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@Damo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@voodoo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Damo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@taniwharugby said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Damo I also think that different societies/cultures behave differently and what works for one won't necessarily work somewhere else.
I reckon adding the long weekend to our lockdown shows our Govt. thinks we need to be hand held through this.
Agree first paragraph. Some societies don't need strict rules to ensure that the population acts appropriately to look after it's vulnerable people. Other societies need strong government rule, otherwise it's every body for themselves.
I agree with the govt on your second paragraph. We do.
More to the point, I also think a few extra days has allowed businesses to plan for how they will function in level 3. If they announced on Monday that we're into level 3 on Wednesday, some businesses might not have planned properly. My office is a case in point. We are ready to go tomorrow, on Wednesday we wouldn't have been.
What would be worse for the economy is level 3 being a disaster, and having to return to level 4.
I really struggle with this attitude, and quite honestly it makes me pretty angry. Who the hell decided we needed hand holding for a long weekend? And what have them the right to make that decision? The government stole 4 trading days from business who were ready to go.
The fact that your business wouldn't have been ready is totally on you, and absolutely not the fault of every other business that was more prepared.
If you're not ready to open, then don't fucking open. We trust people and businesses every day to obey a large list of laws and regulations. Operating under L3 guidelines is just another one, and we shouldn't hold the entire economy hostage because a few businesses can't be trusted.
Well I don't trust businesses who aren't ready to open not to open. It's great that you do, but I don't know what you base that on.
For us it's no big deal, our only public facing aspect at the moment is in court, and only some hearings are done in person most aren't.
What worries me, and no doubt worried the government is the businesses who are public facing and would open without much thought for others.
The other thing that worries me is that you say you are angry about it. Don't get angry about someone else having a different view to you mate. That is just silly.
Seriously, if something someone posts in a very civil political debate makes you angry, perhaps you shouldn't partake in political discussions online. Reasonable people can disagree on this sort of stuff.
It was your attitude that made me angry - you're not ready so the whole economy should wait for you. Pretty selfish IMO, and yeah, makes me pretty frustrated.
You may not don't trust others to act within the law, but where do you draw that line? Do you trust them to pay taxes? To follow OH&S guidelines?
The arbitrary extension for the long weekend was nothing to do with giving business more time anyway as they could have announced a week earlier that the original end date was going to be maintained. It was purely a government overreaching and taking away personal liberties for their agenda.
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Hearing from friends in the UK and Ireland, they are facing long lockdowns right now. My colleague in Ireland said that there is talk that pubs in Ireland won't open until late this year 😱. Not sure how likely that is. Another guy is a dentist outside London. He expects to be off work much longer than us
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@canefan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
Hearing from friends in the UK and Ireland, they are facing long lockdowns right now. My colleague in Ireland said that there is talk that pubs in Ireland won't open until late this year 😱. Not sure how likely that is. Another guy is a dentist outside London. He expects to be off work much longer than us
Ireland has been hit pretty hard haven’t they?
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@voodoo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Damo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@voodoo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Damo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@taniwharugby said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Damo I also think that different societies/cultures behave differently and what works for one won't necessarily work somewhere else.
I reckon adding the long weekend to our lockdown shows our Govt. thinks we need to be hand held through this.
Agree first paragraph. Some societies don't need strict rules to ensure that the population acts appropriately to look after it's vulnerable people. Other societies need strong government rule, otherwise it's every body for themselves.
I agree with the govt on your second paragraph. We do.
More to the point, I also think a few extra days has allowed businesses to plan for how they will function in level 3. If they announced on Monday that we're into level 3 on Wednesday, some businesses might not have planned properly. My office is a case in point. We are ready to go tomorrow, on Wednesday we wouldn't have been.
What would be worse for the economy is level 3 being a disaster, and having to return to level 4.
I really struggle with this attitude, and quite honestly it makes me pretty angry. Who the hell decided we needed hand holding for a long weekend? And what have them the right to make that decision? The government stole 4 trading days from business who were ready to go.
The fact that your business wouldn't have been ready is totally on you, and absolutely not the fault of every other business that was more prepared.
