Pick the next AB coach - two horse race
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Two men enter, one man leaves. Of the two, who do you want to coach our national team?
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Really tough. I'd probably prefer Joseph, but there's probably no difference in what results either would achieve and I think the whingefest if Robertson doesn't get it would be intolerable.
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@Bones said in Pick the next AB coach - two horse race:
Really tough. I'd probably prefer Joseph, but there's probably no difference in what results either would achieve and I think the whingefest if Robertson doesn't get it would be intolerable.
Vote man! Sitting on the fence is not one of the 2 options…
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Sorry Jamie. I just can't bear to listen to another 4 years of toy throwing anytime something goes wrong.
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Razor
Close the thread
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Razor.
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A lot of opinions about the importance of Tony Brown. He was a pretty shitty coach for the Highlanders, and was a massive fucking whiner in his last two years in NZ.
No thanks!
Big shame that Schmidt isn't available.
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@Tim said in Pick the next AB coach - two horse race:
A lot of opinions about the importance of Tony Brown. He was a pretty shitty coach for the Highlanders, and was a massive fucking whiner in his last two years in NZ.
No thanks!
Big shame that Schmidt isn't available.
Get O'Halloran back
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@Tim said in Pick the next AB coach - two horse race:
A lot of opinions about the importance of Tony Brown. He was a pretty shitty coach for the Highlanders, and was a massive fucking whiner in his last two years in NZ.
The Tony Brown thing ways get bigged up by his mate Jeff Wilson. He's no Wayne Smith.
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Don't really have an opinion between the two, but think NZR will go for Joseph. He seems to fit the NZR mould a bit better.
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Well I pretty happy with whoever gets the gig, it's been decided by people who know more than me.
If I vote it would be for JJ, I not sure I want ABs playing like a super team, and the whinge festival would be a thing to behold from all the experts on forums. Lol -
@Dan54 said in Pick the next AB coach - two horse race:
Well I pretty happy with whoever gets the gig, it's been decided by people who know more than me.
If I vote it would be for JJ, I not sure I want ABs playing like a super team, and the whinge festival would be a thing to behold from all the experts on forums. LolI thought posters on here were the experts.
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@Dan54 said in Pick the next AB coach - two horse race:
Well I pretty happy with whoever gets the gig, it's been decided by people who know more than me.
If I vote it would be for JJ, I not sure I want ABs playing like a super team, and the whinge festival would be a thing to behold from all the experts on forums. LolI think you are really getting the wrong end of the stick, the huge love for Razor is because in '19 it was him or Foster, and last year it was him or Foster. And that is why people are so pro-Razor, anything to get the current useless PoS out of the head coach role. For next year it (thank fuck) won't be Foster so most are happy as the two that we know of who are going for it have actually had competent head coaching history. I prefer Razor, I would like to see a shake-up of the staid ABs backroom team and style, but Joseph will be fine.
Anything but a continuation of the late Hansen mediocrity that turned into the Foster disaster
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I'm genuinely surprised by the number of votes Joseph is getting. Has he already had this many fans on here? If so they're been a fairly silent minority.
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I won't be upset if it's JJ but I'd prefer Razor. He's younger and you can't question his record. Ultimately when AB coach it's about getting the best out of the best players to win every game, not assembling a rag tag bunch to punch above their weight. I really think (or hope and pray) that Razor will thrive in that environment.
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@Nepia said in Pick the next AB coach - two horse race:
I'm genuinely surprised by the number of votes Joseph is getting. Has he already had this many fans on here? If so they're been a fairly silent minority.
The coach and NZR need a good working relationship. I think the well has been poisoned
Plus Joseph doesn't have a comb-over
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Long time ago and the board/management has gone from geriatric fishheads to whatever we can label them atm but he was a player (like Cullen) that sued the NZR for Mitch dropping him.
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@Duluth said in Pick the next AB coach - two horse race:
@Nepia said in Pick the next AB coach - two horse race:
I'm genuinely surprised by the number of votes Joseph is getting. Has he already had this many fans on here? If so they're been a fairly silent minority.
The coach and NZR need a good working relationship. I think the well has been poisoned
Plus Joseph doesn't have a comb-over
I'm not ready to call it, once a decision is announced people can get along fine.
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@Nepia said in Pick the next AB coach - two horse race:
people can get along fine.
Theoretically it's possible. It rarely happens like that in the real world, people hold grudges (in both directions). I'd rather a coach that has a good working relationship with NZR because the team is more likely to have good results. We have good options.
