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@Godder said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
@Victor-Meldrew said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
@canefan said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
It does amaze me though that the country the western world has upheld as the protector of democracy has such piss poor voting systems.
When you look at a system such as we have in NZ where you have to be enrolled by proving your right to vote then have a number of ways to have your vote taken you wonder why it is that difficult.The only excuse they could muster is that compared to NZ they are huge. Change is difficult. But they should have fixed this a long time ago
You'd think that a Federal election would require a Federal approach and standards.
They have a nationwide system in the UK but still have problems with an increasing amount of voting fraud - mainly postal voting. One idiot during the last General Election even tweeting a selfie showing his marking up hundreds of postal ballots he'd collected prior to posting them off.
The authorities have piloted a number schemes to stop it - voter ID, collection of postal ballots etc - but change seems quite difficult to implement without disenfranchising people.
But at least we don't get hanging chads and crashing voting machines
We only do 'postal' votes for overseas voters don't we? Or by direct application from a voter.
We don't seem to get complaints about disenfranchisement. Elderly and informed are looked after and get a vote if they want it without risk.NZ basically decided that if everyone is allowed to vote, and it's a real civic duty, the system needs to be as friendly and open as possible, so a lot of effort has gone into having viable options for overseas Kiwis and the elderly and infirm.
That's what happens when decisions are made for the good of the electoral process, not for the benefit of one party or another
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@Crucial said in US Politics:
@Victor-Meldrew said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
@canefan said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
It does amaze me though that the country the western world has upheld as the protector of democracy has such piss poor voting systems.
When you look at a system such as we have in NZ where you have to be enrolled by proving your right to vote then have a number of ways to have your vote taken you wonder why it is that difficult.The only excuse they could muster is that compared to NZ they are huge. Change is difficult. But they should have fixed this a long time ago
You'd think that a Federal election would require a Federal approach and standards.
They have a nationwide system in the UK but still have problems with an increasing amount of voting fraud - mainly postal voting. One idiot during the last General Election even tweeting a selfie showing his marking up hundreds of postal ballots he'd collected prior to posting them off.
The authorities have piloted a number schemes to stop it - voter ID, collection of postal ballots etc - but change seems quite difficult to implement without disenfranchising people.
But at least we don't get hanging chads and crashing voting machines
We only do 'postal' votes for overseas voters don't we? Or by direct application from a voter.
We don't seem to get complaints about disenfranchisement. Elderly and informed are looked after and get a vote if they want it without risk.Problems in the UK have come from anyone being able to get a postal vote. You don't have to give a reason in mainland UK.
It's a good idea making it as easy to vote as possible, but it isn't easy getting the balance right between that and stopping fraud.
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Trumps head in the sand approach to Covid is taking its toll on the polls.
No matter the accuracy of them, there has been a trend downwards which must finally be sinking in to the faithful.
Getting quite dangerous for the GOP in some “safe” states and those expected to be swing states are very much in favour of the Dems.
At this point Biden only needs to sit back and watch the damage unfold. -
@Crucial said in US Politics:
Trumps head in the sand approach to Covid is taking its toll on the polls.
What do you think he should have done differently?
And remember a lot of the very worst decisions (re nursing homes) have been made by democrat state Governors. That wasn't Trumps call
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@Winger said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
Trumps head in the sand approach to Covid is taking its toll on the polls.
What do you think he should have done differently?
And remember a lot of the very worst decisions (re nursing homes) have been made by democrat state Governors. That wasn't Trumps call
Um, taken the virus seriously? Not advocated unproven treatments? Focussed on the viral threat instead of trying to constantly stoke his own ego? Too many things to mention, or is it all MSM fake news?
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@Winger said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
Trumps head in the sand approach to Covid is taking its toll on the polls.
What do you think he should have done differently?
And remember a lot of the very worst decisions (re nursing homes) have been made by democrat state Governors. That wasn't Trumps call
Shown some leadership for a start.
