NZ Rugby Journalists
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I'm curious who the fern considers the best (least worst??) rugby journalist in NZ
There's plenty of comments around about how shit some of these writers are but do any of them deserve some praise? Anybody that provides decent analysis?
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My favourite 3 are
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Liam Napier (he's now moved to the Herald which means I can pretty much avoid Stuff from now on which is great)
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Nigel Yalden (he's more radio than journalist but i'll include him)
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Patrick McKendry
All 3 I find tend to provide fairly balanced insight, good anaylsis without too much cheerleading whilst also having pretty good inside oil.
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Yeah those three aren't too bad but I avoid the Herald now with their new website - it's terrible.
I enjoy Paul Cully's articles because he is neutral. I also don't mind Marc Hinton either.
The current generation of rugby journalists pale in comparison to those from previous years.
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@Bovidae said in NZ Rugby Journalists:
I enjoy Paul Cully's articles because he is neutral
He contributes to the click bait bullshit. Here's his wifes article with his son being used as a prop. Yuck.
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Toby Robson is no longer a journo. Works for the Hurricanes now.
Which is a shame.
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@Bovidae Isn't Cully a Chiefs supporter?
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@Tim I thought he is an Aussie who lives in NZ.
Napier is a Canes supporter, and often it shows
@Duluth I'm not reading his wife's articles.
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@Bovidae said in NZ Rugby Journalists:
@Duluth I'm not reading his wife's articles.
Another sexist Chiefs supporter..
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steve hepburn from the odt. makes the rugby journalists from the press seem sane
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Seti Afoa posts usually posts press conferences unadulterated on youtube for most tests and squad announcements - this earns him #1 rank. Even the AB's own youtube can't manage this for some reason, very good insights buried in answers to seemingly banal questions.
Yalden is really good, unfortunately his insight and analysis is spread among his FB, radio sport hits and his live commentary (which face it, we rarely listen to).
Napier is the best of the press.
Gifford - when he does delve back into rugby - is usually the only other one that seems worth reading.
TJ writes a weekly article/blog for Supersport in South Africa which is outstanding providing it isn't Crusader related.
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Not sure if he still does them, but Marshall did some great analytical pieces (in the Herald I think they were)
Sumo can write some great pieces too, although the better ones are probably more emotive rugby centric than analytical.
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@rotated said in NZ Rugby Journalists:
Seti Afoa posts usually posts press conferences unadulterated on youtube for most tests and squad announcements - this earns him #1 rank. Even the AB's own youtube can't manage this for some reason, very good insights buried in answers to seemingly banal questions.
I subscribe to him too. He also seems to get some pretty good interviews for his channel.
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@taniwharugby said in NZ Rugby Journalists:
Not sure if he still does them, but Marshall did some great analytical pieces (in the Herald I think they were)
Sumo can write some great pieces too, although the better ones are probably more emotive rugby centric than analytical.
Along those lines John Drake RIP was probably the best NZ Herald ex-player columnist.
Fox was OK too but a little dry/generic.
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@Milk said in NZ Rugby Journalists:
@rotated said in NZ Rugby Journalists:
Seti Afoa posts usually posts press conferences unadulterated on youtube for most tests and squad announcements - this earns him #1 rank. Even the AB's own youtube can't manage this for some reason, very good insights buried in answers to seemingly banal questions.
I subscribe to him too.
+1 Once I found someone who put up the entire press conference I was very pleased. Makes a nice difference from the selective editing media and PR people engage in.
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@rotated said in NZ Rugby Journalists:
Yalden is really good, unfortunately his insight and analysis is spread among his FB, radio sport hits and his live commentary (which face it, we rarely listen to).
Napier is the best of the press.
Gifford - when he does delve back into rugby - is usually the only other one that seems worth reading.
A couple of blokes you probably haven't heard of, but who are seriously quality are Rattue & Reason.
Being serious, Yalden, Robson, Napier are my favourites. Cully is also good, but he's not a Kiwi.
I usually like Gifford, but he has been awful this series: a series of whinging articles, unsurprisingly picked up on by the international press (no Phil, the late charge on Barrett after the kick was not red-card worthy...).
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@rotated said in NZ Rugby Journalists:
Seti Afoa posts usually posts press conferences unadulterated on youtube for most tests and squad announcements - this earns him #1 rank. Even the AB's own youtube can't manage this for some reason, very good insights buried in answers to seemingly banal questions.
Yeah I strongly suggest watching the unadulterated press conferences as it'll save you hours of frustration reading those fluffed up reports in popular media. The tone of voice, the questions, the atmosphere are so much more informative and you don't have to read some hack's lurid interpretation of what these guys say
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@Rapido said in NZ Rugby Journalists:
Toby Robson is no longer a journo. Works for the Hurricanes now.
Which is a shame.
