We had some absolute class posters form the NH.
I rememeber meeitng Gailimh, Irish Richard , and PDP in a Irish bar in Dublin on the eve of the AB's playing a grand slam game in 2005, it is my Wifes 30th and we had a roaring night... my wife quickly got over the fact her long awaited 30th birthday evening in Dublin was crashed by a bunch of Irishman and a Frenchman that I had met online and had never seen before....
At about 11pm we got news that there had been a fire at Landsdown road and that one stand would be unavailable and tickets refunded. It was the stand the wife and I were going to. Gutted, as we were going to all 4 grand slam games, and would have been one short.
PdP stepped up and gave us one of his tickets, and I think Gailimh gave us another. Refused money, just took a guiness each.. actually I think Pdp took a whiskey..
Next afternoon we were on the terraces amongst a sea of Irish fans... BEST MATCH EVER.

Thanks TSF.

@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Black Caps v Pakistan:

Bad declaration imo.

Check out this clown.

This thread is again open for new applicants..

Ardie Savea is not fit to lace up Canes boots

This kid is going to have a hard time in life if this is the attitude he is being instilled with.
Life as an adult is about adapting and being a bit of a chameleon, some of the highest flyers I know are complete and utter muppets when hanging with the mates form the 'ole days'..... I know some guys who look like a member of the Sons of Anarchy with a shirt off and look like finely cut gentlemen with a business shirt on.
Newsflash to this youngster and the people in this thread defending him, society makes arbitrary and no logical rules/social norms all the time, and nearly everyone follows them, of course you don't have to, but there are always consequences, sometimes good, sometimes bad.
He wants to look like Hansen.. fine. Go to a school that allows that.
This isn't about the length of his hair, this is about him wanting the school to bend to his wishes rather than the other way around.

After some heavy in depth analysis, listening the experts, scientists and facebook.. I have decided

I have no fucking idea what to think. Like none at all. I swing between just saying fuck it, lets just lift all bans and let it play out and get back to normal faster as the disease doesnt seem that bad, to lets lock everyone down it s gonna be a disaster.

I have now settled on... having no idea what to think about it. I have found myself agreeing with posts that contradict each other....

I do know I hate the media though.

And anyone who hoardes toilet paper should be stripped of the right to vote or drive a car.

@hydro11 said in Tennis:

It's amazing that you can abuse an appointed official by calling them a liar and then say it is sexist when you get punished for it. I'm no tennis expert so I can't speak to the coaching and racquet violations and whether they are consistently enforced. Sexism comes down to just being disrespectful to women so if you are going to throw those terms around, you should make sure you treat other people properly.

I can. I am a qualified Tennis referee.
Coaching at lower levels is always a warning. Always. At ATP and WTA tournaments, they sometimes are, sometimes not. Could go either way. In this case the coach admitted it so.....
Raquet breaking is always a violation, umpires don't even have discretion with it.
Personal abuse is more discretionary, but is usually a violation. Guys get waaay more violations, but they usually calm down after the first or second. She just kept going at it.

Men have lost points and games before. McEnroe even forfeited a match at a grand slam tournament,.

Williams is a disgrace.

@jegga said in All Blacks vs. B&I Lions test #1:

@Crucial said in All Blacks vs. B&I Lions test #1:

@jegga said in All Blacks vs. B&I Lions test #1:

My brother in law has scheduled a party for his birthday on saturday kicking off at 7:30.
He doesn't have sky.
I got a severe frowning from the mrs when I suggested we perhaps skip it.
Did I mention he doesn't have sky?

FFs.

What a turd.

I'm sure you won't be alone if you slink off to another room and watch a stream on SkyGo (if SkyGo actually goes).
Failing that drop her off and go to the pub.

His friends are like him so I will probably be alone.

Some being such a wimp and your wife needs to pull the stick out of her ass.
It is a birthday party.. big woopdy fucking doo.

We are having an interesting time of things in regards to life plans and housing at the moment.
We have a house (3 bedrooms plus office) 1 bathroom and extra toilet.. pretty modest. Has views over harbor and top half of mount and also part of golf course, plus biggish yard with fruit trees, trampoline, tree house etc. All very middle class suburban, but in a nice area 2 minutes drive to CBD.
We also own a rental in same neighborhood.
We also own a rural residential piece of land inside the city limits, about 8000 sqm. Nice spot, very nice area got a few hundred sqm of native bush etc enough room for pool, tennis court, pony/sheep etc.

We did plan on living there....

We are currently building a house on it, about 250 sqm, so not huge McMansion, but definitely nicer than our current house.

