Israel & Palestine
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So there is going to be another mighty protest in Melbourne tonight. Lefties allying up with local followers of Islam to protest Trump's recognition of Jerusalem as the capital of Israel.
Unlike previous 'Free Palestine' events. This year spurned on by Trump's election, and the strong showing at Milo's event there is actually going to be a pro-Israel, pro-Trump counter-protest led by Avi Yemini a local Gym owner turned new Conservative politician who has has found a bit of a niche here making fun of lefty crazies.
Naturally on announcement of this counter-protest the leftist crazies (Carf/Antifa) have announced a counter-counter protest to fight the far right zionist Nazis. (...yep you read that right).
As it stands my knowledge of this conflict is incredibly poor and most of what I watch or read on the subject is normally pretty heavily biased so its very hard to get an accurate picture.
From what I can gather. Jewish people historically lived in Israel, at some point they were turfed out, at some other point it became an Islamist area, before they too were turfed out. Then Britain took control and encouraged Jewish immigration in the early 20th century right up until and after WW2 as anti-semitic sentiment took hold in Europe. In the 60's all surrounding countries went to war against Israel and lost. Hamas who were an offshoot of the Muslim Brotherhood are in charge of the Palestinian movement and up until May this year had a charter which called for the elimination of Jews and Israel. This has now however been secularised and they have disbanded the Brotherhood I guess in order to make a peaceful solution possible. I also understand there have been numerous 2-state solutions offered to date however all have been refused by the Palestinian side (I'm guessing possibly linked to their previous no negotiation destroy Israel policy).
Anyone got another take on it? I think regardless of history using Trump's decision to excuse violent protest is beyond stupid, more so considering Clinton, Bush and Obama also recognised Jerusalum as the capital..but unlike Trump were filled with empty promises.
This video from Paul Joseph Watson certainly sums up one point of view. I'd be keen to see the other.
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All you need to know about the plight of the Palestinian people is that:
- throwing rocks at Israel as a result of perceived slights is counterproductive,
- putting up with terrorist organisations sending rockets into Israel from civilian areas is fundamentally stupid,
- their own leadership are hopelessly corrupt,
- they are used as footballs by other Arabs to kick the Jews, and
- as long as Israel is surrounded by regimes that continue to call for the annihilation of the Jewish State, Israel will continue to occupy territories to taken during the Six Day war to defend itself.
Recognising the obvious fact that Jerusalem is the capital of Israel has been bipartisan policy since Clinton.
Oh, and lefties are invariably antisemitic.
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@antipodean you can add things like this to your list
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Every Israeli I have ever met has been a arrogant twunt. Wether in Israel or travelling elsewhere.
The world would be a better place if Israel as a modern nation had never been created by parachuting a bunch of European jews in to the middle east out of a feeling of collective guilt from western govts because of the holocaust.BUT...
They have every single right to name their own damn capital. FFS the Palestinians wouldn't waste a day if they controlled Jerusalem to name it as their capital, and with zero doubt the west would figuratively blow their collective load over such a move. The Jews were there before the Palestinians, they have a serious history with the place. They won a damn war (more than one but lets not quibble) to control the place.
All this hysteria from the liberal elite is quite pathetic, the peace process was in tatters looong before this move ans was going nowehre. Due to numerous factors amongst
1/ Israelis are twunts
2/ Israel are building a wall which takes makes victims of innocent Palestinian farmers... a twunt move that could have been done better.
3/ Palestinians don't recognize Israels right to exist... a twunt move
4/ Palestine group are full of terrrorist groups.. who behave like terrorists groups.. a bunch of twunts.This move has done nothing to harm or promote a peace accord, it has not moved the dial even a smidgen.
In summary, that area is full of twunts. Worst place I EVER travelled to.
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@baron-silas-greenback there is plenty of bad behaviour to go around on both sides. Back in the day the mufti of Jerusalem made sport of trying to get rid of the Jews. Whoever had the power did bad shit. I'm reading a book about the history of the city back to antiquity. For a holy city a lot of bad stuff has gone down there
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@baron-silas-greenback said in Israel & Palestine:
Every Israeli I have ever met has been a arrogant twunt. Wether in Israel or travelling elsewhere.
The world would be a better place if Israel as a modern nation had never been created by parachuting a bunch of European jews in to the middle east out of a feeling of collective guilt from western govts because of the holocaust.BUT...
They have every single right to name their own damn capital. FFS the Palestinians wouldn't waste a day if they controlled Jerusalem to name it as their capital, and with zero doubt the west would figuratively blow their collective load over such a move. The Jews were there before the Palestinians, they have a serious history with the place. They won a damn war (more than one but lets not quibble) to control the place.
