Coronavirus - Australia
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We've always known that there might not be a vaccine though. It's just empty rhetoric from the likes of Trump that had anyone thinking otherwise.
there's lots of contemporaneous work going on to develop effective treatments that allow us to live successfully with the virus. That's what I am hoping anyway.
@mariner4life where'd you get that figure from 15% unemployment seems like a sudden jump. they're hoping here to keep it at more like 10-12. I guess we will find out when the subsidies end. - and in the months after that.
i did read today that heavy vehicle kms travelled is actually up in NZ for the last mth cf 2019. A KPI that is usually a good indicator of economic activity
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@dogmeat said in Coronavirus - Australia:
@mariner4life where'd you get that figure from 15% unemployment seems like a sudden jump. they're hoping here to keep it at more like 10-12. I guess we will find out when the subsidies end. - and in the months after that
heard it on the news on the way to work. Based on hospo, retail, and a significantly restricted construction industry
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@mariner4life These are monoclonal antibodies that will be produced in bioreactors similar to fermenters. When administered to infected monkeys, they blocked viral replication at least as well as current vaccine candidates. i.e. they would be something that could be given to infected people to stop them developing serious symptoms, and stop producing more virus in their bodies.
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@voodoo said in Coronavirus - Australia:
@taniwharugby said in Coronavirus - Australia:
@mariner4life said in Coronavirus - Australia:
the WHO have now come out and said there may never be a vaccine, ad certainly won't be a silver bullet vaccine that gets us all out of this. So how does that affect government thinking?
yep, governments need to be looking at a plan to live WITH the Virus.
Man, we have been beating that drum on this forum for a while now. I have to believe these discussions are happening within NZ and Australian government, but there certainly are no signs of their thinking being communicated to Joe public. As I've said previously, at the minimum there should be lots of consultation with the most affected industries, eg tourism, universities, property dev etc, all of whom could be actively repurposing, recutting strategy, or at worst shutting down (rather than sucking public funds for no gain) but it sounds like that isn't happening either.
If we look to Victoria as an example, they've shut down industries that weren't hot spots and kept open those that are:
While the restrictions will see most retail, manufacturing and administration businesses close and strict limits placed on numbers of workers in settings such as abattoirs, warehouses and construction sites, many industries in which there have been significant coronavirus clusters will continue to operate, including health, aged care and takeaway food.
Many businesses that managed to struggle through the first closure of three months and saw light at the end of the tunnel have now had to shutter again. A considerable amount of them won't be able to reopen as a result.
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Article on the incompetence of Victoria:
Poorly trained security guards on a so-called “crazy floor” of the Rydges Hotel in Melbourne’s Swanston Street may have let COVID-19 escape into the community, after they became overwhelmed by hysterical guests who were screaming, crying and banging on walls, begging to be let out.
This week’s independent inquiry into the spread of the virus is expected to hear evidence that guests were begging, pleading and even offering money to security guards for a cigarette, a lighter, Valium or a breath of fresh air.
Many of those travellers, especially in the early days of the virus, were infectious, and the guards seemed unable to control them, with mental health professionals eventually called in.
The inquiry will hear that guards in one case struggled to handle a distraught women who collapsed and cried in the hotel hallway before making a bolt for the door, insisting on her need to “breathe”.
The Rydges Hotel was one of the first to take quarantine travellers, and one of the first to have a major virus breakout.
A guest of Rydges, released from the hotel after returning from Europe in April, has told The Australian he had been put on what guards described as the “crazy floor” of his hotel, “with people going absolutely nuts”.
“They had mental health people coming to sedate them,” said the guest, who asked not to be named. “They were asking for Valium, for sleeping pills.
“They were begging to be let out and running for the doors.”
The Victorian government was alone among the states in deciding to engage private security firms to manage hotel quarantine. By contrast, NSW relied on police officers, who are far more experienced at handling civilians under stress.
The guest told The Australian that the guards seem ill-equipped to handle people “who were coming off flights after 60 hours on the go, who wanted a cigarette, wanted fresh air, wanted to go home and see their family.
“And they were being told no, but the guards had no real authority … they gave the impression they could be talked around. And guests were going up to the security guards, begging and offering money to be let out. It was insane.”
More than 20 security guards, relatives and other contacts tested positive after coming into contact with guests at the 107-room Rydges Hotel.
There were outbreaks at the Stamford Plaza in Little Collins Street, too.
The emotional state of many quarantined travellers across Australia can be gleaned from the many posts still appearing on the “Hotel Quarantine” pages on Facebook.
