Catogrande
          Catogrande last edited by

          @Duluth Thanks for posting that, some great footage. A few stand out things, Ieuen Evans was on fire in that series, how many bombs did Gavin Hastings drop? And Zinzan Brooke had an even bigger melon than I remembered.

          Salacious Crumb 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
          • Damo
            Damo last edited by

            The third test was my first ever test. Awesome first.

            M 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
            • Siam
              Siam last edited by

              Cheers @Duluth for the clips

              Forgotten how Foxy dug us out of that BIG hole in Chch

              Made me think of all the close losses the Lions have had at all 3 countries (Sth Africa games spring to mind too).

              Getting ahead of things but I can see the next Lions to SA being a bit of a changing of the guard type scenario.

              Pretty strong Lions side in 93

              1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
              • Nepia
                Nepia last edited by

                Nice, I think I've still got those videos somewhere in storage back home.

                That Magpies v Lions game was awesome. I went to the 83 one as well and we sucked, so it was awesome to see Hewitt and co kick their butts.

                What's funny is the minimal focus on Richards stomping on Bunce. If that was today there would be a lot more focus on it, TBF if it was the other way around the NH press would have turned it into the evilist act of 1993.

                Bovidae 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 2
                • MN5
                  MN5 last edited by

                  Coached AND captained by Scotsmen. Sigh, those were the days.

                  I remember they came to train at my school. Martin Bayfield had to duck some low flying aircraft.

                  1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                  • Salacious Crumb
                    Salacious Crumb @Catogrande last edited by Salacious Crumb

                    @Catogrande said in 1993 Lions tour:

                    A few stand out things...

                    British Lions 1993 Tour Part 1

                    Vs. NZ Maori

                    15:50 - or thereabouts...

                    Maori winger #11 Allen Prince sprints down touchline giving a hospitable in-your-face middle-finger to the Lions cover defence on his way to scoring a try.

                    What stands out to me is comms never mentioned, a stand-out again 'cos we were probly using two fingers back then before kiwi culture became more absorbed by American/Hollywood influence. Prince was surfing a New Wave.

                    I reckon if Prince had tried to do the same today talk-radio & social media would blow up and he would have been subjected to heaps of tsk-tsk scrutiny (see Nepia's comment above re: Dean Richards stomping Frank Bunce's ear off) and have to do the tail between legs apology tour on tv.

                    gollum 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                    • Bovidae
                      Bovidae @Nepia last edited by

                      @Nepia said in 1993 Lions tour:

                      Nice, I think I've still got those videos somewhere in storage back home.

                      That Magpies v Lions game was awesome. I went to the 83 one as well and we sucked, so it was awesome to see Hewitt and co kick their butts.

                      Same for me with Waikato. Thrashed in 1983 (Ollie Campbell got a bucketload of points) but returned the favour in spades in 1993. That midweek Lions team played like they didn't want to be there for the last provincial game, except for Bumface.

                      @MN5 Peter Wright - one of the worst modern-day Lions players ever.

                      MN5 Salacious Crumb 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
                      • MN5
                        MN5 @Bovidae last edited by MN5

                        @Bovidae said in 1993 Lions tour:

                        @Nepia said in 1993 Lions tour:

                        Nice, I think I've still got those videos somewhere in storage back home.

                        That Magpies v Lions game was awesome. I went to the 83 one as well and we sucked, so it was awesome to see Hewitt and co kick their butts.

                        Same for me with Waikato. Thrashed in 1983 (Ollie Campbell got a bucketload of points) but returned the favour in spades in 1993. That midweek Lions team played like they didn't want to be there for the last provincial game, except for Bumface.

                        @MN5 Peter Wright - one of the worst modern-day Lions players ever.

                        Haha. They called him 'teapot' on the tour cos he always had his hands on his hips as opposed to actually playing dynamic rugby.

                        I'd argue Damian Cronin and Andy Reed were even worse. Gav Hastings was an awesome captain though and his bro did ok before getting injured.