Plus the comb-over is disqualifying
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@Duluth said in Pick the next AB coach - two horse race:
@Nepia said in Pick the next AB coach - two horse race:
people can get along fine.
Theoretically it's possible. It rarely happens like that in the real world, people hold grudges (in both directions). I'd rather a coach that has a good working relationship with NZR because the team is more likely to have good results. We have good options.
Plus the comb-over is disqualifying
Will need ear plugs if Brown goes with Joseph his whining through the last 2 super seasons was annoying as it can get.
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I won't be upset if it's JJ but I'd prefer Razor. He's younger and you can't question his record.
Ideally, the next coach should take us through 2 world cup cycles, so age comes into factor - Razor is 48, Joseph is 53, the younger coach has more room for growth hence (in terms of longevity) Razor is the better option, because coaches have a window in which they are at their best, looking at past successful international & title winning coaches it's generally between 40-55 years (not always - but far more often than not this is the case). Hansen, Jones, Gatland, Rennie are just a few examples who's effectiveness as head coaches all declined once they entered that critical late-50's period. This is a trend that is extremely consistent & can't be ignored.
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I would be happy with either, but Razor edges it for me.
Although I guess the strength of the team around them is also a factor, do we know who they are bringing with them?
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@Tim not 2 but down to 5 now
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What ? there is 5 now ? after Schmidt had the job was told 2 weeks ago he was the coach then pulled out, now there is 5 candidates.
This just gets better and better. -
@kiwi_expat said in Pick the next AB coach - two horse race:
I won't be upset if it's JJ but I'd prefer Razor. He's younger and you can't question his record.
Ideally, the next coach should take us through 2 world cup cycles, so age comes into factor - Razor is 48, Joseph is 53, the younger coach has more room for growth hence (in terms of longevity) Razor is the better option, because coaches have a window in which they are at their best, looking at past successful international & title winning coaches it's generally between 40-55 years (not always - but far more often than not this is the case). Hansen, Jones, Gatland, Rennie are just a few examples who's effectiveness as head coaches all declined once they entered that critical late-50's period. This is a trend that is extremely consistent & can't be ignored.
That's a new idea , I think you win the prize for coming up with most excuses etc why noone but Razor can possibly coach the ABs. How have you worked out that Hansen etc were at use by dates at 55?
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Either but Razor edges it if he has some experienced assistants. If MacDonald, Holland, etc, it seems the whole team would be on this massive learning curve.
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@Higgins said in Pick the next AB coach - two horse race:
@Dan54 said in Pick the next AB coach - two horse race:
Well I pretty happy with whoever gets the gig, it's been decided by people who know more than me.
If I vote it would be for JJ, I not sure I want ABs playing like a super team, and the whinge festival would be a thing to behold from all the experts on forums. LolI thought posters on here were the experts.
Since you are a poster on here I will have to bow to the expertise of your opinion.
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@MiketheSnow said in Pick the next AB coach - two horse race:
Razor
Close the thread
Are you sure? He might pick your hatiest AB at 10!!
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@nostrildamus said in Pick the next AB coach - two horse race:
@MiketheSnow said in Pick the next AB coach - two horse race:
Razor
Close the thread
Are you sure? He might pick your hatiest AB at 10!!
Nah Mounga is overseas when the new coach takes over.
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@Chris said in Pick the next AB coach - two horse race:
@nostrildamus said in Pick the next AB coach - two horse race:
@MiketheSnow said in Pick the next AB coach - two horse race:
Razor
Close the thread
Are you sure? He might pick your hatiest AB at 10!!
Nah Mounga is overseas when the new coach takes over.
Good point but I just wanted to spook @MiketheSnow and remind him how much Razor rates Richie...
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@kiwi_expat said in Pick the next AB coach - two horse race:
I won't be upset if it's JJ but I'd prefer Razor. He's younger and you can't question his record.
Ideally, the next coach should take us through 2 world cup cycles, so age comes into factor - Razor is 48, Joseph is 53, the younger coach has more room for growth hence (in terms of longevity) Razor is the better option, because coaches have a window in which they are at their best, looking at past successful international & title winning coaches it's generally between 40-55 years (not always - but far more often than not this is the case). Hansen, Jones, Gatland, Rennie are just a few examples who's effectiveness as head coaches all declined once they entered that critical late-50's period. This is a trend that is extremely consistent & can't be ignored.
