New Lynn knife attack
-
I don't agree with the logic, but I can see why Countdown might have temporarily removed knives from their shelves until the dust settles on all of this. There was always going to be a heap of knee-jerk reactions to something like this, as I noted earlier, security responses to terrorism are always disproportionate to any other crimes, bar-none, and I wouldn't be surprised if other companies move to do it for a little while as well. Especially when you contrast it with the non-terror related multiple stabbing down south earlier in the year which didn't result in any wide reaction (although the knife wasn't sourced from the shelves, of course)
I just want to know why the Mongrel Mob haven't offered to start guarding supermarkets like they did last time around. They must be all out of PR in 2021 after the Shield Snorters drug rehab charm offensive.
-
This is probably the most interesting read I've seen yet, touches on the nature of "lone wolf" terror attackers and how hard they are to stop. John Battersby was a lecturer for a couple of uni papers I did toward my masters a few years back. An incredibly intelligent but also practical academic - he's either serving or very recently ex-police as well.
The upside of ad-hoc lone wolf attackers appears to be that their unsophisticated nature means they don't do widespread damage in the scheme of terror attacks (such as something like a suicide bomber or car bomber might). The downside appears to be that they're very difficult for the intelligence community to pick up on and don't require a heap of planning or resources.
-
@no-quarter said in New Lynn knife attack:
They just need to package the knives in that plastic packaging a lot of toys come in which is almost impossible to open
I reckon a Chupa Chup wrapper would do the job, those fuckers are impossible to open
-
What do we know about the attacker?
The man, whose identity cannot be revealed due to court suppression orders, arrived in New Zealand in October 2011. He became a person of national security interest in 2016.
He had been under round-the-clock monitoring and heavy surveillance due to concerns about his ideology. He was known to multiple agencies, and was also on a terror watchlist.
Local media reports said the attacker was 32 years old and had recently been sentenced to one year of supervision for possessing IS propaganda.
Prosecutors had accused him of plotting a "lone wolf" terror attack using knives, but the judge ruled that planning a terror attack was not in itself an offence under existing laws, the reports said.
His internet search history and bookmarks included heroes of Isis, Islamic State dress, and New Zealand prison clothes and food, according to Stuff.
Ms Ardern said that until Friday, he had not committed any offence. When asked about the man's motivations, she said they were "Isis-inspired".
FFS. The guy was on a student visa. He was recently in jail for possession of ISIS material and was under high-level surveillance. What does it take to deport someone?
-
@canefan said in New Lynn knife attack:
FFS. The guy was on a student visa. He was recently in jail for possession of ISIS material and was under high-level surveillance. What does it take to deport someone?
From the reporting so far that’s the visa he initially arrived on. We find out tomorrow what visa (or residency status) he was on by 2016.
-
@voodoo said in New Lynn knife attack:
@no-quarter said in New Lynn knife attack:
They just need to package the knives in that plastic packaging a lot of toys come in which is almost impossible to open
I reckon a Chupa Chup wrapper would do the job, those fuckers are impossible to open
The pressure of trying to open one of those for a crying kid is immense
-
@canefan said in New Lynn knife attack:
His internet search history and bookmarks included heroes of Isis, Islamic State dress, and New Zealand prison clothes and food, according to Stuff.
Now I'm curious as to what clothes and food they get but I can't google it or I'll end up on some sort of watchlist!
I'm not sure why Stuff thinks that's anywhere near as noteworthy as the first two.
-
@antipodean said in New Lynn knife attack:
... Jacinda saying this guy "doesn't represent any faith" is such a load of shit and just pours petrol on the fire. He follows a version of Islam, ... to claim it has nothing to do with it is just fucking bananas. God she's an idiot.
... When she says this bullshit, there really should be a journalist in the room taking her to task. It's a straight out lie.
...
It's fine to deal in facts, she doesn't have to treat NZers like idiots. She's either doing that or she's a complete idiot herself.
...I have no difficulty believing she's stupid and thinks she's smarter than most New Zealanders.
Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern said she was “gutted” the man had been at large despite his known extremism. “What happened today was despicable. It was hateful, it was wrong,” she said. “It was carried out by an individual, not a faith, not a culture, not an ethnicity but an individual person who is gripped by an ideology that is not supported here by anyone in the community.”
"ISIS inspired". What does the first letter in the acronym ISIS literally say?
Doesn't the widely loved Comrade Saint Jacinda have a special Amazonian Guard that she sends out to maximise on such fabulous photo opportunities? To signify solidarity and empathy and to remind New Zealanders they are merely a vehicle for her to pursue her favourite hobbies?