But now.. we are just going to build and sell. We basically had a choice of living in a very expensive house... or not.

We have chosen to sell it clear all our mortgages and have a large wedge of cash in the bank, and keep our rental. But we will still be living in quite a modest house. I think it is an age thing. I just really like the idea of not having a mortgage, having money in the bank and a rental giving us goods money every week.... alot more than owning a super flash house. I drive a clapped out Kia and the wife drives a little Suzuki Ario.. we probably wont change cars either.

Basically i think we really look like we are struggling, and to be honest it is weird when I pick my kids up form school in my crappy old car and are surrounded by massive flash SUV's, I do feel like i m pretty poor! Makes no logical sense.

Now I am just rambling, but I do find the whole finances vs images social dynamics massively fascinating. Most people do not not how well off or poor they really are. we have some friends who are on a continual mission to be in the best house they can afford, always totally leveraged, I suspect they will likely do quite well .. as long as house prices don't crash.

@voodoo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@voodoo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@voodoo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@canefan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@canefan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@canefan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Kirwan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Machpants said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

Possibly, but when you look at Italy etc, the long term damage there is going to be greater. Their lockdown, now, is even harder than ours because they started late. I'm hoping that at the end of this 4 weeks, NZ will be internally open, even if not to overseas, and we can get on with stuff.

If you are going to use the Italy extreme on one side , you have consider the German one on the other side.

It appears that we aren’t on the same path as Italy, and perhaps never were.

Considering our hospital system, and in particular the lack of ICU spots, would you be comfortable taking the chance? I spoke to my mate today. They are still waiting for supplies of the right PPE and Middlemore is the covid centre for Auckland. Even now, if it slides we are fucked, and the doctors and nurses who will try to manage the outbreak will literally be laying their lives on the line

Your mate is telling lies.

Who made you the Oracle? He is on the front line and doesn't have the protective gear he needs. He offered to bring his own but was told not to because it would panic the other staff.

Just because you didn't read it on Breitbart doesn't mean that it isn't happening. Or do you moonlight at the hospital so you saw it for yourself?

Because in my warehouse I have the local supply of gowns, visors, respirators, goggles, masks and overalls for DHB They have barely been touched and the warehouse and provisioning manager said that nobody is remotely short of PPE gear nationwide. And if our national centre for wuflu was short of equipment then it would be major news and easily resolved.
I am sceptical of your stories about a "mate".

Want proof? I can take photos of the pallets and pallets of PPE gear. Even write your name and place it on the photo.
You or your mate are full of shite.

Then why the fuck aren't people working in the hospitals getting this gear? These people are not ones to lie.

They are getting the gear when needed. Either you or your mate are lying

Wow, you're being next-level arrogant and rude today, even by your own standards. Leaping straight to "you or your mate are lying" rather than perhaps there is a disconnect at the hospital, logistics, supply chain, whatever.

Love the way you like to lecture others about "playing the man", then you come out with this sort of stuff

Because I know there is no disconnect in the supply chain in PPE for DHB's as I am in that exact supply chain. I offered po provide proof of this. It is simply a fact that either Canefans mate didnt say what canefan said he did, or he is lying. If someone tells me the sky is green I will call bullshit.

You offered to prove you have a stash of kit in your warehouse. You didn't attempt to prove that there isn't some issue with ordering/receiving kit. Because you cant. The issue maybe as simple as @canefan 's mate's boss/logistics guy being misinformed, or incompetent. Or something else entirely.

But no, you're convinced that @canefan or his mate is a liar - get out the pitchforks!!!

To what end would @canefan be lying to us? To impress his internet buddies??? Why would his mate lie? To cause more panic in the system that he works in???

But whatever Baron, keep believing what you want and arrogantly accusing folk of lying. Take your comfort in the pages of Breitbart and rest easy.

I am not inside canefans head or his mates, who knows why they spouted such bullshit. But the fact remains that there is no issue with any DHB getting the PPE it needs at the moment. I know this as if it was needed there would be more movement in my warehouse, and when I asked them they wouldn't have said the exact opposite of Canefans mate.

There is no issue with getting current stocks to DHB's, and there is no shortage in stock. Could that change? Absolutely. But Canefans mate was talking about the current situation.
At least try and engage your brain, you seriously think that if the main wuflu centre couldn't access the PPE it needed, it would not be big news? Seriously? Yeah I can see journalists just ignoring that as not important.... the journos would be all over that like flies on shite. If canefan, his mate or you seriously believe that.. get the info to the news, seems a huge deal. But you wont because you know you are posturing over something you know is bullshit.

