Positions and players to watch - 2021
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Starting off in the backs.
At halfback it's pretty clear that there is a huge drop off after Smith, and we're not sure if he will be available in good form for the World Cup.
Fakatava should be exciting to watch; Nock has the skills and is growing mentally, especially in leadership; Xavier Roe plays confidently and could be a bolter; Enari has a lot to prove - will he emerge at last?
Can't say much about the Hurricanes halfbacks without seeing them play Super Rugby. Not a fan of Christie so far, hope he proves me wrong.
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2nd Five-Eighth
A big one this year, as our midfield really underperformed last year, lacking penetration and defensive muscle. Distribution from 12 was often mediocre too. This may also be the position with least depth, with some AB options better suited to centre.
ALB - seems more like a centre to me. Classy player, can run good lines outwide, accurate defender, decent distributor, not direct or physical enough at 12.
Jack Goodhue - not the fastest, doesn't have a good long passing game from 12, better suited to centre where he is an accurate player and very good off-loader.
Laumape - not suited to test rugby. Too small to play his direct, physical game at that level. Poor distribution, running lines aren't adequate at that level.
TJ Faiane - probably too small.
Peter Umaga-Jensen - does he have the distribution to play 12? Might be worth trying.
Havili - need to see a full season at 12 in Super Rugby.
Will be interesting to see if "2nd five-eighth" rather than an inside centre type puts their hand up.
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Thomas Umaga-Jensen at 12 for the Landers is one to watch. He’s had an injury stricken career so far but he’s equally as good as his brother. Suits 12 due to his size and his ability to offload in the tackle.
Focusing on the outsides for me:
Caleb Clarke: can’t wait to see how he performs after a few games in black. Looks to have all the skills in the world but I’d like to see him dominate at Super level.
Salesi Rayasi: I’m hoping he gets first crack in the Hurricanes 11 jersey. His height and size give him a huge advantage against most wingers out there. Let’s hope he takes his chance.
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Hooker
In the 2020 test season it seemed that there was Coles followed by daylight, and it this may be his last season. Taylor, who I thought was our number one option at the start of 2020, has dropped off significantly, and Aumua is still not at test level but is getting better. Hopefully Taylor has a big year
Other possibilities:
Samisoni Taukei'aho - if he learned how to throw he could be a very good player.
Kurt Eklund - needs to keep improving and increasing his physical presence. Very fit, good defender, but can he carry well enough?
Ash Dixon - had his best season last year, accurate player. Does he have the physicality for test rugby?
How will Nathan Harris come back after a long-term injury? Any thoughts on Brodie McAlister?
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@Tim could be the passing of the guard from Coles to Aumua in the Canes. Hope the young fella can take full toll of his opportunity.
The young kid from the Blues (rookie of the year maybe) is also one to watch. Looks like a huge unit.
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@Canes4life said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
The young kid from the Blues (rookie of the year maybe) is also one to watch. Looks like a huge unit.
Unfortunately the Blues said that he is out for four to five months.
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Number 6s look fairly competitive.
Devan Flanders (Canes), Cullen Grace (Crusaders), Mikaele Tu’u (Highlanders), Akira Ioane (Blues) and Luke Jacobsen (Chiefs) will give the AB selectors a headache I’m sure.
Fifita and Squire are probably two other guys looking to return to international footy and have a little bit to prove.
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@Tim argh really.
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@Tim said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
Laumape - not suited to test rugby. Too small to play his direct, physical game at that level. Poor distribution, running lines aren't adequate at that level.
I disagree. He's not been given a chance at test level with a game plan that suits his style. He can change a game with that power and linebreak ability, and he's shown really good option-taking after that line break, which is where a lot of physical backs break down.
The games he's been in have at test level have been frustrating to watch with no clear game plan that I could see, let alone one which took advantage of his or other players' strengths. When he's running on to the ball at pace, there are few better line breakers in world rugby.
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@Tim said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
Laumape - not suited to test rugby. Too small to play his direct, physical game at that level. Poor distribution, running lines aren't adequate at that level.
Can you please send this to Laumape’s DM? It will be great to see him angry in the first game of the year.
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@Canes4life said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
Thomas Umaga-Jensen at 12 for the Landers is one to watch. He’s had an injury stricken career so far but he’s equally as good as his brother. Suits 12 due to his size and his ability to offload in the tackle.
I'm also interested to see Tanielu Teleʻa at 12 for the Blues. Carried well in the NPC, will need to work of defensive reads and his distribution.
Focusing on the outsides for me:
Caleb Clarke: can’t wait to see how he performs after a few games in black. Looks to have all the skills in the world but I’d like to see him dominate at Super level.
Salesi Rayasi: I’m hoping he gets first crack in the Hurricanes 11 jersey. His height and size give him a huge advantage against most wingers out there. Let’s hope he takes his chance.
