Crusaders vs B&I Lions
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@Mattasaurus said in Crusaders vs B&I Lions:
@gt12 said in Crusaders vs B&I Lions:
I'm super happy if that gets called both ways.
If.....
Frogs not known for consistency in refereeingThis
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@Donsteppa said in Crusaders vs B&I Lions:
Fucking hell Crusaders. Pass up three gift points. Give up a midfield scrum with great options both ways. Then completely fuck up the lineout. You're not playing the Sunwolves FFS.
Dumb
Not something you say about the Saders often
Take. The. Points.
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@gt12 said in Crusaders vs B&I Lions:
Lions unlucky there.
Got screwed on the kick.
Dagg with a bad miss though.
Is this regaring the shot at goal that missed?
Found that amusing.
Does anyone seriously think that their perspective from the sideline (I'm looking at you Ian Smith) or watching a TV monitor had a better view of where the ball passed relative to the posts than Angus Gardner who was directly underneath it?
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@booboo said in Crusaders vs B&I Lions:
@Rapido said in Crusaders vs B&I Lions:
I love this refs officiating of the off side line.
What officiating?
The officiating that eventually moved an NZ Super team onside for the first time in years. The no coaching penalties.
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@gt12 said in Crusaders vs B&I Lions:
So, assuming the Lions win this, which I'm now sure they will, what have we learned?
This ref isn't in charge, but Garces and Pointe are.
Well thank goodness for that.
Looks like Peyper then Garces then Poite.
They all have their randomness but less than this bloke.
Who did the Blues have?
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@Rapido TBH cant say I have noticed them being off side more than any other team, and I thought the ref let the Lions away with being in front alot, both on defence and North in front of the kicker...so I guess he was consistent there in allowing both teams?
@booboo you mean like that kick in 2011 that everyone thought missed, but the ARs who were right underneath with the best view for seeing if it goes between.
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@MajorRage It looked like the Lions were off side a lot of the time - the line speed was just a bit too quick and seemed wrong. It was mentioned above that they were in front of the kicker on occasion too. That was my major complaint about the ref (although the blame really rests with the AR's).
It was up to the Crusaders to adapt and yes chipping behind would have been a good remedy. BB being the master of chip and chase will have the Lions thinking a bit more in the tests. -
@kev said in Crusaders vs B&I Lions:
@Duluth said in Crusaders vs B&I Lions:
@gt12 said in Crusaders vs B&I Lions:
Plus the 9,10, 12 were just out of their depth.
9, 10, 12
You're right. Don't recall seeing the 8 on the field ...
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@MiketheSnow said in Crusaders vs B&I Lions:
Tough conditions made for a tough watch.
You mean the lack of wind, lack of rain with only a light sprinkling of dew?
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@booboo I thought that if you created an imaginary line to extend the height of the uprights then that Farrell penalty would have hit the posts, therefore missed.
Speaking of refs, Gardner is in charge of the Highlanders game so we'll see if his interpretation differs from Raynal.
The full list is:
June 3 - Provincial Union XV (Angus Gardner, Australia)
June 7 - Blues (Pascal Gauzere, France)
June 10 - Crusaders (Mathieu Raynal, France)
June 13 - Highlanders (Angus Gardner)
June 17 - NZ Maori (Jaco Peyper, South Africa)
June 20 - Chiefs (Jerome Garces, France)
June 24 - New Zealand (Jaco Peyper)
June 27 - Hurricanes (Romain Poite, France)
July 1 - New Zealand (Jerome Garces)
July 8 - New Zealand (Romain Poite) -
@booboo said in Crusaders vs B&I Lions:
@MiketheSnow said in Crusaders vs B&I Lions:
Tough conditions made for a tough watch.
You mean the lack of wind, lack of rain with only a light sprinkling of dew?