If you're not ready to open, then don't fucking open. We trust people and businesses every day to obey a large list of laws and regulations. Operating under L3 guidelines is just another one, and we shouldn't hold the entire economy hostage because a few businesses can't be trusted.
Well I don't trust businesses who aren't ready to open not to open. It's great that you do, but I don't know what you base that on.
For us it's no big deal, our only public facing aspect at the moment is in court, and only some hearings are done in person most aren't.
What worries me, and no doubt worried the government is the businesses who are public facing and would open without much thought for others.
The other thing that worries me is that you say you are angry about it. Don't get angry about someone else having a different view to you mate. That is just silly.
Seriously, if something someone posts in a very civil political debate makes you angry, perhaps you shouldn't partake in political discussions online. Reasonable people can disagree on this sort of stuff.
It was your attitude that made me angry - you're not ready so the whole economy should wait for you. Pretty selfish IMO, and yeah, makes me pretty frustrated.
You may not don't trust others to act within the law, but where do you draw that line? Do you trust them to pay taxes? To follow OH&S guidelines?
The arbitrary extension for the long weekend was nothing to do with giving business more time anyway as they could have announced a week earlier that the original end date was going to be maintained. It was purely a government overreaching and taking away personal liberties for their agenda.
Mate you shouldn't ever get angry at someone who posts on a sports forum. I repeat that is extremely unhealthy and you should probably walk away if you are angry. I also think it's borderline to go around calling other people selfish because they have a different perspective to you.
I invite you to edit your post and remove the inappropriate language.
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@canefan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
Hearing from friends in the UK and Ireland, they are facing long lockdowns right now. My colleague in Ireland said that there is talk that pubs in Ireland won't open until late this year 😱. Not sure how likely that is. Another guy is a dentist outside London. He expects to be off work much longer than us
Yeah. My son is still in London and doing his best to adjust his work accordingly but the situation there is quite a shambles. The buy-in from the population is nowhere near as complete as some countries and the spread is wide. It is going to take quite some time to find a safe way out.
NB: there is the slim chance that the virus could burn itself out, which for their sake I really hope happens. -
@Damo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
More to the point, I also think a few extra days has allowed businesses to plan for how they will function in level 3. If they announced on Monday that we're into level 3 on Wednesday, some businesses might not have planned properly. My office is a case in point. We are ready to go tomorrow, on Wednesday we wouldn't have been.
Am I right in thinking you work for a law firm? Why weren't you ready to go?
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@Damo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@voodoo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Damo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@voodoo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Damo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@taniwharugby said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Damo I also think that different societies/cultures behave differently and what works for one won't necessarily work somewhere else.
I reckon adding the long weekend to our lockdown shows our Govt. thinks we need to be hand held through this.
Agree first paragraph. Some societies don't need strict rules to ensure that the population acts appropriately to look after it's vulnerable people. Other societies need strong government rule, otherwise it's every body for themselves.
I agree with the govt on your second paragraph. We do.
More to the point, I also think a few extra days has allowed businesses to plan for how they will function in level 3. If they announced on Monday that we're into level 3 on Wednesday, some businesses might not have planned properly. My office is a case in point. We are ready to go tomorrow, on Wednesday we wouldn't have been.
What would be worse for the economy is level 3 being a disaster, and having to return to level 4.
I really struggle with this attitude, and quite honestly it makes me pretty angry. Who the hell decided we needed hand holding for a long weekend? And what have them the right to make that decision? The government stole 4 trading days from business who were ready to go.
The fact that your business wouldn't have been ready is totally on you, and absolutely not the fault of every other business that was more prepared.
If you're not ready to open, then don't fucking open. We trust people and businesses every day to obey a large list of laws and regulations. Operating under L3 guidelines is just another one, and we shouldn't hold the entire economy hostage because a few businesses can't be trusted.
Well I don't trust businesses who aren't ready to open not to open. It's great that you do, but I don't know what you base that on.
For us it's no big deal, our only public facing aspect at the moment is in court, and only some hearings are done in person most aren't.