She is of a despicable class that manipulates and deceives and directs how people must live, the very people who pay their wage in the naive belief they act in their interests, honorably.
Yet New Zealanders are likely to give her another crack in two years time!
-
@anonymous said in New Lynn knife attack:
@canefan said in New Lynn knife attack:
His internet search history and bookmarks included heroes of Isis, Islamic State dress, and New Zealand prison clothes and food, according to Stuff.
Now I'm curious as to what clothes and food they get but I can't google it or I'll end up on some sort of watchlist!
I'm not sure why Stuff thinks that's anywhere near as noteworthy as the first two.
I imagine if you were planning to commit a crime you might want to know whether you'd be getting bacon for breakfast every morning in jail.
-
@canefan NZ doesn't deport people into likely murder/genocide, and if he was a resident for a long time, that makes it close to impossible as well.
It's also extremely difficult to write laws to criminalize one person planning a crime - conspiracy is a known concept (2 or more people planning criminal activities) as is incitement (1 person attempting to convince another to commit a crime), but criminalizing a lone nutter who takes no steps other than buying a knife is seriously prone to overreach by the police later.
Imagine a situation where someone is convicted and sentenced to 5 years because they spew hate online who then bought a hunting knife. The proposed hate speech legislation has been absolutely panned - getting this wrong would be that on steroids.
-
@donsteppa said in New Lynn knife attack:
@canefan said in New Lynn knife attack:
FFS. The guy was on a student visa. He was recently in jail for possession of ISIS material and was under high-level surveillance. What does it take to deport someone?
From the reporting so far that’s the visa he initially arrived on. We find out tomorrow what visa (or residency status) he was on by 2016.
Agreed with this. Just because he came here on a student visa doesn't mean that's what he remained on. My bet is maybe an asylum/refugee visa (I have no clue if that's true or not). Plenty of Tamil left Sri Lanka in the 2000s after after Civil War ended.
Jacinda alluded it was hard to send him home, that is one likely reason why
-
@godder said in New Lynn knife attack:
@canefan NZ doesn't deport people into likely murder/genocide, and if he was a resident for a long time, that makes it close to impossible as well.
It's also extremely difficult to write laws to criminalize one person planning a crime - conspiracy is a known concept (2 or more people planning criminal activities) as is incitement (1 person attempting to convince another to commit a crime), but criminalizing a lone nutter who takes no steps other than buying a knife is seriously prone to overreach by the police later.
Imagine a situation where someone is convicted and sentenced to 5 years because they spew hate online who then bought a hunting knife. The proposed hate speech legislation has been absolutely panned - getting this wrong would be that on steroids.
My old man told me that he tried to leave the country but was refused (and arrested). Is that true? If so, who is the fuck-knuckle who needs an uppercut?
Edit: Seems so, according to NY Times
Ms. Ardern said on Saturday that the man had been arrested at the Auckland airport in 2017 on suspicion of planning to travel to Syria to join the Islamic State militant group, which then controlled parts of Syria and Iraq.
-
@godder said in New Lynn knife attack:
@canefan NZ doesn't deport people into likely murder/genocide, and if he was a resident for a long time, that makes it close to impossible as well.
It's also extremely difficult to write laws to criminalize one person planning a crime - conspiracy is a known concept (2 or more people planning criminal activities) as is incitement (1 person attempting to convince another to commit a crime), but criminalizing a lone nutter who takes no steps other than buying a knife is seriously prone to overreach by the police later.
Imagine a situation where someone is convicted and sentenced to 5 years because they spew hate online who then bought a hunting knife. The proposed hate speech legislation has been absolutely panned - getting this wrong would be that on steroids.
I kind of would like to disagree, but I agree.
-
@aucklandwarlord said in New Lynn knife attack:
@donsteppa said in New Lynn knife attack:
@canefan said in New Lynn knife attack:
FFS. The guy was on a student visa. He was recently in jail for possession of ISIS material and was under high-level surveillance. What does it take to deport someone?
From the reporting so far that’s the visa he initially arrived on. We find out tomorrow what visa (or residency status) he was on by 2016.
Agreed with this. Just because he came here on a student visa doesn't mean that's what he remained on. My bet is maybe an asylum/refugee visa (I have no clue if that's true or not). Plenty of Tamil left Sri Lanka in the 2000s after after Civil War ended.
Jacinda alluded it was hard to send him home, that is one likely reason why
Seems Tamils are generally Hindu, and the beef was between the Buddists and Hindu Tamils.
Muslims make up just under 10% of the population.