All this hysteria from the liberal elite is quite pathetic, the peace process was in tatters looong before this move ans was going nowehre. Due to numerous factors amongst
1/ Israelis are twunts
2/ Israel are building a wall which takes makes victims of innocent Palestinian farmers... a twunt move that could have been done better.
3/ Palestinians don't recognize Israels right to exist... a twunt move
4/ Palestine group are full of terrrorist groups.. who behave like terrorists groups.. a bunch of twunts.This move has done nothing to harm or promote a peace accord, it has not moved the dial even a smidgen.
In summary, that area is full of twunts. Worst place I EVER travelled to.
100% agree with this post, wish I could articulate myself like you mate.
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@Baron-Silas-Greenback has summed it up nicely.
The historic ins and outs of the place are that messy that "possession is nine tenths of the law" springs to mind for me... or to quote that renowned historian Basil, "who won the bloody war anyway?"
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@baron-silas-greenback said in Israel & Palestine:
Every Israeli I have ever met has been a arrogant twunt. Wether in Israel or travelling elsewhere.
The world would be a better place if Israel as a modern nation had never been created by parachuting a bunch of European jews in to the middle east out of a feeling of collective guilt from western govts because of the holocaust.BUT...
They have every single right to name their own damn capital. FFS the Palestinians wouldn't waste a day if they controlled Jerusalem to name it as their capital, and with zero doubt the west would figuratively blow their collective load over such a move. The Jews were there before the Palestinians, they have a serious history with the place. They won a damn war (more than one but lets not quibble) to control the place.
All this hysteria from the liberal elite is quite pathetic, the peace process was in tatters looong before this move ans was going nowehre. Due to numerous factors amongst
1/ Israelis are twunts
2/ Israel are building a wall which takes makes victims of innocent Palestinian farmers... a twunt move that could have been done better.
3/ Palestinians don't recognize Israels right to exist... a twunt move
4/ Palestine group are full of terrrorist groups.. who behave like terrorists groups.. a bunch of twunts.This move has done nothing to harm or promote a peace accord, it has not moved the dial even a smidgen.
In summary, that area is full of twunts. Worst place I EVER travelled to.
Yup, great summary from both sides. This isn't that difficult to understand for anyone that actually wants to know though.
Those protesters @Rembrandt talks about are all fucking idiots, on both sides. These people are incredibly frustrating, the way they all get out on the streets and protest on issues they clearly don't know the first fucking thing about, and for what? To say they "won"? We don't need people trying to win, we need people trying to achieve peace.
Just a bunch of useful idiots. Seriously, right now is the best time to be alive, period. We live in an age of information, anything you want to learn is at your fingertips. If these fucking idiots did what @canefan is doing and just read a fucking book we wouldn't have this ever increasingly polarizing environment.
But no, let's all go out on the street and fight each other over shit we don't understand!
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@no-quarter Sad thing is I am sure there are plenty of people on both sides who would like to live in peace side by side, but the twunts won't have it
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just got down there. 36degrees. Maybe 30 police around the perimeter. A few media. Smatterings of antifa (currently sans masks). Group of about 15 Muslim looking blokes with yellow flags in Arabic. Group of marxists promoting their upcoming conference. 10 Carf organisers in fluro gear. A number of tourists taking photos. And 2 young Korean girls busking and probably confused as all hell about the burgeoning crowd.
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@canefan said in Israel & Palestine:
@no-quarter Sad thing is I am sure there are plenty of people on both sides who would like to live in peace side by side, but the twunts won't have it
Yup, most people are pretty moderate, it's only a minority that are genuine extremists.
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@no-quarter said in Israel & Palestine:
@canefan said in Israel & Palestine:
@no-quarter Sad thing is I am sure there are plenty of people on both sides who would like to live in peace side by side, but the twunts won't have it
Yup, most people are pretty moderate, it's only a minority that are genuine extremists.
Well yeah, because if the majority were extremists then they would not be on the extreme.
Sorry should have said "Pedant alert" at the beginning of the post.
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@Catogrande touché...
The not-so-well made point was that society works best when you have a balance of ideas from the left and the right, as you get better outcomes from discussions between people with differing viewpoints. The extremists on both sides are poisoning those discussions, particularly the far left who appear to be inexplicably making a comeback, and that is hurting the west right now.