Still reckon he’s going to win comfortably?
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@Winger said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
Trumps head in the sand approach to Covid is taking its toll on the polls.
What do you think he should have done differently?
And remember a lot of the very worst decisions (re nursing homes) have been made by democrat state Governors. That wasn't Trumps call
How are those Republican states going Winger? Seems like Florida is really putting it's best foot forward.
Maybe, just maybe, this virus doesn't have much to do with local politics. Just maybe.
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@canefan said in US Politics:
@Winger said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
Trumps head in the sand approach to Covid is taking its toll on the polls.
What do you think he should have done differently?
And remember a lot of the very worst decisions (re nursing homes) have been made by democrat state Governors. That wasn't Trumps call
Um, taken the virus seriously? Not advocated unproven treatments? Focussed on the viral threat instead of trying to constantly stoke his own ego? Too many things to mention, or is it all MSM fake news?
Trump fronted the virus task force for quite some time. Surely this is one example of taking it seriously. Another is the travel ban
His treatment was a suggestion that has been used by many.But I'll say again. The main-steam fake news media is anti Trump and if he walked on water and healed the blind he would still be criticized by this lot
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@Crucial said in US Politics:
@Winger said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
Trumps head in the sand approach to Covid is taking its toll on the polls.
What do you think he should have done differently?
And remember a lot of the very worst decisions (re nursing homes) have been made by democrat state Governors. That wasn't Trumps call
Shown some leadership for a start.
Still reckon he’s going to win comfortably?
I'm certain of it. The loony left Democrats will scare the shit out of most that don't suffer from TDS. Even some that do are now waking up.
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4 fucken years!
4 fucken years of people telling everyone that trump is a fucking retard, like they're the only person that knows that. Slur and insult and denigration to a ridiculous degree as if that strengthens an argument. It's all just so cheap.Just repetitive "liar, leadership, dumb dumb, poor speaker etc etc". Like no one else can see that. Like no one else has pushed that aside and looked at the alternative, and the future well being of America.
Fuck trump and covid. He's no more responsible for the states as Scott Morrison is for Victoria. Besides, we all have first hand experience of the fluffybunny that is covid and hand on heart we all know it's fucken tricky.
But fuck me, imagine if your governing people in Wellington or Auckland or Sydney placated a CHAZ, or talked about defunding the police or stood them down while half a billion bucks of rioting took place? By and large, the yanks live like us, so it's not a stretch to empathise in the face of such utter madness.
All those cities left fucked by rioting and the current crime /murder rate in Chicago and New York are living breathing up to the minute critiques of current Democrat's administration. It's a fucken dire indictment. I don't know what a Democrat government would look like but, I can't see much production coming from the current mob, if now is an example.
Do we really want to see the chaos and neglect while the current Democrat mindset tries and fails at it's "equity for all" ideology? Do we have to watch the yanks fumble like South Africa did? Go through all that destruction and societal retardation just to prove that trump is a classic American blowhard?
We need China and America producing shit. Cycle shop says unlikely to be bikes at Christmas time, buying printers is hard, golf shop can't fill orders, fridges and appliances delayed, and the supply chain kinks abound. We need a functional, and fuck it, if need be a racist, sexist, boastful, USA, and perhaps, putting up with a gibbon at the helm might be a cross to bear. Their well being directly affects ours.
I think (after 4 years) it's time to cease the trump is Satan virtue signalling and cast a gaze at the alternative. A feature of the trump bleaters is they never ever give consideration to the alternative in their sermons.
From our pount of view, post covid we need the septics producing or building shit again. I don't think the democrats have shown any ability to build shit. Exceptional aptitude at tearing things down though
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@Siam good rant.
Totally fails to address the damage Trump himself is doing to the US with his divisive tactics.