It is a damn shame , it wasn't that long ago he hung up his boots either . His story about playing against Umaga when he was playing for the first time for Petone was bloody good.
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I was always a massive fan of Toby Robson.
Must say though I've read a bit of what Gordon D'Arcy has written and I wish we had an ex player here who could write as well and as incisively as he can. Really breaks play down and pulls it apart.
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There are two main problems with rugby writing in places like the Herald and Stuff.
One is that the writers are expected as part of their day jobs to fill out the days content. Readers want to read things and they want to provide that but what happens is they seem to be expected to either fill the role (sometimes gleefully) of clickbaiter or just write basically nothing with the odd little new fact thrown in.
Secondly they are rarely given scope to write at the length and depth that decent insight/analysis requires. The only times they are given that scope it is to write something 'investigative' like the head injury series of articles.
What is starting to develop though (with a few false starts) are avenues for the same writers/journalists to have a crack at freelance content of a little more depth or of a different angle.
I checkplaces like https://www.newsroom.co.nz/@sportsroom every few days and am usually surpirised to read quite good stuff from writers whose work I don't usually rate.
Here is a good example by Steve Deane https://www.newsroom.co.nz/@rugby/2017/07/02/37013/benchmarking-sbws-act-of-thuggery
and surprisingly another from Jim Kayes (even though he can be a dick) https://www.newsroom.co.nz/@rugby/2017/07/04/37325/captain-reads-biggest-test-is-upon-him
I do think a lot of our rugby hacks are only hacking because that's their job requirement. Many have the capability to be much better given the right avenue. -
Our very own... @His-Bobness @Smudge @Mullet Barnya
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@Crucial said in NZ Rugby Journalists:
There are two main problems with rugby writing in places like the Herald and Stuff.
One is that the writers are expected as part of their day jobs to fill out the days content. Readers want to read things and they want to provide that but what happens is they seem to be expected to either fill the role (sometimes gleefully) of clickbaiter or just write basically nothing with the odd little new fact thrown in.
Secondly they are rarely given scope to write at the length and depth that decent insight/analysis requires. The only times they are given that scope it is to write something 'investigative' like the head injury series of articles.
What is starting to develop though (with a few false starts) are avenues for the same writers/journalists to have a crack at freelance content of a little more depth or of a different angle.
I checkplaces like https://www.newsroom.co.nz/@sportsroom every few days and am usually surpirised to read quite good stuff from writers whose work I don't usually rate.
Here is a good example by Steve Deane https://www.newsroom.co.nz/@rugby/2017/07/02/37013/benchmarking-sbws-act-of-thuggery
and surprisingly another from Jim Kayes (even though he can be a dick) https://www.newsroom.co.nz/@rugby/2017/07/04/37325/captain-reads-biggest-test-is-upon-him
I do think a lot of our rugby hacks are only hacking because that's their job requirement. Many have the capability to be much better given the right avenue.The biggest problem with NZ journalists is they don't watch much NH rugby but consider themselves qualified to compare NZ players to their counterparts. It's ends up as cheerleading with no actual evidence base or analysis. Can't stand Wynne Gray he is among the worst.
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@ACT-Crusader said in NZ Rugby Journalists:
Our very own... @His-Bobness @Smudge @Mullet Barnya
I haven't written regular stories on rugby for a decade. But thanks for thinking of me. And also, I wasn't very good (not looking for pity - I was just a soft-hearted journo with limited analysis when it came to rugby).
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@Billy-Tell said in NZ Rugby Journalists:
@rotated said in NZ Rugby Journalists:
Yalden is really good, unfortunately his insight and analysis is spread among his FB, radio sport hits and his live commentary (which face it, we rarely listen to).
Napier is the best of the press.
Gifford - when he does delve back into rugby - is usually the only other one that seems worth reading.
A couple of blokes you probably haven't heard of, but who are seriously quality are Rattue & Reason.
Being serious, Yalden, Robson, Napier are my favourites. Cully is also good, but he's not a Kiwi.
I usually like Gifford, but he has been awful this series: a series of whinging articles, unsurprisingly picked up on by the international press (no Phil, the late charge on Barrett after the kick was not red-card worthy...).
Rattue and Reason. Bona fide geniuses the pair of them. Really surprised @taniwharugby didn't bring them up earlier. Brilliant fair analysis and not the least bit controversial or click baity which is rare in this day and age.
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@MN5 The more subtle, the better sarcasm is.
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@antipodean the problem with @MN5 's dad (Twattue) and his Uncle (Treason) is not so much they seem so bitter and twisted just cos, its they they often dont appear that they even watch the sports they are commenting on, or even like the sport.
SO often Twattue spouts his BS, and the opposite appears true...which is kinda whats happened to the Lions, cos I am pretty sure he wrote them off after test #1 (and half the games prior)
I expect both were the last kid picked in all the teams and both were in love with girls who wouldnt even look at them and went out with one of the 1st 15.