Fucking hell it took me this long to realise you're a parody account and I only realise it because of the pushing of every possible bar of sanity on multiple threads with this little cherry on top of a post.
Well played sir.
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Quite staggering that the posted arguments from last two years don't seem to be about the wider requirements of the role. E. G. Planning a 4 year rwc cycle in detail. Becoming the public face of NZRU and their strategy. Managing a wide array of coaches players and staff to work together for best team results and putting ego's aside. Managing the welfare and development needs of those individuals. It isn't all about finding a motivational gimmick for each match or keeping up with any new ploys and grey areas for officials or rotating squad to have them ready for home finals. I am glad a proper panel is being set up to consider the options because the choice will reverberate through super level and below. I will be happy with whomever they choose as they will be the best overall fit for NZ Rugby for next 4 years.
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@ARHS said in Pick the next AB coach - two horse race:
Quite staggering that the posted arguments from last two years don't seem to be about the wider requirements of the role. E. G. Planning a 4 year rwc cycle in detail. Becoming the public face of NZRU and their strategy. Managing a wide array of coaches players and staff to work together for best team results and putting ego's aside. Managing the welfare and development needs of those individuals. It isn't all about finding a motivational gimmick for each match or keeping up with any new ploys and grey areas for officials or rotating squad to have them ready for home finals. I am glad a proper panel is being set up to consider the options because the choice will reverberate through super level and below. I will be happy with whomever they choose as they will be the best overall fit for NZ Rugby for next 4 years.
dont you know robertson can do all that. hes the best at everything. no weak points
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@ARHS said in Pick the next AB coach - two horse race:
I am glad a proper panel is being set up to consider the options because the choice will reverberate through super level and below.
The whole structure needs attention. Super is no longer preparing players for Tests. We need to refocus on the quality of the rugby, the feeders and pathways, and how we develop and retain coaches and players.
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@ARHS said in Pick the next AB coach - two horse race:
Quite staggering that the posted arguments from last two years don't seem to be about the wider requirements of the role. E. G. Planning a 4 year rwc cycle in detail. Becoming the public face of NZRU and their strategy. Managing a wide array of coaches players and staff to work together for best team results and putting ego's aside. Managing the welfare and development needs of those individuals. It isn't all about finding a motivational gimmick for each match or keeping up with any new ploys and grey areas for officials or rotating squad to have them ready for home finals. I am glad a proper panel is being set up to consider the options because the choice will reverberate through super level and below. I will be happy with whomever they choose as they will be the best overall fit for NZ Rugby for next 4 years.
I have tried to call that stuff out in conjunction with highlighting that Robertson's success has been in excellent planning Super campaigns (a very different kettle of fish)
Of course the discussion then goes back to the ABF brigade.You make a very good point in that (hopefully) NZR are aware of all of these attributes required as AB coach and are looking for the best fit. It is important for this detail to not be lost in the 'overseas experience' one.
There are certainly examples around of coaches that have had success without any track record in these areas but also examples of where that success is very short lived and creates problems down the track or isn't sustainable. (eg the Eddie Jones factor)
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Why is this a two horse race anyway?
You don't think that Gatland has been approached? Isn't interested?
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@Crucial said in Pick the next AB coach - two horse race:
You don't think that Gatland has been approached? Isn't interested?
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@kiwi_expat said in Pick the next AB coach - two horse race:
@Crucial said in Pick the next AB coach - two horse race:
You don't think that Gatland has been approached? Isn't interested?
There is zero in that article that explains the headline. Gatland is only contracted to Wales through RWC2023. At present there is nothing stopping him coming back to NZ and I haven't seen anything from him indicating that he isn't interested this time around.
NZR in the past have been very interested in getting him back here and that must be for a reason. -
There is another name in that article who may apply can't see him being a major contender though Wayne Pivac.
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Might be plenty of people who apply, but the guys holding trump cards are Razor, Joseph, Gatland and Schmidt (but, he's ruled himself out). I can't think of anyone with a record that doesn't get trumped by one of these guys - maybe Rennie has an angle?
I expect it to be Razor and I think it should be.
I counted up the other day and I think he's won something like 20 out of 21 knockout matches coaching Canterbury and the Crusaders - only the Mighty Tasman Mako have got the better of him (and I'll forgive him that).
I think we will need something of a revolution in AB coaching and I think he's the most likely to deliver it.
And I really don't want him and BMac sitting in England plotting our downfalls!