                        I could be wrong but I think it may have been an all Scottish tight 5 vs Waikato? How embarassing. Scotland went so far downhill when Jeffrey, Calder and Sole retired all about the same time.

                        Bovidae 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                        • Salacious Crumb
                          Salacious Crumb @Bovidae last edited by

                          @Bovidae said in 1993 Lions tour:

                          Same for me with Waikato.

                          That try can't even remember who scored it featuring Mitch striding through a gap and offloading was a thing of beauty.

                          That midweek Lions team played like they didn't want to be there for the last provincial game, except for Bumface.

                          Bumface had a cheeky smile on his face in the post-match interview.

                          1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                          • taniwharugby
                            taniwharugby last edited by

                            LOved watching Doug Te Puni score that try from the grass banks, dont recall seeing that interview with him before, classic!

                            MN5 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                            • MN5
                              MN5 @taniwharugby last edited by

                              @taniwharugby said in 1993 Lions tour:

                              LOved watching Doug Te Puni score that try from the grass banks, dont recall seeing that interview with him before, classic!

                              What a good effort, he outpaced a halfback!

                              I think Gav Hastings got in a bit of shit at home for pointing out that his midweek countrymen were fucken poor. Apparently there was a massive divide between the midweekers and test players. The former got aquainted with more than a few pubs by the sounds of things...

                              1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                              • Bovidae
                                Bovidae @MN5 last edited by

                                @MN5 Yes

                                1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                • gollum
                                  gollum @Salacious Crumb last edited by

                                  @Salacious-Crumb said in 1993 Lions tour:

                                  Prince's move would have been better had they (the Maori) not lost. It is still stuck in my mind as one of the most pathetic things I've seen a player do. And I've watch Chris Ashton play.

                                  As I recall it he got a fair bit of stick at the time, less for the finger, more for doing to finger & then losing.

                                  Bones 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                  • Bones
                                    Bones @gollum last edited by

                                    @gollum said in 1993 Lions tour:

                                    @Salacious-Crumb said in 1993 Lions tour:

                                    Prince's move would have been better had they (the Maori) not lost. It is still stuck in my mind as one of the most pathetic things I've seen a player do. And I've watch Chris Ashton play.

                                    As I recall it he got a fair bit of stick at the time, less for the finger, more for doing to finger & then losing.

                                    Yeah, watching those highlights he got made to look stupid a couple of times too, so not all too smart.

                                    1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                    • M
                                      mooshld @Damo last edited by

                                      @Damo said in 1993 Lions tour:

                                      The third test was my first ever test. Awesome first.

                                      The first was mine.

                                      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                      • MN5
                                        MN5 last edited by

                                        You could have quite comfortably landed a jet on any one of the waikato frontrowers heads.

                                        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                        • gollum
                                          gollum last edited by

                                          Also has anyone ever made running fast look as awkward & painful as Walter Little? Yes, Lee Stensness.

                                          He was sensational in that 3rd test, but jeez... its like watching someone in a Vauxhall Viva try to let rip at the lights.

                                          MN5 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                          • MN5
                                            MN5 @gollum last edited by

                                            @gollum said in 1993 Lions tour:

                                            Also has anyone ever made running fast look as awkward & painful as Walter Little? Yes, Lee Stensness.

                                            He was sensational in that 3rd test, but jeez... its like watching someone in a Vauxhall Viva try to let rip at the lights.

                                            Stainless Stensness was certainly no Alama the charmer Ieremia when it came to putting in the big hits.

                                            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                            • Tim
                                              Tim last edited by

                                              He was however the answer to a question on a UC Berkeley materials science class' final exam.

                                              1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                              • Catogrande
                                                Catogrande last edited by Catogrande

                                                This thread and the 2005 one have whetted my appetite and I've managed to source some highlights of the 1971 series. Watching the highlights of the third test gave me just about the best commentary moment I've seen and heard in a test match.

                                                "And there's Joseph, and he tripped over a dog believe it or not".

