Coronavirus - Australia
-
@NTA said in Coronavirus - Australia:
@Nepia said in Coronavirus - Australia:
The Ayatollah Morrison has just announced a lockdown in all but name - “strong advice“:
No one should leave their home except for defined activities - shop for food, medical appointments, work if not possible to WFH, exercise.Public gatherings limited to 2.
He's a lot fucking clearer with his message tonight, as well.
Credit to him for starting to sharpen up on this.
I think it’s still all a bit wishy washy though - why are they avoiding the lockdown when they’re 90% of the way there? The UK and NZ examples show that people are still hopeless even with clear lockdowns. We’re currently no different than before except I can only talk to one mate in public at a time.
-
@Nepia said in Coronavirus - Australia:
I think it’s still all a bit wishy washy though - why are they avoiding the lockdown when they’re 90% of the way there? The UK and NZ examples show that people are still hopeless even with clear lockdowns. We’re currently no different than before except I can only talk to one mate in public at a time.
Because IMO a full lockdown would be disastrous for job losses. Think of all the people (esp in regional areas) working on building sites, roadworks, mowing lawns etc. The stuff that's 'non essential' but still quite safe and important for keeping $$$ in communities.
-
@barbarian said in Coronavirus - Australia:
Because IMO a full lockdown would be disastrous for job losses. Think of all the people (esp in regional areas) working on building sites, roadworks, mowing lawns etc. The stuff that's 'non essential' but still quite safe and important for keeping $$$ in communities.
I think we're already at "disastrous" based on what we've seen so far.
The Libs backed themselves into a corner on social support through successive years. The pandemic situation was a big enough mountain to climb without having to suddenly about-face on Newstart, Robodebt, etc.
It isn't going to be easy for a lot of people, even landlords. However, I would have limited sympathy for someone negatively gearing multiple properties or diving into some franking credits right now
-
@barbarian said in Coronavirus - Australia:
@Nepia said in Coronavirus - Australia:
I think it’s still all a bit wishy washy though - why are they avoiding the lockdown when they’re 90% of the way there? The UK and NZ examples show that people are still hopeless even with clear lockdowns. We’re currently no different than before except I can only talk to one mate in public at a time.
Because IMO a full lockdown would be disastrous for job losses. Think of all the people (esp in regional areas) working on building sites, roadworks, mowing lawns etc. The stuff that's 'non essential' but still quite safe and important for keeping $$$ in communities.
I think you are missing the fact that lock down is all but inevitable. So why drag it out longer than it has to be. Lock down hard, hope that everyone can get back to work sooner rather than later. Or risk delays that turn 4 or 6 weeks into 3 months
-
@canefan said in Coronavirus - Australia:
I think you are missing the fact that lock down is all but inevitable. So why drag it out longer than it has to be. Lock down hard, hope that everyone can get back to work sooner rather than later. Or risk delays that turn 4 or 6 weeks into 3 months
The dialogue is "up to 6 months" - they're using a classic corporate under-promise/over-deliver.
-
@NTA said in Coronavirus - Australia:
@canefan said in Coronavirus - Australia:
I think you are missing the fact that lock down is all but inevitable. So why drag it out longer than it has to be. Lock down hard, hope that everyone can get back to work sooner rather than later. Or risk delays that turn 4 or 6 weeks into 3 months
The dialogue is "up to 6 months" - they're using a classic corporate under-promise/over-deliver.
Cindy is using the reverse strategy here. Says it's 4 weeks, then she might extend it due to "new information" such as infection numbers that aren't favourable, by then everyone is used to the lock down idea
-
@canefan said in Coronavirus - Australia:
@NTA said in Coronavirus - Australia:
@canefan said in Coronavirus - Australia:
I think you are missing the fact that lock down is all but inevitable. So why drag it out longer than it has to be. Lock down hard, hope that everyone can get back to work sooner rather than later. Or risk delays that turn 4 or 6 weeks into 3 months
The dialogue is "up to 6 months" - they're using a classic corporate under-promise/over-deliver.
Cindy is using the reverse strategy here. Says it's 4 weeks, then she might extend it due to "new information" such as infection numbers that aren't favourable, by then everyone is used to the lock down idea
And TBH I prefer that: "4 weeks IF EVERYONE DOES THEIR FUCKING JOB" is how I take it.
-
@barbarian said in Coronavirus - Australia:
@Nepia said in Coronavirus - Australia:
I think it’s still all a bit wishy washy though - why are they avoiding the lockdown when they’re 90% of the way there? The UK and NZ examples show that people are still hopeless even with clear lockdowns. We’re currently no different than before except I can only talk to one mate in public at a time.
Because IMO a full lockdown would be disastrous for job losses. Think of all the people (esp in regional areas) working on building sites, roadworks, mowing lawns etc. The stuff that's 'non essential' but still quite safe and important for keeping $$$ in communities.
As @canefan says I think lockdown is inevitable, and we're getting closer and closer to it every day, but as that continues we increase the chance of community infection. But, I think not having clarity is the biggest issue, I just think people are more likely to ignore "strong advice" than directions from the govt.
It's already disastrous for job losses. Of my close knit Sydney friends there's already been four job losses (one of them worked for the Tahs so that was to be expected). I don't want any job losses obviously, but if it kicks off massively here in Sydney we're going to have those job losses anyway and the health system is going to take a battering.
-
I disagree with the notion that 'a lockdown is inevitable so just do it now'.
Firstly I'm not sure it is inevitable. It seems clear the Australian Government has received different advice to the NZ Government.
But more importantly the 'it's already bad for jobs, so what's a few more?' is a bit tough on the hundreds of thousands of people who are still in construction jobs. Or landscaping or mechanics or packing shelves at Bunnings.