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@antipodean said in NZ Rugby Journalists:
@MN5 The more subtle, the better sarcasm is.
I was being serious
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@Billy-Tell said in NZ Rugby Journalists:
Can't stand Wynne Gray he is among the worst.
I could be mistaken but I think there was a time Gray used to care. Now it's countdown to pension-time and he's farting in a bag and mailing it in. There's no excuse for how weak and pathetic his slop has become. Rattue is a calculated wind-up clown, but at least he tries. Gregor Paul gets a pass simply because he's not as lousy as the other pair.
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@Salacious-Crumb said in NZ Rugby Journalists:
@Billy-Tell said in NZ Rugby Journalists:
Can't stand Wynne Gray he is among the worst.
I could be mistaken but I think there was a time Gray used to care. Now it's countdown to pension-time and he's farting in a bag and mailing it in.
That's because he is actually (e-)mailing it in. He finished up full-time with the Herald last year. So the weekly/twice-weekly column is probably done between gardening stints and multiple cup of tea.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=11675484
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@rotated said in NZ Rugby Journalists:
Seti Afoa posts usually posts press conferences unadulterated on youtube for most tests and squad announcements - this earns him #1 rank. Even the AB's own youtube can't manage this for some reason, very good insights buried in answers to seemingly banal questions.
It's great but he needs to put a mic on the table. The sound is barely audible.
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@Frye Yes. In one of the press conferences you see him at the front and it looks like he uses a camera/phone on a tripod. The audio is very hit and miss.
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Here's an article from Stuff about the NZ teams dominance over the Aussies. So far so good. However there are a number of references to the "4 try bonus point" that the Aussie teams have managed to achieve. The 'journalists' don't appear to know that these 4 try bonus points don't exist anymore.
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Sir Terry McLean National Sports Journalism Awards
Sports News Reporting (Print and online)
Liam Napier (NZME/NZ Herald)Sports Broadcasting (Radio)
Peter Montgomery (NZME/Newstalk ZB/Radio Sport)Sports Reporting (Television)
Michelle Pickles (TV3 Newshub)Multi-media Sports Reporting
Martin Tasker and Peter Lester (Freelance)Sports Feature (Television)
Matt Beale (Sky Sport)Sports Feature Writing
Mark Reason (Fairfax)Sports Column/Opinion (All media)
Dylan Cleaver (NZME/NZ Herald)Best Community sport/Recreational/Adventure reporting
Dylan Cleaver (NZME/NZ Herald)New Zealand Herald DJ Cameron Young Journalist Award
Ruth Dacey (Rotorua Daily Post)Best Provincial/Community Journalist
Logan Savory (Southland Times)Sports Photography (Portfolio)
John Cowpland (Alphapix)Community Sports/Recreational/Adventure Photography (Portfolio)
Chris Symes (Media Images)NZSJA Award for Best Single Story
Abby Wilson (TVNZ)NZSJA Award for Best Single Photograph
Robyn Edie (Southland Times)Sir John Wells Sport New Zealand Journalism Scholarships
Alex Chapman (NZME/Radio Sport) and Kirstie Stanway (Newshub)Sport NZ Lifetime Achievement Award
Bryan Waddle (NZME/Radio Sport/Newstalk ZB)Sports Journalist of the Year
Liam Napier (NZME/NZ Herald)Garry Frew Memorial Trophy
Lindsay Kerrnzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=11950729
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@stargazer loses all credibility with Mark Treason in there, or is this the one where they nominate themselves?
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@taniwharugby Yeah, I was thinking the same thing, although I can agree with Liam Napier taking out the main prize.
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Clearly a shallow pond.
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@stargazer said in NZ Rugby Journalists:
@taniwharugby Yeah, I was thinking the same thing, although I can agree with Liam Napier taking out the main prize.
Yeah, he's been pumping out content this year.
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@taniwharugby said in NZ Rugby Journalists:
@stargazer loses all credibility with Mark Treason in there, or is this the one where they nominate themselves?
You also have to pay to enter, which puts off a lot of cheapskate journos (like myself) back in the day.
Bittersweet win for Logan Savory who loses his job next week thanks to Fairfax cuts.
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@smudge you could start a givealittle page for the entry fee, we'll all chip in..but only if you go for whatever award Treason nominated himself for and tell us how we can make you win it!
Yeah the old restructuring sucks!
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That's a lot of awards, looks like just about every Sports Journalist in NZ got one.
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@taniwharugby said in NZ Rugby Journalists:
@smudge you could start a givealittle page for the entry fee, we'll all chip in..but only if you go for whatever award Treason nominated himself for and tell us how we can make you win it!
Yeah the old restructuring sucks!
My contribution to journalism these days is a fortnightly column in an obscure publication. Probably read by up to and including 25 people.
Let's do it!