It isn’t virtue signalling to be concerned about the path he is taking the US down any more than your concerns about where the Dems would take things. -
@Crucial it is when one side is represented by 3 weeks of CHAZ, 500 million damages in Minneapolis and 40000 homeless in LA. 3 examples of stark realities directly attributable to governance and political decisions
Vs
"divisiveness"
All of the Democrat state's visible, recorded problems just disappear when trump is gone huh? Like magic " sanctuary cities" thrive overnight huh? Homelessness is irradiated, crime drops and police do a better job with half the funding? All you need for America to thrive again is simply for trump to be gone huh?
Concrete real world examples vs middle class character assessments- actually that sums up the left quite aptly.
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@Siam A diversion, but I don’t know what has happened with Chicago. I lived there part time for quite a while and it looked like there was a possibility of the homicide rate falling to manageable levels. Certainly in all the time I was there I never felt unsafe. For sure the tactics of the police were questionable a lot of the time but it kept people safe. They had a task force that was disbanded maybe ten years ago after which things seem to have trended back upwards. That may just be a coincidence but if not the lesson is that aggressive police tactics maybe necessary to keep people alive.
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@Siam 4 years, 4 fucking years of watching american become great again. what a fucken disaster.
and the alternative wants to defund the police, because that's what trump said... except as usual that was a lie, because it is not what biden has said at all.you are making the mistake of confusing the extremists with the potential government. which is why being divisive matters, by the way.
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@JC agree. Perhaps humans will simply just be destructive sans effective deterrents and authority. Perhaps it's simply too much to get all of society always playing by the rules, without a "stick" of some sort?
The flip side are the inevitable abuses of that authority. It appears we lack a cogent analysis of that balancing act, currently.
I think crime vs law abiding is always a feature of human civilization, but I think we have enough experience as a species to identify what absolutely doesn't work in a democracy.
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@reprobate said in US Politics:
@Siam 4 years, 4 fucking years of watching american become great again. what a fucken disaster.
and the alternative wants to defund the police, because that's what trump said... except as usual that was a lie, because it is not what biden has said at all.you are making the mistake of confusing the extremists with the potential government. which is why being divisive matters, by the way.
Durkhin is an extremist?
Newsome is an extremist?
DeBlasio is an extremist?
Walz is an extremist?
Lightfoot is an extremist?
Evers is an extremist?
Inslee is an extremist?
Cuomo is an extremist?They aren't potential government. They are the government and their work is in plain sight.
And I'm confused huh?
Are all these people re-imagining the police force all extremists? Obama too?
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@Siam re-imagining? there's nothing wrong with assessing law and order, gun control, repeated incidences of police violence which is indicative of serious problems. the system is not working as well as anyone would like it to.
saying defund the police without offering alternatives is bullshit, as is saying 'they want to defund the police' when their leader has said that he does not support that at all.if the democrats are so extreme, i assume you're saying that this has happened since the last democrat government? because that government seemed far more like the american 'business as usual' - that you say you want - than the current republican (even though it's not really republican) one.
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@Snowy said in US Politics:
@JC said in US Politics:
I should know better than to engage with you, it's like trying to reason with a Jersey cow.
I'm taking umbrage with that, Jersey cows are smart and think for themselves. I also like cheese.
Yeah I was a little disturbed with jc's smearing of a pretty likeable and functional bovine, also😀
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Heres a good example of how corrupt the mainstream fake news media has become now. Unfortunately some still don't get it yet
At least one was honest
@jaketapper
Folks read the ENTIRE McEnany comment about "the science should not stand in the way" of opening schools. She's arguing that the science is on the side of those who want to open them, she cites a JAMA study. I'm not taking a position on the matter but be fair.
2:44 AM · Jul 17, 2020Unlike Acosta (and the Washington Post, NY Times, Guardian etc)
The White House Press Secretary on Trump's push to reopen schools: 'The science should not stand in the way of this,'" said CNN's Jim Acosta, conveniently omitting some fairly necessary context.
US Politics