                                                Sure enough there was a dog on the field and at one point some young kid came on the field to get their dog back during a break for a line out. No one batted an eyelid.. Fantastic.

                                                dogmeat 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 6
                                                • D
                                                  Disgusted of TW last edited by

                                                  I had forgotten how nippy Barnes was.

                                                  Snowy 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                                  • Snowy
                                                    Snowy @Disgusted of TW last edited by

                                                    @Disgusted-of-TW said in 1993 Lions tour:

                                                    I had forgotten how nippy Barnes was.

                                                    You are referring to the dog?

                                                    1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                                    • dogmeat
                                                      dogmeat @Catogrande last edited by

                                                      @Catogrande said in 1993 Lions tour:

                                                      This thread and the 2005 one have whetted my appetite and I've managed to source some highlights of the 1971 series. Watching the highlights of the third test gave me just about the best commentary moment I've seen and heard in a test match.

                                                      "And there's Joseph, and he tripped over a dog believe it or not".

                                                      Sure enough there was a dog on the field and at one point some young kid came on the field to get their dog back during a break for a line out. No one batted an eyelid.. Fantastic.

                                                      71 series was the first Lions one I really followed - as in scrapbook listened to every game. Went to the Maori and 4th test. Dawes, John and Gibson visited my school

                                                      Great memories for a young in - even if the result sort of sucked

                                                      Since them only missed one Lions test at EP (83 when I was making myself very popular in London by successfully predicting the 4-0 sweep)

                                                      TBH we were bloody lucky in in 77 when the Lions forwards owned us but poor coaching and unimaginative backs plus a shocking inter did for the Lions - although it was all on until Knight scored at the end of the 4th test

                                                      93 could have gone either way in the test series but 83 and 95 were just disasters for the Lions - although the fans didn't seem to mind - full credit.

                                                      Will miss another one this year as only have tickets to 3rd Test

                                                      Bovidae 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                                      • Bovidae
                                                        Bovidae @dogmeat last edited by

                                                        @dogmeat said in 1993 Lions tour:

                                                        71 series was the first Lions one I really followed - as in scrapbook listened to every game. Went to the Maori and 4th test. Dawes, John and Gibson visited my school

                                                        Great memories for a young in - even if the result sort of sucked

                                                        The 1971 tour was before my time but I was interested to read Phil Gifford's opinion piece on the tour, and in particular the myth that the Lions backs were the difference in that series.

                                                        http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/opinion/90580737/Phil-Gifford-The-1971-Lions-team-was-about-as-beautiful-as-a-punch-in-the-face

                                                        Catogrande dogmeat 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                                        • MN5
                                                          MN5 last edited by

                                                          Had the Lions vs Waikato game on in the background just before. Geez Wayne Warlow was a big hard running winger. Did he ever play Super Rugby?

                                                          Bovidae 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                                          • Bovidae
                                                            Bovidae @MN5 last edited by

                                                            @MN5 said in 1993 Lions tour:

                                                            Had the Lions vs Waikato game on in the background just before. Geez Wayne Warlow was a big hard running winger. Did he ever play Super Rugby?

                                                            I don't think so. Warlow's career was winding down by the time Super rugby started although he did make a few appearances for Waikato in 1998-99 at centre. He was a big back for that era.

                                                            Warlow scored the only try for Thames Valley against the 1986 Aust team, which gives you an idea of when he started.

                                                            MN5 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                                            • R
                                                              Rugger Quizzes last edited by

                                                              Actually played against Wayne Warlow once. Was at Lions-Maoris game in 1993 at Athletic Park and remember Prince doing that, although admittedly I just chuckled at the time. Boy did that backfire though, remember the Lions being behind at halftime with Bayfield etc being shut out at lineout time but all one way traffic in the 2nd half.

                                                              1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                                              • Catogrande
                                                                Catogrande @Bovidae last edited by

                                                                @Bovidae Nice article. As Willie-John McBride said - "Get your retaliation in first"!

