Black Lives Matter
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@barbarian said in US Politics:
@pakman said in US Politics:
I'm not sure the mood here is that racism in US is overblown. And I'd much rather be a black man in US than Uighur in China.
Of all the ridiculous statements on this thread, this one ranks right up there. It's like having both legs amputated and the doc telling you 'Cheer up cobber, I'd much rather have no legs than be a quadreplegic'.
This is a terribly overblown comparison.
Absolute bullshit. -
@Frank said in US Politics:
Most liked comment under this:
Looting is a valid form of protest. It is the act of striking out against a system that capitalizes and places value of material goods over human lives.
Looting is humanity screaming to be heard.Things can be replaced.
Lives cannot.
#BlackLivesMatter
My girlfriend had a dinner with some uni mates on the weekend. One of whom as it turns out is a raging Leftist (For clarity I mean a left wing ideologue). She works in a public hospital in Melbourne (runs some scanning machines, not sure what) and gave a speech to her friends about how she would have been on the streets for the amazing BLM protests however because her job is 'saving lives' during this covid-19 outbreak she couldn't attend.
My darling non-political girlfriend sadly has chosen to live with me so has to deal with seeing a large number of 'on the ground' videos of the riots that channel 9 choose to not show because it doesn't fit their narrative. So she challenged this lass on the rioting aspect in the states. The lass completely straightfaced genuinely said that all the rioting and looting was committed by 'white supremacists'.
Brainwashed to the point of retard. Thanks The Guardian/CNN et al
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@Winger said in US Politics:
and maybe address the points raised in the (excellent) Berkeley letter noted below
It's an excellent letter. While there is one place I think the author over-eggs it a bit, that's besides the point. The point is all views should be allowed to be aired, especially so on college campuses. It is very concerning that a letter like that has to be written.
Regardless of your views on the BLM movement, it's imperative that all opinions can be safely aired and that's just not the case. The cancel culture is misguided and does so much more harm than good, we can all agree on that.
The only area I have an issue is I think the author goes a bit too far on the 'Floyd was a bad man' stuff. IMO people aren't celebrating Floyd himself, he's just become symbolic of something far larger. His background is pretty much irrelevant. Bringing it up in the manner the author does implies he somehow deserved his fate.
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@barbarian said in US Politics:
@Winger said in US Politics:
and maybe address the points raised in the (excellent) Berkeley letter noted below
It's an excellent letter. While there is one place I think the author over-eggs it a bit, that's besides the point. The point is all views should be allowed to be aired, especially so on college campuses. It is very concerning that a letter like that has to be written.
Regardless of your views on the BLM movement, it's imperative that all opinions can be safely aired and that's just not the case. The cancel culture is misguided and does so much more harm than good, we can all agree on that.
The only area I have an issue is I think the author goes a bit too far on the 'Floyd was a bad man' stuff. IMO people aren't celebrating Floyd himself, he's just become symbolic of something far larger. His background is pretty much irrelevant. Bringing it up in the manner the author does implies he somehow deserved his fate.
But the question is what is this something "far larger". Is it real? Or media hype to divide (and harm) people by separating them by color (as opposed to sex or age etc that the media also does)
I'll give you one example. Lets say a young black woman was walking with her dog in a NY Park. She let the dog off the leash (no big deal really) and a powerful older white man (who was videoing her???) threatened the black lady (if you do what you want I will do likewise and you won't like it).
Who do you think would be fired if a video of this was released?
My view is people (not just Blacks) have been sold out in the US. The elite don't want the focus on them so manufacture fights between various groups. Sadly people fall for it.
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@barbarian said in US Politics:
The only area I have an issue is I think the author goes a bit too far on the 'Floyd was a bad man' stuff. IMO people aren't celebrating Floyd himself, he's just become symbolic of something far larger. His background is pretty much irrelevant. Bringing it up in the manner the author does implies he somehow deserved his fate.
That is a valid concern.
I think where people are getting riled up is that it seems hypocritical to use his murder as a reason to tear down statues of people long gone because of flaws in their distant past..yet we are supposed to ignore the very recent past of George or the current present of folk destroying public property on camera without apparent consequence.
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@barbarian said in US Politics:
The only area I have an issue is I think the author goes a bit too far on the 'Floyd was a bad man' stuff. IMO people aren't celebrating Floyd himself, he's just become symbolic of something far larger. His background is pretty much irrelevant. Bringing it up in the manner the author does implies he somehow deserved his fate.
Have had this discussion a couple of times, and I agree with the premise that he didn't deserve it, we have courts and laws for that, but they are mutually exclusive comments.
Did he deserve to die like that?
Was he (possibly) a violent misogynist druggie?They shouldn't be tied together.
Derek Chauvin was no angel either and had "history" and I doubt that he will survive prison but this is interesting:
Chauvin still stands to benefit from a pension partially funded by taxpayers. While a number of state laws allow for the forfeiture of pensions for those employees convicted of felony crimes related to their work, this is not the case in Minnesota.Chauvin would likely be eligible for annual payments in the ballpark of US$50,000 (A$73,000) a year or more if he chose to start receiving them at age 55
That just feels wrong.
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@Rembrandt said in US Politics:
@barbarian said in US Politics:
The only area I have an issue is I think the author goes a bit too far on the 'Floyd was a bad man' stuff. IMO people aren't celebrating Floyd himself, he's just become symbolic of something far larger. His background is pretty much irrelevant. Bringing it up in the manner the author does implies he somehow deserved his fate.