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Excellent points made by @Baron-Silas-Greenback, couldn't agree more. Having said that, I think Trump might have been able to have actually moved things along by announcing the move and acknowledging that the future capital of Palestine will be in East Jerusalem. Nevertheless, I don't think there is much to see here.
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@no-quarter Ha! The point was quite well made by both you and @canefan
I was merely being pedantic and a little facile.
The Middle East is so fucked over in so many places that I fear it will never be resolved. I honestly think that if it was possible to move Israel out that there would still be huge problems in the ME. Israel is simply the biggest piece of grit in the oyster. Note: This is not me blaming Israel or suggesting the State of Israel should not exist or should be moved.
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For anyone who is interested this is the book I am reading (trying to; it can be a little hard going)
Jerusalem: The Biography by Simon Sebag Montefiore – review
Antony Beevor on a remarkably objective account of the holy city's turbulent history
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Leftard is as leftard does
“2017 has become the year that women have spoken out against injustice and abuse by those in power. Lorde has become to her generation what Rosa Parkes, Jane Fonda, Kate Shepherd, and many others were to theirs.”
Ffs , actually the Jane Fonda one is probably accurate, a self absorbed misguided fool.
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@jegga said in Israel & Palestine:
Leftard is as leftard does
“2017 has become the year that women have spoken out against injustice and abuse by those in power. Lorde has become to her generation what Rosa Parkes, Jane Fonda, Kate Shepherd, and many others were to theirs.”
Ffs , actually the Jane Fonda one is probably accurate, a self absorbed misguided fool.
I feel sorry for Lorde.
Depending on where you sit on the multi-dimensional spectrum she got fucked over.
Basically bullied into chucking in the concert. All of a sudden she is making a statement in support of Palestine.
She just wanted to sing somewhere and make some cash.
But because Palestine is a cause célèbre for the left ...
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I've worked with a fair few Israelis in software development - a lot of whom were born Jewish but don't necessarily go hardline on it. Most of them were pretty chilled out, and generally funny people.
When the topic comes up, most of them shrug and move on. They're just happy to be able to drive around without the hassle they get in some places back home with security forces etc.
There were a few exceptions. One woman I work with married into a Jewish family and had to jump through all the hoops to get there. She is always bitching about her husband's laziness and putting up with her family's shit.
Fuck she got seriously fired up when I stated Israel was not helping by seizing territory and kicking people out of their houses. I'd previously stated that by the same token, people firing rockets into civilian areas was fucked. Israel fully deserve to have a state if they can beat off superior forces like they did last century, but don't be shunts about it.
She started to get a bit spiky, then suddenly had to run off to a meeting.
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@booboo said in Israel & Palestine:
@jegga said in Israel & Palestine:
Leftard is as leftard does
“2017 has become the year that women have spoken out against injustice and abuse by those in power. Lorde has become to her generation what Rosa Parkes, Jane Fonda, Kate Shepherd, and many others were to theirs.”
Ffs , actually the Jane Fonda one is probably accurate, a self absorbed misguided fool.
I feel sorry for Lorde.
Depending on where you sit on the multi-dimensional spectrum she got fucked over.
Basically bullied into chucking in the concert. All of a sudden she is making a statement in support of Palestine.
She just wanted to sing somewhere and make some cash.
But because Palestine is a cause célèbre for the left ...
I don't feel the least bit sorry for her, she was happy to play in Russia and Trumps America .
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It's funny isn't it. OK to perform in China and Russia. OK to fly with or endorse airlines from countries where homesexuality is illegal. OK to perform in countries with rampant corruption. Yet apparently performing in the only genuine democracy in the Middle East is completely beyond the pale.
The knee-jerk accusation of anti-semitism at criticism of Israel is utter bullshit, but fark me you have to wonder sometimes.
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@rancid-schnitzel said in Israel & Palestine:
It's funny isn't it. OK to perform in China and Russia. OK to fly with or endorse airlines from countries where homesexuality is illegal. OK to perform in countries with rampant corruption. Yet apparently performing in the only genuine democracy in the Middle East is completely beyond the pale.
The knee-jerk accusation of anti-semitism at criticism of Israel is utter bullshit, but fark me you have to wonder sometimes.
That is an unfortunate distraction from the actual topic, Ive seen words to the effect that "lorde refused to play to a stadium full of jews" somewhere which while true isn't really the point here. Despite the pathetic fawning like the crap I posted its a world away from the anti apartheid protests of the past.
Up until a week ago she was quite happy to play there and being as insipidly right on as she likes to present herself as being theres absolutely no way she didn't know about the situation in Israel. The BDS movement saw a weak target and went for her and she and her pr people weighed up the bad publicity of playing there versus the good publicity of not playing there, calculated the sums and decided not to play.