What worries me, and no doubt worried the government is the businesses who are public facing and would open without much thought for others.
The other thing that worries me is that you say you are angry about it. Don't get angry about someone else having a different view to you mate. That is just silly.
Seriously, if something someone posts in a very civil political debate makes you angry, perhaps you shouldn't partake in political discussions online. Reasonable people can disagree on this sort of stuff.
It was your attitude that made me angry - you're not ready so the whole economy should wait for you. Pretty selfish IMO, and yeah, makes me pretty frustrated.
You may not don't trust others to act within the law, but where do you draw that line? Do you trust them to pay taxes? To follow OH&S guidelines?
The arbitrary extension for the long weekend was nothing to do with giving business more time anyway as they could have announced a week earlier that the original end date was going to be maintained. It was purely a government overreaching and taking away personal liberties for their agenda.
Mate you shouldn't ever get angry at someone who posts on a sports forum. I repeat that is extremely unhealthy and you should probably walk away if you are angry. I also think it's borderline to go around calling other people selfish because they have a different perspective to you.
I invite you to edit your post and remove the inappropriate language.
You obviously haven't been hanging around on the fern long enough to tackle with one of the guys who used to post here. That was nothing compared to receiving a lashing from him!
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@Damo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@voodoo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Damo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@voodoo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Damo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@taniwharugby said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Damo I also think that different societies/cultures behave differently and what works for one won't necessarily work somewhere else.
I reckon adding the long weekend to our lockdown shows our Govt. thinks we need to be hand held through this.
Agree first paragraph. Some societies don't need strict rules to ensure that the population acts appropriately to look after it's vulnerable people. Other societies need strong government rule, otherwise it's every body for themselves.
I agree with the govt on your second paragraph. We do.
More to the point, I also think a few extra days has allowed businesses to plan for how they will function in level 3. If they announced on Monday that we're into level 3 on Wednesday, some businesses might not have planned properly. My office is a case in point. We are ready to go tomorrow, on Wednesday we wouldn't have been.
What would be worse for the economy is level 3 being a disaster, and having to return to level 4.
I really struggle with this attitude, and quite honestly it makes me pretty angry. Who the hell decided we needed hand holding for a long weekend? And what have them the right to make that decision? The government stole 4 trading days from business who were ready to go.
The fact that your business wouldn't have been ready is totally on you, and absolutely not the fault of every other business that was more prepared.
If you're not ready to open, then don't fucking open. We trust people and businesses every day to obey a large list of laws and regulations. Operating under L3 guidelines is just another one, and we shouldn't hold the entire economy hostage because a few businesses can't be trusted.
Well I don't trust businesses who aren't ready to open not to open. It's great that you do, but I don't know what you base that on.
For us it's no big deal, our only public facing aspect at the moment is in court, and only some hearings are done in person most aren't.
What worries me, and no doubt worried the government is the businesses who are public facing and would open without much thought for others.
The other thing that worries me is that you say you are angry about it. Don't get angry about someone else having a different view to you mate. That is just silly.
Seriously, if something someone posts in a very civil political debate makes you angry, perhaps you shouldn't partake in political discussions online. Reasonable people can disagree on this sort of stuff.
It was your attitude that made me angry - you're not ready so the whole economy should wait for you. Pretty selfish IMO, and yeah, makes me pretty frustrated.
You may not don't trust others to act within the law, but where do you draw that line? Do you trust them to pay taxes? To follow OH&S guidelines?
The arbitrary extension for the long weekend was nothing to do with giving business more time anyway as they could have announced a week earlier that the original end date was going to be maintained. It was purely a government overreaching and taking away personal liberties for their agenda.
Mate you shouldn't ever get angry at someone who posts on a sports forum. I repeat that is extremely unhealthy and you should probably walk away if you are angry. I also think it's borderline to go around calling other people selfish because they have a different perspective to you.
I invite you to edit your post and remove the inappropriate language.
🤣 that made me laugh. I'm sure the mods will do their thing if they think I've been innapropriate.