                                                                1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                                                • MN5
                                                                  MN5 @Bovidae last edited by

                                                                  @Bovidae said in 1993 Lions tour:

                                                                  @MN5 said in 1993 Lions tour:

                                                                  Had the Lions vs Waikato game on in the background just before. Geez Wayne Warlow was a big hard running winger. Did he ever play Super Rugby?

                                                                  I don't think so. Warlow's career was winding down by the time Super rugby started although he did make a few appearances for Waikato in 1998-99 at centre. He was a big back for that era.

                                                                  Warlow scored the only try for Thames Valley against the 1986 Aust team, which gives you an idea of when he started.

                                                                  to be fair some of the Lions backs looked pretty miniscule in comparison, a far cry from what we'll see mid year!

                                                                  gollum 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                                                  • gollum
                                                                    gollum @MN5 last edited by

                                                                    @MN5 said in 1993 Lions tour:

                                                                    to be fair some of the Lions backs looked pretty miniscule in comparison, a far cry from what we'll see mid year!

                                                                    Owen Farrell & Jonathan Joseph are pretty small for modern backs. Ditto Hogg, Halfpenny etc. There's not that many big munters in the lions frame, North, Kearney I guess, but we probably outsize them, Savea, Dagg, Naholo, SBW are all big, Rene Ranger Isia Toeava Norm Berryman Jordie Barrett if he gets a run

                                                                    Catogrande 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                                                    • Catogrande
                                                                      Catogrande @gollum last edited by

                                                                      @gollum Farrell is 1.88m and 96kg (Source: Wiki) so while not being a giant is not exactly small even for these days. But yeah some of those poached boys of yours will be bigger... 🎣

                                                                      gollum 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                                                      • MN5
                                                                        MN5 last edited by

                                                                        Dagg is big???

                                                                        Henshaw is as is wildcard Superstar Tim Visser

                                                                        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                                                        • gollum
                                                                          gollum @Catogrande last edited by

                                                                          @Catogrande

                                                                          That's not big for a modern inside centre tho'. If you figure England have had Zara's husband, Barritt, Twelvetrees & Tuilagi all there prior & they were all 100kg+, the ABs had used Nonu & SBW, Wales used anyone 100kg+ who could run straight & not pass...

                                                                          My point was in reply to the idea that this Lions team will be huge munters compared to the ABs (a reversal of the tour MN5 was discussing), I'm pretty sure we wil outweigh their backline.

                                                                          @MN5 said in 1993 Lions tour:

                                                                          Dagg is big???

                                                                          Yes, he really is. Certainly bigger than Halfpenny, Mike Brown, Hogg, Farrell etc

                                                                          MN5 Catogrande 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                                                          • MN5
                                                                            MN5 @gollum last edited by

                                                                            @gollum said in 1993 Lions tour:

                                                                            @Catogrande

                                                                            That's not big for a modern inside centre tho'. If you figure England have had Zara's husband, Barritt, Twelvetrees & Tuilagi all there prior & they were all 100kg+, the ABs had used Nonu & SBW, Wales used anyone 100kg+ who could run straight & not pass...

                                                                            My point was in reply to the idea that this Lions team will be huge munters compared to the ABs (a reversal of the tour MN5 was discussing), I'm pretty sure we wil outweigh their backline.

                                                                            @MN5 said in 1993 Lions tour:

                                                                            Dagg is big???

                                                                            Yes, he really is. Certainly bigger than Halfpenny, Mike Brown, Hogg, Farrell etc

                                                                            Fair call those fullbacks are all smallish jokers.

                                                                            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                                                            • Catogrande
                                                                              Catogrande @gollum last edited by

                                                                              @gollum said in 1993 Lions tour:

                                                                              @Catogrande

                                                                              That's not big for a modern inside centre tho'. If you figure England have had Zara's husband, Barritt, Twelvetrees & Tuilagi all there prior & they were all 100kg+, the ABs had used Nonu & SBW, Wales used anyone 100kg+ who could run straight & not pass...

