2007 QF [split thread]



  • It's off topic. Again.

    But anyhow, why not just agree that neither toeava nor Guildford were up to much at AB level.

    Every time I see a possum in the headlights, I think Toeva + 2007.



  • @Billy-Tell said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

    Every time I see a possum in the headlights, I think Toeva + 2007.

    I see Brendon Leonard in that QF...



  • @Billy-Tell said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

    It's off topic. Again.

    But anyhow, why not just agree that neither toeava nor Guildford were up to much at AB level.

    Every time I see a possum in the headlights, I think Toeva + 2007.

    Toeava was outstanding in 2007 and subsequent to that. He won a MoTM in the centres, on the wing and at fullback in black.



  • @rotated said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

    @Billy-Tell said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

    It's off topic. Again.

    But anyhow, why not just agree that neither toeava nor Guildford were up to much at AB level.

    Every time I see a possum in the headlights, I think Toeva + 2007.

    Toeava was outstanding in 2007 and subsequent to that. He won a MoTM in the centres, on the wing and at fullback in black.

    I just remember him as decidely underwhelming. Probably biased by the 2007 quarter final.



  • @Billy-Tell said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

    I just remember him as decidely underwhelming. Probably biased by the 2007 quarter final.

    He did as much in his 9 minutes as could be expected.



  • @rotated said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

    @Billy-Tell said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

    I just remember him as decidely underwhelming. Probably biased by the 2007 quarter final.

    He did as much in his 9 minutes as could be expected.

    TBH, my memories of that game are watching it in a bar in Cork, with a sense of impending dread, while the Irish crowd was increasingly enjoying the spectacle.

    I've never watched the game again...so maybe Toeava was just fine in those 9 minutes as you say...



  • @kiwiinmelb said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

    he had his moments in his career , but would be a bit rough to point the finger at him in this game though, he was the least of our problems TBH .

    That picture of Carter on the sideline looking white... still haunts me.



  • @kiwiinmelb I was being facetious after an earlier comment dismissing Umaga as one of the best AB centres.

    And let's not keep bringing up a certain game in 2007 in this thread. I had tickets to the SF and final that I ended up selling. 😞



  • @kiwiinmelb said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

    @Bovidae said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

    @Nepia Don't forget that Mauger carried Umaga. 🙂

    I actually think they complimented each other pretty well , each sort of provided what the other lacked ,

    And funny enough , when Umaga retired , Mauger seem to slide out of favor ,

    Probably form as well but he didnt seem as appealing when paired with Conrad or Mils as he did with Tana IMO .

    Conrad and Mauger were extraordinary foils for Nonu/Umaga.A little like Osborne/Robertson. Had AM played in Cardiff instead of Luke we would have canter(bry)ed away with it.

    But Mauger/Smith were always going to be too samey to be a good pair.


  • Banned

    @nzzp said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

    @kiwiinmelb said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

    he had his moments in his career , but would be a bit rough to point the finger at him in this game though, he was the least of our problems TBH .

    That picture of Carter on the sideline looking white... still haunts me.

    I remember Anton Oliver's eyes. Full of fear is the only way to describe them.

    Fuck that was a terrible night.



  • @pakman said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

    @kiwiinmelb said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

    @Bovidae said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

    @Nepia Don't forget that Mauger carried Umaga. 🙂

    I actually think they complimented each other pretty well , each sort of provided what the other lacked ,

    And funny enough , when Umaga retired , Mauger seem to slide out of favor ,

    Probably form as well but he didnt seem as appealing when paired with Conrad or Mils as he did with Tana IMO .

    Conrad and Mauger were extraordinary foils for Nonu/Umaga.A little like Osborne/Robertson. Had AM played in Cardiff instead of Luke we would have canter(bry)ed away with it.

    But Mauger/Smith were always going to be too samey to be a good pair.

    That's bollocks, that gets rinsed and repeated every few years it seems. If Mauger had been a reserve he might have been able to influence the result with his leadership, he might have come on and set us for a drop goal, but it's doubtful he would have had the attacking influence that Lucky had that day.

    Also, Mils was the centre that day, not Conrad.



  • @Nepia said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

    @pakman said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

    @kiwiinmelb said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

    @Bovidae said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

    @Nepia Don't forget that Mauger carried Umaga. 🙂

    I actually think they complimented each other pretty well , each sort of provided what the other lacked ,

    And funny enough , when Umaga retired , Mauger seem to slide out of favor ,

    Probably form as well but he didnt seem as appealing when paired with Conrad or Mils as he did with Tana IMO .

    Conrad and Mauger were extraordinary foils for Nonu/Umaga.A little like Osborne/Robertson. Had AM played in Cardiff instead of Luke we would have canter(bry)ed away with it.

    But Mauger/Smith were always going to be too samey to be a good pair.

    That's bollocks, that gets rinsed and repeated every few years it seems. If Mauger had been a reserve he might have been able to influence the result with his leadership, he might have come on and set us for a drop goal, but it's doubtful he would have had the attacking influence that Lucky had that day.

    Also, Mils was the centre that day, not Conrad.

