Coronavirus - Overall
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I was talking to Indian colleagues at morning tea. They are of the opinion that the numbers are 10 x worse than the official numbers, this has already been reported in media as possibly up to 10 x worse than official numbers when journalists have visited crematoriums/cemetaries and written a piece. Maybe my colleagues are influenced by these reported numbers.
Which would be in same ball park as the Wuhan rumours. But unfortunately at scale.
But whether numbers are 2 x or 3x seems not outrageous. Talking Mexico, Russia, South Africa, Iran etc. But 10 x is harder to fathom, reading the media reports I did hold a degree of scepticism about 10x - that cremations make it seem more apocalyptic. But I think it is clear that it is at a factor worse than the undercounting in these other countries.
Quite a harrowing conversation, tbh. The relative youth of victims they personally know.
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@crucial said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@frank said in Coronavirus - Overall:
Inida right now.
Amazing that there are people out there that will still argue that COVID is fake news or that lockdown/mask/social restrictions/border measures were unnecessary or simply power grabs.
that aimed at me?
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@mariner4life said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@crucial said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@frank said in Coronavirus - Overall:
Inida right now.
Amazing that there are people out there that will still argue that COVID is fake news or that lockdown/mask/social restrictions/border measures were unnecessary or simply power grabs.
that aimed at me?
Sounds like a straw man argument to me when I see people actually qualified on the matter raise objections and concerns with the government's health policy.
I'm also entirely unsurprised at India's predicament. A country with aspirations to be a superpower. It's only superpowers are population and bureaucracy.
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@antipodean said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@mariner4life said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@crucial said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@frank said in Coronavirus - Overall:
Inida right now.
Amazing that there are people out there that will still argue that COVID is fake news or that lockdown/mask/social restrictions/border measures were unnecessary or simply power grabs.
that aimed at me?
Sounds like a straw man argument to me when I see people actually qualified on the matter raise objections and concerns with the government's health policy.
I'm also entirely unsurprised at India's predicament. A country with aspirations to be a superpower. It's only superpowers are population and bureaucracy.
poverty. shit hygiene conditions. restrictive class system. people living on top of each other. I wonder why they are fucked?
I bet their numbers are way higher than are reported too, because i bet people die of it in the slums and go unrecorded.
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@mariner4life said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@crucial said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@frank said in Coronavirus - Overall:
Inida right now.
Amazing that there are people out there that will still argue that COVID is fake news or that lockdown/mask/social restrictions/border measures were unnecessary or simply power grabs.
that aimed at me?
Nope.
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@antipodean said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@mariner4life said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@crucial said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@frank said in Coronavirus - Overall:
Inida right now.
Amazing that there are people out there that will still argue that COVID is fake news or that lockdown/mask/social restrictions/border measures were unnecessary or simply power grabs.
that aimed at me?
Sounds like a straw man argument to me when I see people actually qualified on the matter raise objections and concerns with the government's health policy.
I'm also entirely unsurprised at India's predicament. A country with aspirations to be a superpower. It's only superpowers are population and bureaucracy.
The comment was more about idiots not believing potential impacts.
Out of interest who are the 'people actually qualified' that you refer to.
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@crucial said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@antipodean said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@mariner4life said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@crucial said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@frank said in Coronavirus - Overall:
Inida right now.
Amazing that there are people out there that will still argue that COVID is fake news or that lockdown/mask/social restrictions/border measures were unnecessary or simply power grabs.
that aimed at me?
Sounds like a straw man argument to me when I see people actually qualified on the matter raise objections and concerns with the government's health policy.
I'm also entirely unsurprised at India's predicament. A country with aspirations to be a superpower. It's only superpowers are population and bureaucracy.
The comment was more about idiots not believing potential impacts.
Out of interest who are the 'people actually qualified' that you refer to.
Bret Weinstein, John Lee, John Ioannidis, Jayanta Bhattacharya, Anders Tegnell, etc.
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@antipodean said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@crucial said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@antipodean said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@mariner4life said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@crucial said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@frank said in Coronavirus - Overall:
Inida right now.
Amazing that there are people out there that will still argue that COVID is fake news or that lockdown/mask/social restrictions/border measures were unnecessary or simply power grabs.
that aimed at me?
Sounds like a straw man argument to me when I see people actually qualified on the matter raise objections and concerns with the government's health policy.