                                                                              My point was in reply to the idea that this Lions team will be huge munters compared to the ABs (a reversal of the tour MN5 was discussing), I'm pretty sure we wil outweigh their backline.

                                                                              @MN5 said in 1993 Lions tour:

                                                                              Dagg is big???

                                                                              Yes, he really is. Certainly bigger than Halfpenny, Mike Brown, Hogg, Farrell etc

                                                                              Agree, not that big for a 12 these days but ask him and he'd likely say he's a 10. BTW, Wiki has Dagg at 1.85m and 96kg. If true not that big either

                                                                              1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                                                              • Chris B.
                                                                                Chris B. last edited by

                                                                                Various big options open to the ABs, but if we ran with:

                                                                                Smith, Barrett, Crotty, ALB, Savea, Dagg, Smith then Savea would be the only guy over 100kg

                                                                                Most likely variation, I think is SBW at 2nd five (or centre?), which would add some size. As would alternative midfielders like Fekitoa, Tamanivalu or Moala.

                                                                                I can't see them pairing Savea and Naholo to play two big wings.

                                                                                TJ would add size at halfback.

                                                                                Alternatively Cruden or NMS would make our unit smaller.

                                                                                1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                                                                • dogmeat
                                                                                  dogmeat @Bovidae last edited by

                                                                                  @Bovidae said in 1993 Lions tour:

                                                                                  The 1971 tour was before my time but I was interested to read Phil Gifford's opinion piece on the tour, and in particular the myth that the Lions backs were the difference in that series.

                                                                                  Jeez Giffords article was all over the place

                                                                                  Whilst technically correct his piece about the Lions ignores the tone of the tour

                                                                                  I myself used to take solace in the fact that if tries had been worth 4 points (introduced the next year) we would have won the 71 series.

                                                                                  But that straw and Giffords piece ignores the relative strengths of the two teams.

                                                                                  By 71 the AB's were coming (had come) to the end of one of their most successful eras ever.

                                                                                  An era built on forward dominance but that under the innovation of Fred Allen had redefined the game on the 67 tour so that it resembled something like the modern game in terms of interplay between forwards and backs and skills etc

                                                                                  The Needle had gone and been replaced by Vodanovich an old school coach who was suspicious of airy fairyness and favoured 9 man rugby with Going as the playmaker.

                                                                                  The lions reputation for open running was built around their demolition of our provincial sides.

                                                                                  they beat wtn by 38 points, Maori by 11 (midweek) Akl in the game before the 3rd test and were the only Lions side to go undefeated against the provinces.

                                                                                  Come the tests they were up against an aging AB side that didn't have a lot of pace and should have won the first test in Dunedin more comfortably.

                                                                                  They underestimated us in the 2nd and were well beaten so they figured to play safety first because they knew they had the measure of our forwards and didn't really rate our backs - amd who can blame them

                                                                                  For the record these are the backs who started the last 2 tests

                                                                                  Laurie Mains, Bruce Hunter, Howard Joseph, Wayne Cottrell, Ken Carrington, Bob Burgess (rep Mick Duncan), Sid Going,

                                                                                  Laurie Mains, Ken Carrington, Mick Duncan, Phil Gard, Bryan Williams, Wayne Cottrell, Sid Going

                                                                                  Decidedly average

                                                                                  Lions: Williams, Gerald Davies, Dawes (c), Gibson, Duckham, John, Edwards

                                                                                  Nearly 50 years later I reckon every Kiwi that follows rugby to any extent recognizes all those Lions names. I went to the 4th test and theres 2 AB names I don't know

                                                                                  I had to look up Gard, Duncan and Joseph. They played 5 tests between them. All debuted against the Lions. None ever capped again

                                                                                  Catogrande Bovidae 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 7
                                                                                  • Catogrande
                                                                                    Catogrande @dogmeat last edited by

                                                                                    @dogmeat But it's not an article, it's an opinion piece, so that means it doesn't have to be correct. 🤥

                                                                                    1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
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