If I misinterpreted your attitude, that you support the extension because it gave less-prepared businesses like yours time to get ready, at the expense of the rest of the economy, then sure, I'm sorry for that. But if I understood you correctly (and note that you haven't clarified or corrected me) , then yeah I find your attitude selfish. I'm not apologising for that.
As for my anger, you don't have to worry about me - I'm not stomping around the house punching the walls. I'm just "internet" angry, venting into my phone keyboard.
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@voodoo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Damo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@voodoo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Damo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@voodoo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Damo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@taniwharugby said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Damo I also think that different societies/cultures behave differently and what works for one won't necessarily work somewhere else.
I reckon adding the long weekend to our lockdown shows our Govt. thinks we need to be hand held through this.
Agree first paragraph. Some societies don't need strict rules to ensure that the population acts appropriately to look after it's vulnerable people. Other societies need strong government rule, otherwise it's every body for themselves.
I agree with the govt on your second paragraph. We do.
More to the point, I also think a few extra days has allowed businesses to plan for how they will function in level 3. If they announced on Monday that we're into level 3 on Wednesday, some businesses might not have planned properly. My office is a case in point. We are ready to go tomorrow, on Wednesday we wouldn't have been.
What would be worse for the economy is level 3 being a disaster, and having to return to level 4.
I really struggle with this attitude, and quite honestly it makes me pretty angry. Who the hell decided we needed hand holding for a long weekend? And what have them the right to make that decision? The government stole 4 trading days from business who were ready to go.
The fact that your business wouldn't have been ready is totally on you, and absolutely not the fault of every other business that was more prepared.
If you're not ready to open, then don't fucking open. We trust people and businesses every day to obey a large list of laws and regulations. Operating under L3 guidelines is just another one, and we shouldn't hold the entire economy hostage because a few businesses can't be trusted.
Well I don't trust businesses who aren't ready to open not to open. It's great that you do, but I don't know what you base that on.
For us it's no big deal, our only public facing aspect at the moment is in court, and only some hearings are done in person most aren't.
What worries me, and no doubt worried the government is the businesses who are public facing and would open without much thought for others.
The other thing that worries me is that you say you are angry about it. Don't get angry about someone else having a different view to you mate. That is just silly.
Seriously, if something someone posts in a very civil political debate makes you angry, perhaps you shouldn't partake in political discussions online. Reasonable people can disagree on this sort of stuff.
It was your attitude that made me angry - you're not ready so the whole economy should wait for you. Pretty selfish IMO, and yeah, makes me pretty frustrated.
You may not don't trust others to act within the law, but where do you draw that line? Do you trust them to pay taxes? To follow OH&S guidelines?
The arbitrary extension for the long weekend was nothing to do with giving business more time anyway as they could have announced a week earlier that the original end date was going to be maintained. It was purely a government overreaching and taking away personal liberties for their agenda.
Mate you shouldn't ever get angry at someone who posts on a sports forum. I repeat that is extremely unhealthy and you should probably walk away if you are angry. I also think it's borderline to go around calling other people selfish because they have a different perspective to you.
I invite you to edit your post and remove the inappropriate language.
🤣 that made me laugh. I'm sure the mods will do their thing if they think I've been innapropriate.
If I misinterpreted your attitude, that you support the extension because it gave less-prepared businesses like yours time to get ready, at the expense of the rest of the economy, then sure, I'm sorry for that. But if I understood you correctly (and note that you haven't clarified or corrected me) , then yeah I find your attitude selfish. I'm not apologising for that.
As for my anger, you don't have to worry about me - I'm not stomping around the house punching the walls. I'm just "internet" angry, venting into my phone keyboard.
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@voodoo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
that made me laugh. I'm sure the mods will do their thing if they think I've been innapropriate.
I actually pay here so that I can say "fuck" when it suits me.
Maybe we need a swear box for those that don't contribute.
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@Toddy said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Damo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
More to the point, I also think a few extra days has allowed businesses to plan for how they will function in level 3. If they announced on Monday that we're into level 3 on Wednesday, some businesses might not have planned properly. My office is a case in point. We are ready to go tomorrow, on Wednesday we wouldn't have been.