That is a valid concern.
I think where people are getting riled up is that it seems hypocritical to use his murder as a reason to tear down statues of people long gone because of flaws in their distant past..yet we are supposed to ignore the very recent past of George or the current present of folk destroying public property on camera without apparent consequence.
I think we can all agree that the original concerns out of the Floyd killing, and others, are valid. And that lots of groups on all sides, be it anarchists leftists white supremacists and just plain crooks, are all using the protest as an excuse to advance their own agendas
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And now a 27 year old black man ends up shot dead after a scuffle with police. He was running away and appears to have been shot in the back. He was found asleep in his car in a Wendy's carpark and after over 20 minutes of discussion he went berserk when the cops wanted to cuff him. After everything that is going on I can't believe these police are still making these decisions. He had no firearm, he was running away after resisting arrest after what I would consider to be a low level infringement, so risk to the police officers was low. And he is dead. That is crazy
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@canefan said in US Politics:
And now a 27 year old black man ends up shot dead after a scuffle with police. He was running away and appears to have been shot in the back. He was found asleep in his car in a Wendy's carpark and after over 20 minutes of discussion he went berserk when the cops wanted to cuff him. After everything that is going on I can't believe these police are still making these decisions. He had no firearm, he was running away after resisting arrest after what I would consider to be a low level infringement, so risk to the police officers was low. And he is dead. That is crazy
Not defending the officer and don't know the full law on this, but please include all context.
You missed out this part,
"Brooks resisted and stole a Taser from an officer, they said. Brooks ran from the officers, and at one point, aimed the Taser at police before the officer fired his weapon, "Private citizens, and licensed Concealed Carry gun owners, would face no charges if they used their weapon because they were assaulted and had a taser gun fired at me by an inebriated person. Madness
It is now possible (but not certain) the cop could face murder charges. This will blow back on Democrats hard. Police unions will abandon them in droves.
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@Frank said in US Politics:
@canefan said in US Politics:
And now a 27 year old black man ends up shot dead after a scuffle with police. He was running away and appears to have been shot in the back. He was found asleep in his car in a Wendy's carpark and after over 20 minutes of discussion he went berserk when the cops wanted to cuff him. After everything that is going on I can't believe these police are still making these decisions. He had no firearm, he was running away after resisting arrest after what I would consider to be a low level infringement, so risk to the police officers was low. And he is dead. That is crazy
You missed out this part,
"Brooks resisted and stole a Taser from an officer, they said. Brooks ran from the officers, and at one point, aimed the Taser at police before the officer fired his weapon, "Ran from the officers firing a taser. I don't know about you but I think there is a big difference between running at officers and running away. And a taser is not a lethal firearm, aiming when running and drunk is probably tricky. I'm not saying this guy didn't deserve to go to jail, but if you think in this instance that he deserved to get shot dead then we will have to agree to disagree
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@Snowy said in US Politics:
@Frank You missed this bit : "officials said"
after officials said he resisted arrest and stole an officer's Taser.
@Frank said in US Politics:
please include all context.
The officials are whom I wonder?
Watch the video and listen.
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@Frank said in US Politics:
What an awesome dude.
Have you read any of his books? I'm looking for a recommendation, have watched a few interviews in the last couple years and read 'basic economics' last year which I thought was very eye opening. Just trying to choose the next one to read.
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Contrast this experience with something I witnessed first hand. Week one of lockdown a polynesian guy was caught by the cops driving near our house at 2 in the morning. He stopped his car and took off on foot, chased by the eagle helicopter and a couple of officers. The guy ran onto the reserve behind our house and ended up hiding on a low part of our roof. He was tracked by two officers and a dog. After a tense verbal exchange the guy was coaxed off the roof and grabbed by the dog before being taken away. If I lived in Atlanta I don't think the police would have been that patient with him, he would have ended up shot just like that guy sleeping in his car
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@Snowy said in US Politics:
@Frank said in US Politics:
Watch the video and listen.
I did. So the police handcuffed a guy and shot him in the back. My cynicism was about the word "officials".
So is resisting arrest an instant capital punishment? It appears so these days.
It would be interesting to see what police procedure is on that. The majority of these cases are related to resisting arrest. Maybe that's change that could be brought in, if someone is resisting arrest to the point where it is becoming dangerous to themselves but not an immediate danger to police or public maybe let them go, call backup and follow the suspect. Or would that just lead to more people resisting arrest and increased police fatalities?
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@Rembrandt said in US Politics:
@Snowy said in US Politics:
@Frank said in US Politics:
Watch the video and listen.
I did. So the police handcuffed a guy and shot him in the back. My cynicism was about the word "officials".
So is resisting arrest an instant capital punishment? It appears so these days.
It would be interesting to see what police procedure is on that. The majority of these cases are related to resisting arrest. Maybe that's change that could be brought in, if someone is resisting arrest to the point where it is becoming dangerous to themselves but not an immediate danger to police or public maybe let them go, call backup and follow the suspect. Or would that just lead to more people resisting arrest and increased police fatalities?
If the officers are in no immediate danger I think there is no way they can shoot. He was running away from them, he wasn't on a rampage. Call for backup and chase the guy on foot
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@Rembrandt When everybody is armed it is obviously more difficult. I've never tried it but shooting someone with you hands behind your back must be a bit tricky.
Basically agree with you but you just remove the guns and it becomes more like @canefan home situation above.
Edit and the post after from him.