    Lucky was a liability from 35 minutes on. Our 9/10/12 had a combined IQ of 120 for much of the second half. AM would have doubled that had he come on. Things were crying out for a wise head.

    Smith comment was generic. His light was still under a bushel at that stage. Then again, this had given some indication of what was to come:



  • what is this game you all speak of with such great knowledge?



  • McAlister not unlike Spencer in 2003 actually had the temerity to set up a brilliant try under tremendous pressure and was probably the best back on the field. This doesn't stop the anti-Blues crowd from banging the drum for both though...

    If our 9-10-12 had an IQ of 120 for the second half - I'd hate to see your assessment of Ellis-Carter-Nonu who manufactured nothing in the 2011 final.



  • @rotated said in 2007 QF [split thread]:

    McAlister not unlike Spencer in 2003 actually had the temerity to set up a brilliant try under tremendous pressure and was probably the best back on the field. This doesn't stop the anti-Blues crowd from banging the drum for both though...

    If our 9-10-12 had an IQ of 120 for the second half - I'd hate to see your assessment of Ellis-Carter-Nonu who manufactured nothing in the 2011 final.

    Carter? In the 2011 Final??



  • @Hooroo yea, he did fuck all. hopeless



  • @Hooroo said in 2007 QF [split thread]:

    @rotated said in 2007 QF [split thread]:

    McAlister not unlike Spencer in 2003 actually had the temerity to set up a brilliant try under tremendous pressure and was probably the best back on the field. This doesn't stop the anti-Blues crowd from banging the drum for both though...

    If our 9-10-12 had an IQ of 120 for the second half - I'd hate to see your assessment of Ellis-Carter-Nonu who manufactured nothing in the 2011 final.

    Carter? In the 2011 Final??

    Wow, completely forgot about that injury and I was at the game. Not going to live that one down.

    Well I don't think many would argue that if Ma'a Nonu has the best rugby IQ in your 9-10-12 axis you are in trouble.



  • @rotated said in 2007 QF [split thread]:

    McAlister not unlike Spencer in 2003 actually had the temerity to set up a brilliant try under tremendous pressure and was probably the best back on the field. This doesn't stop the anti-Blues crowd from banging the drum for both though...

    If our 9-10-12 had an IQ of 120 for the second half - I'd hate to see your assessment of Ellis-Carter-Nonu who manufactured nothing in the 2011 final.

    Lu cky was excellent in first 35. But not a good man in the crunch. Byron and Lucky didn't contribute much of the 120. You need a good brain there to execute. IMO AM and Conrad were both guys who picked good options and who made the athletes around them (Lucky and Nonu, for example) much more deadly.



  • @rotated 2011 was all Dagg's fault anyway.

    And i blame Leon MacDonald for 2003 and 2007...

    People try to blame Goldie for '99, but I won't hear a bad word against him, so i blame Hart.

    '95 was a collective stitch up, from politics to bookies. Can't blame anyone except external nefarious entities.

    '91 was also Hart's fault...



  • @Billy-Tell said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

    It's off topic. Again.

    But anyhow, why not just agree that neither toeava nor Guildford were up to much at AB level.

    Every time I see a possum in the headlights, I think Toeva + 2007.

    Sorry but I call Bullshit on that. Guilford yes but no way can you say that about Toeava!

    Toeava was very much up to AB Level. Sure in some of his early matches he was a little overawed but he grew into it and was certainly a worthy AB. Anyone who wins a man of the match award and came close on other occasions doesn't deserve such criticism.

    Cut down in his prime by a chronic hip injury which really hampered his RWC 2011 campaign.

    FYI... He was playing very well in France for Claremont before a season ending injury earlier this year.



  • @RoninWC I'm not even sure you can say it about Guildford. We all know that his mental health issues and resulting addictions are to blame for his disappearance from test and Super Rugby. There's simply no way of knowing how he would have developed as a test player without all those problems.

    Toeava indeed had some classy appearances for Clermont this year. I hope his next season for the club will be injury free, so he can get a real chance to show his talent and skills. He played mostly at fullback for them though, but may appear in the midfield more often this new season due to some other midfielders (Including Benson Stanley) leaving.



  • Shit's getting real when we're dredging up these games to extend the fighting over.

    Fucking fullbacks playing at centre! How many RWC's did it take coaches of the All Blacks - no less - to learn that lesson the 98th time?



  • I'm just glad this game is FINALLY getting some attention on TSF.



  • @barbarian 23 posts and no mention of #Wayne Barnes or #forwardpass



  • @taniwharugby i think we should discuss with @barbarian the real turning point of 2003, St George Smith cynically and sickeningly hitting Justin Marshall late, and taking him out of the game. Filthy cheaty convicts



  • @mariner4life

    I thought the turning point was a legit try being called a knock on just before that intercept



  • @Duluth fucking cheating fuckers so desperate for a NH champion they engineered getting a team in the final they knew couldn't beat England. That it was also the home team was just gravy for the IRB.

    And it still nearly backfired.



  • @taniwharugby said in 2007 QF [split thread]:

    what is this game you all speak of with such great knowledge?