Am I right in thinking you work for a law firm? Why weren't you ready to go?
Well for one thing we were waiting for guidance from the courts as to what would happen with hearings/conferences. We kept getting mixed signals about what sorts of stuff would be operating and what wouldn't. Nobody is still quite sure what is happening with short cause stuff, except that it has to be done in person. (What about, for example the 65 year old lawyer who doesn't want to, or the 70 year old witness who has to attend?). We also have a high percentage of elderly staff.
Ultimately it makes little difference to us because we aren't currently public facing. A cafe or restaurant wondering about how to operate with remote delivery is in a different position. I note that even McDonalds is being criticised for it's current plans.
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Even the WHO don't know for sure if everyone who has CV-19 is immune to getting it again. In light of that, caution is prudent and, to me at least, understandable.
Purely anecdotal, so take it with a grain (or full bag) of salt, but I worked in fast food for 10 years, and have been a union delegate in the public service for the past 5 years. I attend regular interagency delegate meetings here in Christchurch and have done since becoming a delegate, originally regarding the Canterbury earthquakes, and more recently the Mosque shooting, and virtually throughout the lockdown. In that time, it has been abundantly clear that even the state sector are more interested in operations than safety, no matter how much they pontificate to the contrary. The state-funded sector (e.g. NGOs with a contract for state services) is even worse.
My time in fast food was worse again - I was a store manager at Domino's during the Canterbury earthquakes, and we reopened on the same day as the September quake, and the next day following the February quake i.e. missed one day trading in all that that time and all those earthquakes. They did their best to follow the rules, but it's heavily dependent on staff and their managers who are mostly teenagers and 20-somethings. That doesn't sound that bad after an earthquake, but there was a major public health concern around water and sewage (like all bread, pizza dough has water in it).
That's with a franchise behind them creating operating plans with the best legal guidance. I shudder to think what small independents will be like, or owner-operators who are desperate to open and make money regardless of the rules. Agree that in an ideal world, outfits would not reopen until they were ready and we could have opened the doors last week, but that desperation would have meant places would have opened even if they weren't ready, and staff would have been pressured into attending work whether they legally should have or not.
Also, that's why it's a 12 week wage subsidy - gives the government a range of time frames if necessary.
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@voodoo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Damo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@voodoo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Damo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@voodoo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Damo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@taniwharugby said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Damo I also think that different societies/cultures behave differently and what works for one won't necessarily work somewhere else.
I reckon adding the long weekend to our lockdown shows our Govt. thinks we need to be hand held through this.
Agree first paragraph. Some societies don't need strict rules to ensure that the population acts appropriately to look after it's vulnerable people. Other societies need strong government rule, otherwise it's every body for themselves.
I agree with the govt on your second paragraph. We do.
More to the point, I also think a few extra days has allowed businesses to plan for how they will function in level 3. If they announced on Monday that we're into level 3 on Wednesday, some businesses might not have planned properly. My office is a case in point. We are ready to go tomorrow, on Wednesday we wouldn't have been.
What would be worse for the economy is level 3 being a disaster, and having to return to level 4.
I really struggle with this attitude, and quite honestly it makes me pretty angry. Who the hell decided we needed hand holding for a long weekend? And what have them the right to make that decision? The government stole 4 trading days from business who were ready to go.
The fact that your business wouldn't have been ready is totally on you, and absolutely not the fault of every other business that was more prepared.
If you're not ready to open, then don't fucking open. We trust people and businesses every day to obey a large list of laws and regulations. Operating under L3 guidelines is just another one, and we shouldn't hold the entire economy hostage because a few businesses can't be trusted.
Well I don't trust businesses who aren't ready to open not to open. It's great that you do, but I don't know what you base that on.
For us it's no big deal, our only public facing aspect at the moment is in court, and only some hearings are done in person most aren't.
What worries me, and no doubt worried the government is the businesses who are public facing and would open without much thought for others.
The other thing that worries me is that you say you are angry about it. Don't get angry about someone else having a different view to you mate. That is just silly.