One guest, from a hotel outside Victoria, admitting making “constant calls to reception” to get permission for fresh-air breaks.
“Tonight, I called reception at 10pm to get out for a break, they reply ‘Yes, I will put you on the list’ — I waited and waited for 15mins to get escorted out; still no-one, 10:15, 10:30, 10:45, I called.
“The officer only came to take me at 10:50pm which only gave me 10mins for fresh air.”
This break was permitted, under the program’s rules.
Others advised fellow guests to “lose your shit, cry” in order to get outside.
The pressure on others is apparent from their posts, with one saying: “I lost my shit on day 10. No amount of someone telling me that it was ‘going to be fine’ would comfort me.”
Another said they were “mentally broken” by the experience.
“The only thing we asked (pleaded) for when we arrived, was access to a mental health professional, and we were empathetically (convincingly) promised this,” she wrote.
“By the second day, still with no mental health support, which I naively assumed you would have ready for us the moment we arrived, or prescription medication that we had requested, our mental state had deteriorated further.
“By the third day, my partner was screaming — I mean, SCREAMING — for help, sobbing uncontrollably and wailing that she just wanted to die.”
An “imposing police officer” arrived to tell them to shut up.
Another guest of Rydges has complained directly to the Victorian government COVID-19 inquiry about the risk of transmission between guests.
Christine Joan Cocks says in a submission that she “was in quarantine in Rydges on Swanston from 12 April to 27 April, 2020” after returning from Uruguay.
“Issues of cleanliness concerned my husband and I,” she said. “We are both healthcare workers. The carpet was dirty. Quite a few in our cohort asked for a vacuum cleaner.
“ Of concern to us was how the vacuum cleaner was transferred from room to room.
“I do not think it was cleaned between transfers. A fair percentage of our cohort had tested COVID positive.”
She said guests were not expected to remove mattress toppers when stripping their own linen, upon leaving the hotel.
“We cannot believe this. How disgusting. What a great way to spread a virus. We double-bagged all waste within our room, but it was collected like that from our door. The first bag should have been put into the second bag held by a PPE-protected staff member, to ensure the outside of that bag was not contaminated.”
She also witnessed eight staff coming for their shift in just two cars. “I think it is unfair to just point a finger at the security staff at the hotel because, to us, the most likely weakness was how potential contaminants were managed by the hotel,” she said.
“Quarantine should only be managed by people well-trained in handling of contaminants.”
Public hearings of the inquiry begin on Thursday.
Topics to be examined include the nature of COVID-19; infection control; epidemiology and contact tracing; and genomic testing. The report is due on September 23, after the Victorian lockdown ends.
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@antipodean wow
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Updates from Victoria:
Exercising?
People who are isolating at home can no longer leave their property to exercise. Everyone else can use their one hour of exercise as normal.
Stiff shit if you can't get your exercise done within 5km and an hour. Otherwise people will die.
Childcare?
Dan Andrews will discuss childcare with the Prime Minister "It's not so much about whether it's a yes or no [in relation to childcare being open]," Mr Andrews said. "It's about trying to work out what will be the impact be. How many kids will be going to childcare? How many childcare workers will need to move around the community? How much movement will that add? How much will that undermine our general push to have as little movement as possible? "We'll get the clarity as quickly as we possibly can. We'll inform people and we'll try and make it as simple and as easy to understand as we possibly can."
Why do you need childcare if everyone has to stay at home ffs? Why should the country pay for your incompetence? Tax your own State.
Work permits?
Permit to be issued for workers who have to work past the 8:00pm curfew Mr Andrews said a permit would be issued for those who need to be out after 8:00pm from tomorrow. "It's a piece of paper. Your employer fills it out. They sign it. You sign it. You carry it with you and then you're able to demonstrate so there's not a sense of anxiety or a sense of having to tell your story 17 times. "If you're pulled up by police, you can simply provide that piece of paper and then you would be waved on to go about your business."
No loophole there. No sirree.
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@antipodean so that is 0.6 percent dying based on your figures and the number of asymptomatic could make those positives actually higher. That is a train wreck.
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Sweden's approach with a bit more attention to protecting those in rest-homes, is looking smarter by the day. What an absolute clusterfuck.
The govt should be publishing metrics others than Covid cases.
Jobs lost, mental health calls, domestic abuse etc. -
@Frank said in Coronavirus - Australia:
Sweden's approach with a bit more attention to protecting those in rest-homes, is looking smarter by the day. What an absolute clusterfuck.
The govt should be publishing metrics others than Covid cases.
Jobs lost, mental health calls, domestic abuse etc.Are you just going to keep posting that with the attached asterisk around deaths in rest homes in post after post?