Well half the players must have been playing in plimsoles then with duck fat lathered on their hands
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New Zealand's likely starting hooker in the three-Test series, Taylor got a first-hand look at what makes the Lions' set piece tick when his Crusaders were beaten 12-3 by the tourists in Christchurch. It was a far cry from he and his all-All Blacks tight five are used to in Super Rugby. But it was effective, and that has Taylor on edge. The biggest problem was the scrum, normally a Crusaders weapon, where they were penalised heavily by French referee Mathieu Raynal. That penalty count helped the Lions dominate possession and territory and left the Crusaders without a reliable platform. Taylor says it took half a game to adjust to the tourists' tactics of "changing the picture", which in front-row parlance means varying the size of the space between both packs at every scrum. "I suppose we didn't get the rub of the green but we had to adapt to what was happening with the ref and what their tactics were," he said. "They would change the picture, which was really smart and we probably weren't prepared for that. "The All Blacks, we'll have to be a bit smarter." Taylor says having played under Raynal will be of benefit, with two other French whistleblowers - Jerome Garces and Romain Poite - to control the second and third Tests. As well as the scrum rulings, Raynal also let the Lions get away with some unusual lineout antics. Explaining why the Crusaders' lineout was malfunctioning early on, Taylor says the touring forwards would shout over the home team's calls, creating confusion. And on their own throw, the Lions routinely go into a huddle, slowing down play. "We can't do anything about that unless the ref speeds it up. I don't think they're breaking any rules," Taylor said. "And we've seen over the last few weeks, they like to make a bit of noise and try to confuse us." -
@Stargazer said in Crusaders vs B&I Lions:
Taylor says it took half a game to adjust to the tourists' tactics of "changing the picture", which in front-row parlance means varying the size of the space between both packs at every scrum.
Half a game?
TBH I was surprised at how slow, almost to the point they failed to adapt to the ref at all at scrum time and the fact they didnt sort the call before getting to the lineout to combat the Lions calling over them?
One of the few completed scrums for the Crusaders resulted in Goodhue's big break, which I guess bodes well if any other team can get thier scrum functioning.
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If I were the Lions ...
... I'd be happy with:
- the win
- the creation of try scoring opportunities
- it was the Crusaders
- they'll get better
... I'd be unhappy with:
- lack of tries actually scored, especially those that they had to try really really hard not to score
- the score was very close (if probably flattering the home side)
- they got the rub of the officiating green
- the Crusaders were bloody awful in how many mistakes they made (in execution and in decision making)
- given the above two points they weren't further in front
Interesting the reaction to the win, like they'd won the series, but understandable given the impact on the tour. Possibly gives them a boost and shows a developing team spirit.
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We can complain about the Frenchman all day but I don't think he's the reason we lost.
Quite simply we cracked under pressure.
Havilii, Bridge, Mouaga and hall were overawed and played badly.
Robertson needs to realise that Drummond is our best 9 and should start every game. Crotty will make a huge difference at 12.
At the game it didn't look to me that the lions were offside any more than we were. Their Rush defense really pressured Mouaga and havilii. Hope we learn a lot from that, because I know the Chiefs, Canes and Highlamders will have. We also lost the breakdown battle pretty comprehensively ... Wynn jones and whoever the other lock was outplayed Whitleock and Romano convincingly.
Matt Todd and Taufua ripped into everything, but with a tight 5 getting beaten up were always in for a long night.
As I said, good lesson for Robertson etc. that game really showed our weak points. Hope we learn from it quickly.
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Good game to watch if only to see an improvement in the Lions. Even Sexton managed to put himself back in the reckoning for selection.
Surprised that Crusaders given their record this season didn't get over for at least one score. But Farrell snr earned his corn with a great defensive effort. Sorry for Davies and Hogg with both having just got started into the game. Both under HIA protocols which means a minimum 6-day layoff so they won't be involved in Tues match and low chance for the Maori match.
The Murray/Sexton/Farrell combo might be worth looking at again with maybe a more conventional 13 such as Joseph, Daly or even Henshaw.
Not sure a penetrating back three has been uncovered yet. And let's face it, penalty kicks ain't gonna cut it come test time.
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@SammyC said in Crusaders vs B&I Lions:
Quite simply we cracked under pressure.
This.
At the game it didn't look to me that the lions were offside any more than we were. Their Rush defense really pressured Mo'unga and Havilii.
and this too.
We can complain about the Frenchman all day but I don't think he's the reason we lost.
However, I don't the ref called the Lions on their being off, did he? Maybe once?
I also think that he started the game looking to assert his authority, and during those first 15 minutes things pretty clearly went against the Saders. After that, it was really about their poor play.
The more I think about the game, the more I think that Murray is going to be the key player. We know they have a good 8, and we know they'll kick their goals. His kicking and game control from 9 was outstanding yesterday. Was he MOTM?