What is remarkable to me from that wikipedia entry is the percentage of the population who claim to have a faith.
Not many atheists in Sri Lanka.
-
@gt12 said in New Lynn knife attack:
My old man told me that he tried to leave the country but was refused (and arrested). Is that true? If so, who is the fuck-knuckle who needs an uppercut?
Most Western/allied/OECD nations detained people who planned or attempted to travel offshore to join Isis. Including Japan from a quick Google.
We find out soon about his visa or residency status. In the meantime, I imagine there would have been a lot of clamouring for uppercuts if a "New Zealander"or "New Zealand resident"showed up in Isis footage in 2017 committing atrocities if that law had been ignored at the border.
-
@aucklandwarlord said in New Lynn knife attack:
@donsteppa said in New Lynn knife attack:
@canefan said in New Lynn knife attack:
FFS. The guy was on a student visa. He was recently in jail for possession of ISIS material and was under high-level surveillance. What does it take to deport someone?
From the reporting so far that’s the visa he initially arrived on. We find out tomorrow what visa (or residency status) he was on by 2016.
Agreed with this. Just because he came here on a student visa doesn't mean that's what he remained on. My bet is maybe an asylum/refugee visa (I have no clue if that's true or not). Plenty of Tamil left Sri Lanka in the 2000s after after Civil War ended.
Jacinda alluded it was hard to send him home, that is one likely reason why
Yep, it'll be interesting... on the one hand he has been referred to as a "Sri Lankan National" in a few media reports. But, I see there were seven Sri Lankans included in refugee and protection approvals by nationality in 2013/14, so it might fit the known timeframe too. (Source: https://www.immigration.govt.nz/documents/statistics/statistics-refugee-and-protection.pdf)
-
@donsteppa said in New Lynn knife attack:
@gt12 said in New Lynn knife attack:
My old man told me that he tried to leave the country but was refused (and arrested). Is that true? If so, who is the fuck-knuckle who needs an uppercut?
Most Western/allied/OECD nations detained people who planned or attempted to travel offshore to join Isis. Including Japan from a quick Google.
We find out soon about his visa or residency status. In the meantime, I imagine there would have been a lot of clamouring for uppercuts if a "New Zealander"or "New Zealand resident"showed up in Isis footage in 2017 committing atrocities if that law had been ignored at the border.
From your quick google was that Japanese residents or Japanese citizens?
The two are very different.
-
@booboo said in New Lynn knife attack:
Not many atheists in Sri Lanka.
I went there twice on holiday - 2012 and 2019. Amazing place. They also have a bit of a catholic presence too. Great people, incredible hosts as well. Highly recommended. They love their cricket too, obviously.
We went up into the north in 2019 which was traditionally a Tamil stronghold. Never felt unsafe once - the people thought my blonde haired kids were some type of deity. We got swarmed at remote locations by locals wanting photos of the blonde kids. Some local Tamil lady also saved my wife from some rabid monkey while I was busy laughing - Mrs AWL still brings that up, funnily enough.
-
@gt12 said in New Lynn knife attack:
@donsteppa said in New Lynn knife attack:
@gt12 said in New Lynn knife attack:
My old man told me that he tried to leave the country but was refused (and arrested). Is that true? If so, who is the fuck-knuckle who needs an uppercut?
Most Western/allied/OECD nations detained people who planned or attempted to travel offshore to join Isis. Including Japan from a quick Google.
We find out soon about his visa or residency status. In the meantime, I imagine there would have been a lot of clamouring for uppercuts if a "New Zealander"or "New Zealand resident"showed up in Isis footage in 2017 committing atrocities if that law had been ignored at the border.
From your quick google was that Japanese residents or Japanese citizens?
The two are very different.
This is a far as I got while also checking Oz and the US etc. The first one is paywalled so this is as far as I got: https://www.japantimes.co.jp/tag/isis/
Man, 31, referred to prosecutors over attempt to join Islamic State while at Hokkaido University
A 31-year-old man was referred to prosecutors Wednesday for allegedly preparing to travel to Syria to join the Islamic State militant group in 2014 while he was a student at Hokkaido University, Tokyo police and other sources said. The police also sent investigative papers to ...
Not sure if this guy got sent back from Turkey: https://www.haaretz.com/middle-east-news/japanese-aspiring-jihadist-detained-turkey-1.5422192
-
Now revealed he was a Tamil refugee claimant who was in the tedious process of having his refugee status unwound by the courts and tribunals.
It's a real long process full of appeal rights to unpick that stuff. Not uncommon for someone to arrive on a temporary visa and then claim, hence arriving as a student.