Yeah, there's lots of talent out wide. Interested to see where Will Jordan plays, and if Mark Telea has improved under the high ball and on defence, and if he has his confidence back. Looked better on defence for Tasman by the end of the season. Zarn Sullivan is an interesting one to watch, but he may be better suited at 10. How Leicester Fainga'anuku is used will be worth watching too.
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@delicatessen said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
@Tim said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
Laumape - not suited to test rugby. Too small to play his direct, physical game at that level. Poor distribution, running lines aren't adequate at that level.
I disagree. He's not been given a chance at test level with a game plan that suits his style. He can change a game with that power and linebreak ability, and he's shown really good option-taking after that line break, which is where a lot of physical backs break down.
The games he's been in have at test level have been frustrating to watch with no clear game plan that I could see, let alone one which took advantage of his or other players' strengths. When he's running on to the ball at pace, there are few better line breakers in world rugby.
Him beating Beauden Barrett on the outside was terrific to watch.
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@MN5 yeah that game against the Blues last year at the Cake Tin was something else by Laumape. Must of had about five red bulls before that game, certainly played like one.
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@Canes4life said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
@MN5 yeah that game against the Blues last year at the Cake Tin was something else by Laumape. Must of had about five red bulls before that game, certainly played like one.
.....and for those doubting whether he has the more subtle touches to his game could look at how Nonu developed these at a similar age.
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In terms of props I don’t think you can go past Fletcher Newell and T Williams from the Crusaders in terms of potential. Young guns for sure so I hope we see plenty of them in 2021. The other four franchises will be hoping we don’t.
Lomax will be after a big season for the Canes after holding his own last year.
Laulaula at the Blues is probably keen to put his hand up again.
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Tupaea one to watch at 12 if Chiefs play him there.
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@Canes4life said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
Caleb Clarke: can’t wait to see how he performs after a few games in black. Looks to have all the skills in the world but I’d like to see him dominate at Super level.
Didn't put a foot wrong and doesn't seem to have any weaknesses.
What surprised me was his maturity - looked as though he'd been playing Test rugby for years. Hungry for work too.
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Fakatava a dead cert. Curious to see if any uncapped second rows and 10s put their hands up.
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@MN5 said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
.....and for those doubting whether he has the more subtle touches to his game could look at how Nonu developed these at a similar age.
It would be great to see his skills develop and used a la Nonu. He looks to me to still be a bit one-dimensional ATM.
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@MN5 said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
@Canes4life said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
@MN5 yeah that game against the Blues last year at the Cake Tin was something else by Laumape. Must of had about five red bulls before that game, certainly played like one.
.....and for those doubting whether he has the more subtle touches to his game could look at how Nonu developed these at a similar age.
Similar ages? Laumape is the same age nonu was at the 2011 world cup. This so called development is a couple of years behind
Nonu was also 4cm taller and 10kg heavier
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@mariner4life said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
@MN5 said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
@Canes4life said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
@MN5 yeah that game against the Blues last year at the Cake Tin was something else by Laumape. Must of had about five red bulls before that game, certainly played like one.
.....and for those doubting whether he has the more subtle touches to his game could look at how Nonu developed these at a similar age.
Similar ages? Laumape is the same age nonu was at the 2011 world cup. This so called development is a couple of years behind
Nonu was also 4cm taller and 10kg heavier
The Laumape/Nonu analogy is just dumb. Nonu always had the physical game at test level.
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@mariner4life said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
@MN5 said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
@Canes4life said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
@MN5 yeah that game against the Blues last year at the Cake Tin was something else by Laumape. Must of had about five red bulls before that game, certainly played like one.
.....and for those doubting whether he has the more subtle touches to his game could look at how Nonu developed these at a similar age.
Similar ages? Laumape is the same age nonu was at the 2011 world cup. This so called development is a couple of years behind
Nonu was also 4cm taller and 10kg heavier
Yes. Similar ages. The skillset you're after has developed nicely over the last couple of years.
Also - he hasn't been playing union forever.
@Tim said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
@mariner4life said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
@MN5 said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
@Canes4life said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
@MN5 yeah that game against the Blues last year at the Cake Tin was something else by Laumape. Must of had about five red bulls before that game, certainly played like one.
.....and for those doubting whether he has the more subtle touches to his game could look at how Nonu developed these at a similar age.
Similar ages? Laumape is the same age nonu was at the 2011 world cup. This so called development is a couple of years behind
Nonu was also 4cm taller and 10kg heavier
The Laumape/Nonu analogy is just dumb. Nonu always had the physical game at test level.
Maybe so in that comparisons are odious and such like, but really? You think there's nothing analogous about two midfielders with strong running/crash ball games that were both asked to develop other complementary skills?
Agreed Laumape hasn't broken into the test team as easily as Nonu did, but I'd argue that's more due to the quality of competition.None of us have seen enough yet to know whether Laumape has the physical game at test level.