Seriously, if something someone posts in a very civil political debate makes you angry, perhaps you shouldn't partake in political discussions online. Reasonable people can disagree on this sort of stuff.
It was your attitude that made me angry - you're not ready so the whole economy should wait for you. Pretty selfish IMO, and yeah, makes me pretty frustrated.
You may not don't trust others to act within the law, but where do you draw that line? Do you trust them to pay taxes? To follow OH&S guidelines?
The arbitrary extension for the long weekend was nothing to do with giving business more time anyway as they could have announced a week earlier that the original end date was going to be maintained. It was purely a government overreaching and taking away personal liberties for their agenda.
Mate you shouldn't ever get angry at someone who posts on a sports forum. I repeat that is extremely unhealthy and you should probably walk away if you are angry. I also think it's borderline to go around calling other people selfish because they have a different perspective to you.
I invite you to edit your post and remove the inappropriate language.
🤣 that made me laugh. I'm sure the mods will do their thing if they think I've been innapropriate.
If I misinterpreted your attitude, that you support the extension because it gave less-prepared businesses like yours time to get ready, at the expense of the rest of the economy, then sure, I'm sorry for that. But if I understood you correctly (and note that you haven't clarified or corrected me) , then yeah I find your attitude selfish. I'm not apologising for that.
As for my anger, you don't have to worry about me - I'm not stomping around the house punching the walls. I'm just "internet" angry, venting into my phone keyboard.
Yeah I just think that the current risk averse approach of the government is good. You clearly don't.
I think it is better to go slowly and ensure we avoid a longer than necessary lockdown, than risk having to go backwards. That would in my estimation be significantly worse for the economy not least because it would make people distrustful of the next time we relaxed. The last thing we want is people too afraid to go outside. Most of these businesses that are opening up need customers to function, regardless of what the laws are.
Makes not much difference to me because the business I work at is not really public facing (for clarity it's not my business). Lots of businesses are public facing and these sorts of things are difficult for them to navigate.
Hardly selfish on my part because I am thinking about others who are more vulnerable to the disease than me. That sort of loaded language diminishes political discussions and is unhelpful.
I am sure we all believe that we are expressing reasonable viewpoints, otherwise we would be expressing different views. I didn't ask you to apologise, that would be silly.
I just wondered if you might reflect whether calling someone selfish for expressing a different view to yours is helpful. Laugh if you want but that seems an odd position to take. -
@Damo all things considered my opinion is we did what we had to do. Protect our fragile resources from a covid tidal wave. It is more challenging now, balancing continued caution with a desire to allow the economy to restart. Whichever way they decide I am sure there will be people unhappy with how the government are handling it
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@canefan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Damo all things considered my opinion is we did what we had to do. Protect our fragile resources from a covid tidal wave. It is more challenging now, balancing continued caution with a desire to allow the economy to restart. Whichever way they decide I am sure there will be people unhappy with how the government are handling it
I agree.
My understanding is that most of the debate is about whether we should have gone to L3 on Thursday last week or on Tuesday after a long weekend. Pretty minor issue in the scheme of things.
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@canefan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Damo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@voodoo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Damo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@voodoo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Damo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@taniwharugby said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Damo I also think that different societies/cultures behave differently and what works for one won't necessarily work somewhere else.
I reckon adding the long weekend to our lockdown shows our Govt. thinks we need to be hand held through this.
Agree first paragraph. Some societies don't need strict rules to ensure that the population acts appropriately to look after it's vulnerable people. Other societies need strong government rule, otherwise it's every body for themselves.
I agree with the govt on your second paragraph. We do.
More to the point, I also think a few extra days has allowed businesses to plan for how they will function in level 3. If they announced on Monday that we're into level 3 on Wednesday, some businesses might not have planned properly. My office is a case in point. We are ready to go tomorrow, on Wednesday we wouldn't have been.
What would be worse for the economy is level 3 being a disaster, and having to return to level 4.
I really struggle with this attitude, and quite honestly it makes me pretty angry. Who the hell decided we needed hand holding for a long weekend? And what have them the right to make that decision? The government stole 4 trading days from business who were ready to go.