Remember what he said

"They are still waiting for supplies of the right PPE and Middlemore is the covid centre for Auckland."

That is just a complete lie. All DHB's have supplies of the right PPE.

Thanks for this. I'm sure I'm better for it. I'll try to engage my brain more, that's a great idea.

Learn something new everyday at the Fern huh?

Apology accepted, do better next time. A good clue is that if Hawkes fans are supporting your position, you need to reconsider, they are not the smartest bunch.

@voodoo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@voodoo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@canefan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@canefan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@canefan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Kirwan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Machpants said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

Possibly, but when you look at Italy etc, the long term damage there is going to be greater. Their lockdown, now, is even harder than ours because they started late. I'm hoping that at the end of this 4 weeks, NZ will be internally open, even if not to overseas, and we can get on with stuff.

If you are going to use the Italy extreme on one side , you have consider the German one on the other side.

It appears that we aren’t on the same path as Italy, and perhaps never were.

Considering our hospital system, and in particular the lack of ICU spots, would you be comfortable taking the chance? I spoke to my mate today. They are still waiting for supplies of the right PPE and Middlemore is the covid centre for Auckland. Even now, if it slides we are fucked, and the doctors and nurses who will try to manage the outbreak will literally be laying their lives on the line

Your mate is telling lies.

Who made you the Oracle? He is on the front line and doesn't have the protective gear he needs. He offered to bring his own but was told not to because it would panic the other staff.

Just because you didn't read it on Breitbart doesn't mean that it isn't happening. Or do you moonlight at the hospital so you saw it for yourself?

Because in my warehouse I have the local supply of gowns, visors, respirators, goggles, masks and overalls for DHB They have barely been touched and the warehouse and provisioning manager said that nobody is remotely short of PPE gear nationwide. And if our national centre for wuflu was short of equipment then it would be major news and easily resolved.
I am sceptical of your stories about a "mate".

Want proof? I can take photos of the pallets and pallets of PPE gear. Even write your name and place it on the photo.
You or your mate are full of shite.

Then why the fuck aren't people working in the hospitals getting this gear? These people are not ones to lie.

They are getting the gear when needed. Either you or your mate are lying

Wow, you're being next-level arrogant and rude today, even by your own standards. Leaping straight to "you or your mate are lying" rather than perhaps there is a disconnect at the hospital, logistics, supply chain, whatever.

Love the way you like to lecture others about "playing the man", then you come out with this sort of stuff

Because I know there is no disconnect in the supply chain in PPE for DHB's as I am in that exact supply chain. I offered po provide proof of this. It is simply a fact that either Canefans mate didnt say what canefan said he did, or he is lying. If someone tells me the sky is green I will call bullshit.

You offered to prove you have a stash of kit in your warehouse. You didn't attempt to prove that there isn't some issue with ordering/receiving kit. Because you cant. The issue maybe as simple as @canefan 's mate's boss/logistics guy being misinformed, or incompetent. Or something else entirely.

But no, you're convinced that @canefan or his mate is a liar - get out the pitchforks!!!

To what end would @canefan be lying to us? To impress his internet buddies??? Why would his mate lie? To cause more panic in the system that he works in???

But whatever Baron, keep believing what you want and arrogantly accusing folk of lying. Take your comfort in the pages of Breitbart and rest easy.

I am not inside canefans head or his mates, who knows why they spouted such bullshit. But the fact remains that there is no issue with any DHB getting the PPE it needs at the moment. I know this as if it was needed there would be more movement in my warehouse, and when I asked them they wouldn't have said the exact opposite of Canefans mate.

There is no issue with getting current stocks to DHB's, and there is no shortage in stock. Could that change? Absolutely. But Canefans mate was talking about the current situation.
At least try and engage your brain, you seriously think that if the main wuflu centre couldn't access the PPE it needed, it would not be big news? Seriously? Yeah I can see journalists just ignoring that as not important.... the journos would be all over that like flies on shite. If canefan, his mate or you seriously believe that.. get the info to the news, seems a huge deal. But you wont because you know you are posturing over something you know is bullshit.

Remember what he said

"They are still waiting for supplies of the right PPE and Middlemore is the covid centre for Auckland."

That is just a complete lie. All DHB's have supplies of the right PPE.

@voodoo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@canefan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@canefan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@canefan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Kirwan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Machpants said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

Possibly, but when you look at Italy etc, the long term damage there is going to be greater. Their lockdown, now, is even harder than ours because they started late. I'm hoping that at the end of this 4 weeks, NZ will be internally open, even if not to overseas, and we can get on with stuff.

If you are going to use the Italy extreme on one side , you have consider the German one on the other side.