    Hi all

    (I'm probably going to regret this, but it's late and I'm a bit drunk and the AB-Lions series is 1-1, so no time like the present ...)

    I was at the '99 game and the '07 game (as I dared to mention in my first post a month ago). Sport is a weird thing at times - there have been other tours since '71 that the Lions had a good chance of winning; maybe this is going to be one of those weird times.

    If if the Lions are within 4-8 points at 60 minutes, maybe there might be a certain type of throat noise ...?

    I watched the game last weekend in a pub in England - there were 2 Kiwis with AB shirts. I said to them at the end "You'll win next week".

    But as the week has gone on, the euphoric optimism of sport has made me think it is a 60/40 game in favour of the ABs.
    But that is close in a contact sport with an odd-shaped ball.
    Maybe, just maybe ...

    Yet another AB centre pairing ...
    A French ref ...
    A winner-takes-all game between 2 closely-matched teams (forget your opinion: the series is 1-1) - that is a scenario more familiar to NH teams,

    What was unthinkable 1 year ago, 1 month ago - it might just happen.

    2 sleeps to go. 12 years to wait for redemption.

    Enjoy!

    Cheers
    Megweya



  • @Megweya said in 2007 QF [split thread]:

    If if the Lions are within 4-8 points at 60 minutes, maybe there might be a certain type of throat noise ...?

    ah, beautiful. A choke joke. It's been a while my old friend.



  • @Megweya I hope it was you I spilled my beer on at Twickers in 99 😉



  • @mariner4life said in 2007 QF [split thread]:

    @Megweya said in 2007 QF [split thread]:

    If if the Lions are within 4-8 points at 60 minutes, maybe there might be a certain type of throat noise ...?

    ah, beautiful. A choke joke. It's been a while my old friend.

    I thought you had to win two World Cups in a row to be rid of that tag?

    South African Cricket team has some 'work-ons'



  • @mariner4life said in 2007 QF [split thread]:

    @Megweya said in 2007 QF [split thread]:

    If if the Lions are within 4-8 points at 60 minutes, maybe there might be a certain type of throat noise ...?

    ah, beautiful. A choke joke. It's been a while my old friend.

    After 2015 I thought we renamed it "doing a Lancaster"?



  • The only good thing that came out of the QF (Spits words out) was finding this place and the fellow tragics that exist here. I don't think I would have made it otherwise 😉



  • @barbarian said in 2007 QF [split thread]:

    I'm just glad this game is FINALLY getting some attention on TSF.

    What game?



  • The worst part of that night in Cardiff was depressingly getting back to my accommodation only to discover my lucky All Blacks boxers were on inside-out. Sorry team.



  • @pakman said in 2007 QF [split thread]:

    @Nepia said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

    @pakman said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

    @kiwiinmelb said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

    @Bovidae said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

    @Nepia Don't forget that Mauger carried Umaga. 🙂

    I actually think they complimented each other pretty well , each sort of provided what the other lacked ,

    And funny enough , when Umaga retired , Mauger seem to slide out of favor ,

    Probably form as well but he didnt seem as appealing when paired with Conrad or Mils as he did with Tana IMO .

    Conrad and Mauger were extraordinary foils for Nonu/Umaga.A little like Osborne/Robertson. Had AM played in Cardiff instead of Luke we would have canter(bry)ed away with it.

    But Mauger/Smith were always going to be too samey to be a good pair.

    That's bollocks, that gets rinsed and repeated every few years it seems. If Mauger had been a reserve he might have been able to influence the result with his leadership, he might have come on and set us for a drop goal, but it's doubtful he would have had the attacking influence that Lucky had that day.

    Also, Mils was the centre that day, not Conrad.

    Lucky was a liability from 35 minutes on. Our 9/10/12 had a combined IQ of 120 for much of the second half. AM would have doubled that had he come on. Things were crying out for a wise head.

    Smith comment was generic. His light was still under a bushel at that stage. Then again, this had given some indication of what was to come:

    That was an awesome display by ABs against a French team which on paper was not weak. Hayman/Grenadeface/Woodie tore Frog front row several new ones. Made me misty eyed to watch again!!



  • @nzzp said in 2007 QF [split thread]:

    @kiwiinmelb said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

    he had his moments in his career , but would be a bit rough to point the finger at him in this game though, he was the least of our problems TBH .

    That picture of Carter on the sideline looking white... still haunts me.

    He was injured and he could see it all going to the dogs. Mealamu trying to console him too.

    For me it was the looks on the faces of the cartel, especially Henry.



  • this is the one that gets me...and is quite possibly one of the triggers that preceeded the 2 pictured going on to greater things

    0_1499416011649_dd9b5c0e-d82d-4638-b0ab-3696882047ae-image.png



  • @Donsteppa hopefully it's a good omen, because I recall the same discussions on here before the 2011 WC final...



  • @taniwharugby McCaw said in his book he was just wiping away the sweat from his face momentarily, then instantly regretted it as he heard all the cameras click and realized that'd be the picture shown below all the headlines.


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