The fact that your business wouldn't have been ready is totally on you, and absolutely not the fault of every other business that was more prepared.
If you're not ready to open, then don't fucking open. We trust people and businesses every day to obey a large list of laws and regulations. Operating under L3 guidelines is just another one, and we shouldn't hold the entire economy hostage because a few businesses can't be trusted.
Well I don't trust businesses who aren't ready to open not to open. It's great that you do, but I don't know what you base that on.
For us it's no big deal, our only public facing aspect at the moment is in court, and only some hearings are done in person most aren't.
What worries me, and no doubt worried the government is the businesses who are public facing and would open without much thought for others.
The other thing that worries me is that you say you are angry about it. Don't get angry about someone else having a different view to you mate. That is just silly.
Seriously, if something someone posts in a very civil political debate makes you angry, perhaps you shouldn't partake in political discussions online. Reasonable people can disagree on this sort of stuff.
It was your attitude that made me angry - you're not ready so the whole economy should wait for you. Pretty selfish IMO, and yeah, makes me pretty frustrated.
You may not don't trust others to act within the law, but where do you draw that line? Do you trust them to pay taxes? To follow OH&S guidelines?
The arbitrary extension for the long weekend was nothing to do with giving business more time anyway as they could have announced a week earlier that the original end date was going to be maintained. It was purely a government overreaching and taking away personal liberties for their agenda.
Mate you shouldn't ever get angry at someone who posts on a sports forum. I repeat that is extremely unhealthy and you should probably walk away if you are angry. I also think it's borderline to go around calling other people selfish because they have a different perspective to you.
I invite you to edit your post and remove the inappropriate language.
You obviously haven't been hanging around on the fern long enough to tackle with one of the guys who used to post here. That was nothing compared to receiving a lashing from him!
Well I normally post at Planet Rugby.
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@Damo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
Yeah I just think that the current risk averse approach of the government is good. You clearly don't.
I think it is better to go slowly and ensure we avoid a longer than necessary lockdown, than risk having to go backwards. That would in my estimation be significantly worse for the economy not least because it would make people distrustful of the next time we relaxed. The last thing we want is people too afraid to go outside. Most of these businesses that are opening up need customers to function, regardless of what the laws are.
I have no issue with your viewpoint here, I certainly disagree, but you're entitled to think this
Hardly selfish on my part because I am thinking about others who are more vulnerable to the disease than me. That sort of loaded language diminishes political discussions and is unhelpful.
I am sure we all believe that we are expressing reasonable viewpoints, otherwise we would be expressing different views. I didn't ask you to apologise, that would be silly.
I just wondered if you might reflect whether calling someone selfish for expressing a different view to yours is helpful. Laugh if you want but that seems an odd position to take.Your original post said that you supported the lockdown extension because it gave businesses (including yours) more time to get ready and this is the thought process that I consider selfish - it has nothing to do with you holding a different view. Again, if I misinterpreted your statement, then I'm sorry for that.
We had a clear, known date for lockdown to end, and all businesses should have been working towards that. Sure the details of what L3 would ultimately be were not all known, but I would suggest that social distancing, delivery only, and a lack of contact with customers would have been a fairly sensible assumption to make. 4 days of trading lost is not to be sneezed at - for many business who run tight, low-margin businesses, this can be make-or-break, especially after the 4 weeks leading in.
I'm going to leave this one here Damo, I don't particularly enjoy the back-and-forth arguments with individual posters - you seem like a reasonable dude, I'm sure we will find something to agree on and most likely disagree on again in the future!
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@voodoo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
We had a known potential date for lockdown to end, and all businesses should have been working towards that.
FIFY
It was pretty clearly stated all along that L4 was for an initial period to be re-assessed toward the end to decide what and how to do after that.
There was never a stated end that was then extended.
Many people I know expected that any reduction would probably make sense to happen after the long weekend, especially after seeing how some people reacted over Easter.
I think when the pros and cons of changing to L3 Tonight rather than last week were added up the former won out.
Coronavirus - New Zealand