It appears that we aren’t on the same path as Italy, and perhaps never were.

Considering our hospital system, and in particular the lack of ICU spots, would you be comfortable taking the chance? I spoke to my mate today. They are still waiting for supplies of the right PPE and Middlemore is the covid centre for Auckland. Even now, if it slides we are fucked, and the doctors and nurses who will try to manage the outbreak will literally be laying their lives on the line

Your mate is telling lies.

Who made you the Oracle? He is on the front line and doesn't have the protective gear he needs. He offered to bring his own but was told not to because it would panic the other staff.

Just because you didn't read it on Breitbart doesn't mean that it isn't happening. Or do you moonlight at the hospital so you saw it for yourself?

Because in my warehouse I have the local supply of gowns, visors, respirators, goggles, masks and overalls for DHB They have barely been touched and the warehouse and provisioning manager said that nobody is remotely short of PPE gear nationwide. And if our national centre for wuflu was short of equipment then it would be major news and easily resolved.
I am sceptical of your stories about a "mate".

Want proof? I can take photos of the pallets and pallets of PPE gear. Even write your name and place it on the photo.
You or your mate are full of shite.

Then why the fuck aren't people working in the hospitals getting this gear? These people are not ones to lie.

They are getting the gear when needed. Either you or your mate are lying

Wow, you're being next-level arrogant and rude today, even by your own standards. Leaping straight to "you or your mate are lying" rather than perhaps there is a disconnect at the hospital, logistics, supply chain, whatever.

Love the way you like to lecture others about "playing the man", then you come out with this sort of stuff

Because I know there is no disconnect in the supply chain in PPE for DHB's as I am in that exact supply chain. I offered po provide proof of this. It is simply a fact that either Canefans mate didnt say what canefan said he did, or he is lying. If someone tells me the sky is green I will call bullshit. Its almost as bad as when Hawkes fans claim they are not precious. Sometimes bullshit just has to be called out.

And besides I did allow for the fact that maybe canefan was just told bullshit. In fact my response was initially to say his mate was lying. He decided to double down.

@canefan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@canefan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@canefan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@canefan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Kirwan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Machpants said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

Possibly, but when you look at Italy etc, the long term damage there is going to be greater. Their lockdown, now, is even harder than ours because they started late. I'm hoping that at the end of this 4 weeks, NZ will be internally open, even if not to overseas, and we can get on with stuff.

If you are going to use the Italy extreme on one side , you have consider the German one on the other side.

It appears that we aren’t on the same path as Italy, and perhaps never were.

Considering our hospital system, and in particular the lack of ICU spots, would you be comfortable taking the chance? I spoke to my mate today. They are still waiting for supplies of the right PPE and Middlemore is the covid centre for Auckland. Even now, if it slides we are fucked, and the doctors and nurses who will try to manage the outbreak will literally be laying their lives on the line

Your mate is telling lies.

Who made you the Oracle? He is on the front line and doesn't have the protective gear he needs. He offered to bring his own but was told not to because it would panic the other staff.

Just because you didn't read it on Breitbart doesn't mean that it isn't happening. Or do you moonlight at the hospital so you saw it for yourself?

Because in my warehouse I have the local supply of gowns, visors, respirators, goggles, masks and overalls for DHB They have barely been touched and the warehouse and provisioning manager said that nobody is remotely short of PPE gear nationwide. And if our national centre for wuflu was short of equipment then it would be major news and easily resolved.
I am sceptical of your stories about a "mate".

Want proof? I can take photos of the pallets and pallets of PPE gear. Even write your name and place it on the photo.
You or your mate are full of shite.

Then why the fuck aren't people working in the hospitals getting this gear? These people are not ones to lie.

They are getting the gear when needed. Either you or your mate are lying

Well fuck you! But about the gear I'd love to buy N95 masks for work and if you know where these can be bought then great

No idea. Considering if I sold DHB PPE gear then I would be in a lot of trouble. I cannot get much for my staff, and that is annoying as I look out my window and see tens of thousands of PPE gear... water water everywhere...

Don't blame me because your story is bollox

@canefan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Old-Samurai-Jack said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@No-Quarter It is weird, isn't it? . Experts in infectious diseases from Korea/ Japan say maskes are essential and don't understand why medical experts from other countries say they are not. Now it looks like there is a bit of a u-turn from the naysayers. Here in Japan it is just common sense that people should wear them for protection and prevention. I don't know a thing about the medical field but when doctors and nurses won't go into a hospital without them but tell the public they aren't necessary, I get friggen suspicious!