I don't blame the Government for trying to keep as many people in jobs for as long as possible.
With our growth rate slowing, clearly something is working. It might not be slowing fast enough, but I'm not sure there's enough evidence the 'shut it down and it will all be sweet in four weeks' theory will work any better than our current strategy.
-
@barbarian said in Coronavirus - Australia:
I disagree with the notion that 'a lockdown is inevitable so just do it now'.
Firstly I'm not sure it is inevitable. It seems clear the Australian Government has received different advice to the NZ Government.
But more importantly the 'it's already bad for jobs, so what's a few more?' is a bit tough on the hundreds of thousands of people who are still in construction jobs. Or landscaping or mechanics or packing shelves at Bunnings.
I don't blame the Government for trying to keep as many people in jobs for as long as possible.
With our growth rate slowing, clearly something is working. It might not be slowing fast enough, but I'm not sure there's enough evidence the 'shut it down and it will all be sweet in four weeks' theory will work any better than our current strategy.
It's a big gamble. The only countries I can find that are not engaged in some sort of lockdown are Australia, the USA and the Netherlands (I must admit I didn't look very hard)
-
@canefan said in Coronavirus - Australia:
It's a big gamble. The only countries I can find that are not engaged in some sort of lockdown are Australia, the USA and the Netherlands (I must admit I didn't look very hard)
But broadly speaking we are in a lockdown. Could be splitting hairs, but... urged to stay in our homes and police have a broad range of enforcement powers to break up gatherings, move people on from public places etc.
-
@barbarian said in Coronavirus - Australia:
But more importantly the 'it's already bad for jobs, so what's a few more?'
That's bullshit, no one is saying that. No job losses are good, not the ones that have already been lost and not any that may be lost in the future.
@barbarian said in Coronavirus - Australia:
@canefan said in Coronavirus - Australia:
It's a big gamble. The only countries I can find that are not engaged in some sort of lockdown are Australia, the USA and the Netherlands (I must admit I didn't look very hard)
But broadly speaking we are in a lockdown. Could be splitting hairs, but... urged to stay in our homes and police have a broad range of enforcement powers to break up gatherings, move people on from public places etc.
This is part of the problem IMHO, if we are in lockdown then why aren't they saying we're in lockdown? They've given advice to not do a bunch of things, but tomorrow I can just say fuck it, they've only advised me to do this, they're not making me, II'll do grocery shopping and any other shopping if anythings open at the mall, I'll go off and buy a pot plant at Bunnings, visit a couple of mates at their houses, meet with one friend in Central Park. I can do all this currently. Hell, even if I was 75 I could still do all this. That's not a real lockdown.
This is good news though:
-
@canefan said in Coronavirus - Australia:
@NTA said in Coronavirus - Australia:
@canefan said in Coronavirus - Australia:
I think you are missing the fact that lock down is all but inevitable. So why drag it out longer than it has to be. Lock down hard, hope that everyone can get back to work sooner rather than later. Or risk delays that turn 4 or 6 weeks into 3 months
The dialogue is "up to 6 months" - they're using a classic corporate under-promise/over-deliver.
Cindy is using the reverse strategy here. Says it's 4 weeks, then she might extend it due to "new information" such as infection numbers that aren't favourable, by then everyone is used to the lock down idea
a "minimum" of four weeks
-
We're effectively in lock down.
Went for drive this arvo:
- Ms Boo Jr (Leaner driver) needed to get books out of her locker at school
- Mrs Boo needed to drop in to work to set up her new Acting GM's office.
(Mrs Boo is EA to GM at local private hospital. Have suggested to Mrs Boo that they will be swamped with the non-COVID cases from across the road, and that she's on the front line.)
Anyways, so little traffic. Went to Coles (No loo paper) and for veges and stuff. And there's nobody there.
I really don't see much difference to NZ's situation to what is happening here.
-
@booboo said in Coronavirus - Australia:
We're effectively in lock down.
Went for drive this arvo:
- Ms Boo Jr (Leaner driver) needed to get books out of her locker at school
- Mrs Boo needed to drop in to work to set up her new Acting GM's office.
(Mrs Boo is EA to GM at local private hospital. Have suggested to Mrs Boo that they will be swamped with the non-COVID cases from across the road, and that she's on the front line.)
Anyways, so little traffic. Went to Coles (No loo paper) and for veges and stuff. And there's nobody there.
I really don't see much difference to NZ's situation to what is happening here.
Sounds promising
-
@canefan said in Coronavirus - Australia:
@Nepia you hit the nail on the head. Until you call it a lockdown many people won't take it seriously. It won't stop the hardcore few but you just need people to get on board and realize they don't have a choice
It's hard to take any of this seriously when people advocate the destruction of our economy and the associated mental health damage because after two months Australia has recorded 18 deaths and less than 4000 confirmed cases (as of 1500h today). https://www.health.gov.au/news/health-alerts/novel-coronavirus-2019-ncov-health-alert/coronavirus-covid-19-current-situation-and-case-numbers#in-australia
Meanwhile cardiovascular disease accounts for a quarter of all deaths in this country and a million hospitalisations, per year.
What we should have been doing is strenuously pointing out that we should avoid old people so as not to give the weak exposure to the virus. Instead we're locking ourselves up for the foreseeable future only to kick the can down the road.
This country has lost the fucking plot and I'm seeing a pattern here: Despite being in the top 0.1% of all humans who have ever lived in terms of health, life expectancy and standard of living, people are increasingly fatalistic and given to pessimism. We've only just got over the "worst ever fire season" despite it being nothing of the fucking sort. Now we've got something else to run around crying the sky is falling.
Perhaps we all just got sick of waiting for nuclear war and the climate change apocalypse, so any panic will do.