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He's less.than 100kg. At best he's Sam tuitupou
Players don't magically get better in their late 20s
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@mariner4life said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
He's less.than 100kg. At best he's Sam tuitupou
Players don't magically get better in their late 20s
I'll just leave this here.
If that doesn't convince you I'll get my mate to ask his future step son in law ( who is in the Hurricanes ) to get him to jump on the scales at pre season training.
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@Canes4life said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
Number 6s look fairly competitive.
Devan Flanders (Canes), Cullen Grace (Crusaders), Mikaele Tu’u (Highlanders), Akira Ioane (Blues) and Luke Jacobsen (Chiefs) will give the AB selectors a headache I’m sure.
Fifita and Squire are probably two other guys looking to return to international footy and have a little bit to prove.
Except that he's an 8....
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@Canes4life nah don't coz he'll call the fern out for "disrespecting his name."
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@Bones said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
@Canes4life said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
Number 6s look fairly competitive.
Devan Flanders (Canes), Cullen Grace (Crusaders), Mikaele Tu’u (Highlanders), Akira Ioane (Blues) and Luke Jacobsen (Chiefs) will give the AB selectors a headache I’m sure.
Fifita and Squire are probably two other guys looking to return to international footy and have a little bit to prove.
Except that he's an 8....
As is Jacobson.
And, apparently Grace wants to play 8 too (can't remember where I read that).
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@gt12 said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
As is Jacobson.
Hasn't he played more rugby at 6? When in form he's a pretty damn good defender. Haven't seen the ball carrying from him that an 8 would need.
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It's pretty funny how Frizzel is left off that list completely...
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@Bones It's what you'd expect after three forgettable years in the All Blacks.
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@Tim said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
@Bones It's what you'd expect after three forgettable years in the All Blacks.
Well maybe the new coaching group will drop him then....oh....
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@Bones Yep, conservative Foster has no balls.
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Flanders' preferred position is no. 8, too.
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@Tim said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
@Bones Yep, conservative Foster has no balls.
Anyway, clearly you haven't forgotten!
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@Tim said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
2nd Five-Eighth
A big one this year, as our midfield really underperformed last year, lacking penetration and defensive muscle. Distribution from 12 was often mediocre too. This may also be the position with least depth, with some AB options better suited to centre.
ALB - seems more like a centre to me. Classy player, can run good lines outwide, accurate defender, decent distributor, not direct or physical enough at 12.
Jack Goodhue - not the fastest, doesn't have a good long passing game from 12, better suited to centre where he is an accurate player and very good off-loader.
Laumape - not suited to test rugby. Too small to play his direct, physical game at that level. Poor distribution, running lines aren't adequate at that level.
TJ Faiane - probably too small.
Peter Umaga-Jensen - does he have the distribution to play 12? Might be worth trying.
Havili - need to see a full season at 12 in Super Rugby.
Will be interesting to see if "2nd five-eighth" rather than an inside centre type puts their hand up.
Cough cough Jordie cough cough.
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@MN5 said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
@mariner4life said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
He's less.than 100kg. At best he's Sam tuitupou
Players don't magically get better in their late 20s
I'll just leave this here.
If that doesn't convince you I'll get my mate to ask his future step son in law ( who is in the Hurricanes ) to get him to jump on the scales at pre season training.
He’s not a tall man but he’s built like a brick shit house. Farking tree trunk legs. He may lack certain skills but it’s pretty strange to say he doesn’t have the physical attributes. It’s not like he needs to jump in line outs.
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@Tim said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
@gt12 said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
As is Jacobson.
Hasn't he played more rugby at 6? When in form he's a pretty damn good defender. Haven't seen the ball carrying from him that an 8 would need.
Yep, but I think he has played better rugby at 8. He's probably a bit Masoe-ish in that he can play anywhere (less at 7 of course), but at the next level he's probably a bit small for a six.
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@Rancid-Schnitzel said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
@MN5 said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
@mariner4life said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
He's less.than 100kg. At best he's Sam tuitupou
Players don't magically get better in their late 20s
I'll just leave this here.
If that doesn't convince you I'll get my mate to ask his future step son in law ( who is in the Hurricanes ) to get him to jump on the scales at pre season training.
He’s not a tall man but he’s built like a brick shit house. Farking tree trunk legs. He may lack certain skills but it’s pretty strange to say he doesn’t have the physical attributes. It’s not like he needs to jump in line outs.
He's a bit odd, in that comparatively, his torso looks tiny compared to his legs. He's about 5' of legs and 8" of torso/head (no neck).
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Very surprised that halfback hasn’t entered the conversation. Weber is a stopgap measure as number 2 (although we do need him if AS falls over). Still looking for the next cabs off the rank.
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@Crucial said in Positions and players to watch - 2021:
Very surprised that halfback hasn’t entered the conversation. Weber is a stopgap measure as number 2 (although we do need him if AS falls over). Still looking for the next cabs off the rank.
I know sometimes @Tim's posts are a bit cryptic, but his OP discussing halfbacks was pretty clear!