There is a greater potential for exposure in hospital, and even higher when you are actually dealing with covid patients. The virus exists in aerosols and droplets which can easily find their way into your eyes, nose or mouth. That's why all the testing station staff wear gowns masks and visors

No way really???

There is no shortage of PPE gear at the moment, that's just a fact, one I offered to prove to you.

@canefan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@canefan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@canefan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Kirwan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Machpants said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

Possibly, but when you look at Italy etc, the long term damage there is going to be greater. Their lockdown, now, is even harder than ours because they started late. I'm hoping that at the end of this 4 weeks, NZ will be internally open, even if not to overseas, and we can get on with stuff.

If you are going to use the Italy extreme on one side , you have consider the German one on the other side.

It appears that we aren’t on the same path as Italy, and perhaps never were.

Considering our hospital system, and in particular the lack of ICU spots, would you be comfortable taking the chance? I spoke to my mate today. They are still waiting for supplies of the right PPE and Middlemore is the covid centre for Auckland. Even now, if it slides we are fucked, and the doctors and nurses who will try to manage the outbreak will literally be laying their lives on the line

Your mate is telling lies.

Who made you the Oracle? He is on the front line and doesn't have the protective gear he needs. He offered to bring his own but was told not to because it would panic the other staff.

Just because you didn't read it on Breitbart doesn't mean that it isn't happening. Or do you moonlight at the hospital so you saw it for yourself?

Because in my warehouse I have the local supply of gowns, visors, respirators, goggles, masks and overalls for DHB They have barely been touched and the warehouse and provisioning manager said that nobody is remotely short of PPE gear nationwide. And if our national centre for wuflu was short of equipment then it would be major news and easily resolved.
I am sceptical of your stories about a "mate".

Want proof? I can take photos of the pallets and pallets of PPE gear. Even write your name and place it on the photo.
You or your mate are full of shite.

Then why the fuck aren't people working in the hospitals getting this gear? These people are not ones to lie.

They are getting the gear when needed. Either you or your mate are lying

@canefan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@canefan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Kirwan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Machpants said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

Possibly, but when you look at Italy etc, the long term damage there is going to be greater. Their lockdown, now, is even harder than ours because they started late. I'm hoping that at the end of this 4 weeks, NZ will be internally open, even if not to overseas, and we can get on with stuff.

If you are going to use the Italy extreme on one side , you have consider the German one on the other side.

It appears that we aren’t on the same path as Italy, and perhaps never were.

Considering our hospital system, and in particular the lack of ICU spots, would you be comfortable taking the chance? I spoke to my mate today. They are still waiting for supplies of the right PPE and Middlemore is the covid centre for Auckland. Even now, if it slides we are fucked, and the doctors and nurses who will try to manage the outbreak will literally be laying their lives on the line

Your mate is telling lies.

Who made you the Oracle? He is on the front line and doesn't have the protective gear he needs. He offered to bring his own but was told not to because it would panic the other staff.

Just because you didn't read it on Breitbart doesn't mean that it isn't happening. Or do you moonlight at the hospital so you saw it for yourself?

Because in my warehouse I have the local supply of gowns, visors, respirators, goggles, masks and overalls for DHB They have barely been touched and the warehouse and provisioning manager said that nobody is remotely short of PPE gear nationwide. And if our national centre for wuflu was short of equipment then it would be major news and easily resolved.
I am sceptical of your stories about a "mate".

Want proof? I can take photos of the pallets and pallets of PPE gear. Even write your name and place it on the photo.
You or your mate are full of shite.

@canefan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Kirwan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

@Machpants said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:

Possibly, but when you look at Italy etc, the long term damage there is going to be greater. Their lockdown, now, is even harder than ours because they started late. I'm hoping that at the end of this 4 weeks, NZ will be internally open, even if not to overseas, and we can get on with stuff.

If you are going to use the Italy extreme on one side , you have consider the German one on the other side.

It appears that we aren’t on the same path as Italy, and perhaps never were.

Considering our hospital system, and in particular the lack of ICU spots, would you be comfortable taking the chance? I spoke to my mate today. They are still waiting for supplies of the right PPE and Middlemore is the covid centre for Auckland. Even now, if it slides we are fucked, and the doctors and nurses who will try to manage the outbreak will literally be laying their lives on the line

Your mate is telling lies.

I am hoping to be proved wrong, but I think the govt has fucked this up. This article sums alot of thoughts on the matter.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/120791273/coronavirus-health-is-important-but-it-cannot-be-the-governments-only-aim

I think as usual this govt just panicked and decided to govern by working group, and in this case the entire orking group were people who didnt care about the economy.