Hero to a generation? Bitch please. -
Jason Flom, the guy that signed Lorde and also Katy Perry is a bit of an SJW so I doubt she's been getting great advice recently. There was also that tweet where she tried to apologise on behalf of white people and said "we" must do better, which didn't exactly endear her to many people in the US or around the world. She'd do well to just stay the fuck out of politics as much as possible like her "besty" Taylor Swift does.
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@no-quarter said in Israel & Palestine:
Jason Flom, the guy that signed Lorde and also Katy Perry is a bit of an SJW so I doubt she's been getting great advice recently. There was also that tweet where she tried to apologise on behalf of white people and said "we" must do better, which didn't exactly endear her to many people in the US or around the world. She'd do well to just stay the fuck out of politics as much as possible like her "besty" Taylor Swift does.
He's probably the reason Katy Perrys career has been going down the toilet since she decided to go the full retard politically.
Shame because
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@jegga said in Israel & Palestine:
@no-quarter said in Israel & Palestine:
Jason Flom, the guy that signed Lorde and also Katy Perry is a bit of an SJW so I doubt she's been getting great advice recently. There was also that tweet where she tried to apologise on behalf of white people and said "we" must do better, which didn't exactly endear her to many people in the US or around the world. She'd do well to just stay the fuck out of politics as much as possible like her "besty" Taylor Swift does.
He's probably the reason Katy Perrys career has been going down the toilet since she decided to go the full retard politically.
Shame because
If only she looked like that still!
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@bones said in Israel & Palestine:
@virgil Because when you're fapping you only like to view photos taken in the previous week? I'm gonna assume you don't cross paths in real life...
Nah mate I just look at her now and how’s she’s gone full angry lesbo look and sigh..
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@bones said in Israel & Palestine:
@virgil Because when you're fapping you only like to view photos taken in the previous week? I'm gonna assume you don't cross paths in real life...
damn straight i only want photos from last week! which has made whacking it to August Ames a little bit different recently...
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@mariner4life said in Israel & Palestine:
@bones said in Israel & Palestine:
@virgil Because when you're fapping you only like to view photos taken in the previous week? I'm gonna assume you don't cross paths in real life...
damn straight i only want photos from last week! which has made whacking it to August Ames a little bit different recently...
Indeed, you can only beat the meat to the same thing so many times. Need fresh material. Katy is no longer delivering, I feel @Virgil's pain.
As an aside, the outrage at Ames not wanting to fuck guys that do gay porn highlighted everything that is wrong with all the morally superior retards on social media today.
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@nepia said in Israel & Palestine:
@virgil said in Israel & Palestine:
Those trivago ads on tv every 10 mins is making the tv viewing more bearable these hols
Who is that presenter?
Is it important? I’m guessing Trivagos parent company also owns Roskins skin repair.
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@no-quarter said in Israel & Palestine:
@mariner4life said in Israel & Palestine:
@bones said in Israel & Palestine:
@virgil Because when you're fapping you only like to view photos taken in the previous week? I'm gonna assume you don't cross paths in real life...
damn straight i only want photos from last week! which has made whacking it to August Ames a little bit different recently...
Indeed, you can only beat the meat to the same thing so many times. Need fresh material. Katy is no longer delivering, I feel @Virgil's pain.
As an aside, the outrage at Ames not wanting to fuck guys that do gay porn highlighted everything that is wrong with all the morally superior retards on social media today.
I was unaware of August Ames work , I’ve heard mention in passing of Annisa Kate though.
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@jegga said in Israel & Palestine:
@nepia said in Israel & Palestine:
@virgil said in Israel & Palestine:
Those trivago ads on tv every 10 mins is making the tv viewing more bearable these hols
Who is that presenter?
Is it important? I’m guessing Trivagos parent company also owns Roskins skin repair.
I'm confused, have no idea what that means.
Do they have a different Trivago ad in NZ than in OZ?
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@nepia said in Israel & Palestine:
@jegga said in Israel & Palestine:
@nepia said in Israel & Palestine:
@virgil said in Israel & Palestine:
Those trivago ads on tv every 10 mins is making the tv viewing more bearable these hols
Who is that presenter?
Is it important? I’m guessing Trivagos parent company also owns Roskins skin repair.
I'm confused, have no idea what that means.
Do they have a different Trivago ad in NZ than in OZ?
You don’t have the hot chick hosting them?
Lorde takes a stand