I'm also entirely unsurprised at India's predicament. A country with aspirations to be a superpower. It's only superpowers are population and bureaucracy.
The comment was more about idiots not believing potential impacts.
Out of interest who are the 'people actually qualified' that you refer to.
Bret Weinstein, John Lee, John Ioannidis, Jayanta Bhattacharya, Anders Tegnell, etc.
Thanks. I thought you were talking about epidemiologists and health policy experts.
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@crucial said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@antipodean said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@crucial said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@antipodean said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@mariner4life said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@crucial said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@frank said in Coronavirus - Overall:
Inida right now.
Amazing that there are people out there that will still argue that COVID is fake news or that lockdown/mask/social restrictions/border measures were unnecessary or simply power grabs.
that aimed at me?
Sounds like a straw man argument to me when I see people actually qualified on the matter raise objections and concerns with the government's health policy.
I'm also entirely unsurprised at India's predicament. A country with aspirations to be a superpower. It's only superpowers are population and bureaucracy.
The comment was more about idiots not believing potential impacts.
Out of interest who are the 'people actually qualified' that you refer to.
Bret Weinstein, John Lee, John Ioannidis, Jayanta Bhattacharya, Anders Tegnell, etc.
Thanks. I thought you were talking about epidemiologists and health policy experts.
a Professor of Medicine (Stanford Prevention Research), of Epidemiology and Population Health
a Professor of Medicine - Primary Care Outcomes Research and Senior Fellow, Stanford Institute for Economic Policy Research (SIEPR)
A clinical professor of pathology
A state epidemiologist specialising in infectious disease?Guess i should listen to you instead.
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@antipodean and here I was thinking they were simply IDW theorists. So enlighten me to their objections and concerns about borders, lockdowns etc
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@crucial said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@antipodean and here I was thinking they were simply IDW theorists. So enlighten me to their objections and concerns about borders, lockdowns etc
Perhaps you should listen to them yourself.
Educate yourself. -
@crucial said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@antipodean and here I was thinking they were simply IDW theorists. So enlighten me to their objections and concerns about borders, lockdowns etc
I'm not qualified to adequately present their expert opinions. Nor am I interested in inadvertently misrepresenting them so you can save face on the internet. If you're genuinely interested, try googling.
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@antipodean said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@crucial said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@antipodean and here I was thinking they were simply IDW theorists. So enlighten me to their objections and concerns about borders, lockdowns etc
I'm not qualified to adequately present their expert opinions. Nor am I interested in inadvertently misrepresenting them so you can save face on the internet. If you're genuinely interested, try googling.
I have.
Weinstein describes himself as a a theoretical evolutionary biologist. Ioannidis has well read theories about the 'falseness' of research findings and his views on how false COVID mortality predictions were (according to his theories) threw egg all over his face when his numbers were wildy (and dangerously) low.
I have no doubt that these are intelligent people but they are coming at this from very ivory tower theoretical views that often don't hold up.
I think it's great to have other lenses thrown over the situation but their theories need to be taken alongside others (that can be just as bad in their group think) rather than heralded as all knowing.
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@crucial said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@antipodean said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@crucial said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@antipodean and here I was thinking they were simply IDW theorists. So enlighten me to their objections and concerns about borders, lockdowns etc
I'm not qualified to adequately present their expert opinions. Nor am I interested in inadvertently misrepresenting them so you can save face on the internet. If you're genuinely interested, try googling.
I have.
Then why ask?
Weinstein describes himself as a a theoretical evolutionary biologist. Ioannidis has well read theories about the 'falseness' of research findings and his views on how false COVID mortality predictions were (according to his theories) threw egg all over his face when his numbers were wildy (and dangerously) low.
Someone who understands immunobiology and a Professor of Epidemiology and Population Health. So from your cherry-picking we still have an epidemiologist and health policy expert.
I have no doubt that these are intelligent people but they are coming at this from very ivory tower theoretical views that often don't hold up.
As opposed to the rampant guesswork by Neil Ferguson?
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@antipodean how’s Ioannidis’ theoretical prediction of 1% infection and 10k deaths in the US holding up?
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@crucial said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@antipodean how’s Ioannidis’ theoretical prediction of 1% infection and 10k deaths in the US holding up?
So dissatisfied with me not misrepresenting the work and statements of others you're doing it yourself. Have fun.