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@Frank said in Coronavirus - Australia:
The govt should be publishing metrics others than Covid cases.
Jobs lost, mental health calls, domestic abuse etc.And in Australia they certainly publish stats on all of those things. Most countries do.
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@antipodean The wife mentioned hearing screaming and walls being punched and kicked. I applied my husband doubtful card and dismissed it as her exaggerating and being dramatic...
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@dogmeat said in Coronavirus - Australia:
We've always known that there might not be a vaccine though. It's just empty rhetoric from the likes of Trump that had anyone thinking otherwise.
there's lots of contemporaneous work going on to develop effective treatments that allow us to live successfully with the virus. That's what I am hoping anyway.
@mariner4life where'd you get that figure from 15% unemployment seems like a sudden jump. they're hoping here to keep it at more like 10-12. I guess we will find out when the subsidies end. - and in the months after that.
i did read today that heavy vehicle kms travelled is actually up in NZ for the last mth cf 2019. A KPI that is usually a good indicator of economic activity
can we please mention trump in every thread? It's great for learning what a dumkhoff he is and who on the fern has the greatest insights on the world.
I reckon I'll pass on a hastily generated vaccine for a disease with a death rate of such miniscule proportions.
Im old enough to register the pitfalls of thalidomide, to name one example of not so thorough testing
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@antipodean said in Coronavirus - Australia:
Updates from Victoria:
Exercising?
People who are isolating at home can no longer leave their property to exercise. Everyone else can use their one hour of exercise as normal.
Stiff shit if you can't get your exercise done within 5km and an hour. Otherwise people will die.
Childcare?
Dan Andrews will discuss childcare with the Prime Minister "It's not so much about whether it's a yes or no [in relation to childcare being open]," Mr Andrews said. "It's about trying to work out what will be the impact be. How many kids will be going to childcare? How many childcare workers will need to move around the community? How much movement will that add? How much will that undermine our general push to have as little movement as possible? "We'll get the clarity as quickly as we possibly can. We'll inform people and we'll try and make it as simple and as easy to understand as we possibly can."
Why do you need childcare if everyone has to stay at home ffs? Why should the country pay for your incompetence? Tax your own State.
Work permits?
Permit to be issued for workers who have to work past the 8:00pm curfew Mr Andrews said a permit would be issued for those who need to be out after 8:00pm from tomorrow. "It's a piece of paper. Your employer fills it out. They sign it. You sign it. You carry it with you and then you're able to demonstrate so there's not a sense of anxiety or a sense of having to tell your story 17 times. "If you're pulled up by police, you can simply provide that piece of paper and then you would be waved on to go about your business."
No loophole there. No sirree.
I'm pleasantly surprised they have allowed Racing to continue in Victoria.
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@Hooroo said in Coronavirus - Australia:
@antipodean said in Coronavirus - Australia:
Updates from Victoria:
Exercising?
People who are isolating at home can no longer leave their property to exercise. Everyone else can use their one hour of exercise as normal.
Stiff shit if you can't get your exercise done within 5km and an hour. Otherwise people will die.
Childcare?
Dan Andrews will discuss childcare with the Prime Minister "It's not so much about whether it's a yes or no [in relation to childcare being open]," Mr Andrews said. "It's about trying to work out what will be the impact be. How many kids will be going to childcare? How many childcare workers will need to move around the community? How much movement will that add? How much will that undermine our general push to have as little movement as possible? "We'll get the clarity as quickly as we possibly can. We'll inform people and we'll try and make it as simple and as easy to understand as we possibly can."
Why do you need childcare if everyone has to stay at home ffs? Why should the country pay for your incompetence? Tax your own State.
Work permits?
Permit to be issued for workers who have to work past the 8:00pm curfew Mr Andrews said a permit would be issued for those who need to be out after 8:00pm from tomorrow. "It's a piece of paper. Your employer fills it out. They sign it. You sign it. You carry it with you and then you're able to demonstrate so there's not a sense of anxiety or a sense of having to tell your story 17 times. "If you're pulled up by police, you can simply provide that piece of paper and then you would be waved on to go about your business."
No loophole there. No sirree.
I'm pleasantly surprised they have allowed Racing to continue in Victoria.
Racing cannot be killed by conventional weapons
That said, we'll happily run the Cox Plate at Cannon Park
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@mariner4life said in Coronavirus - Australia:
@Hooroo said in Coronavirus - Australia:
@antipodean said in Coronavirus - Australia:
Updates from Victoria:
Exercising?
People who are isolating at home can no longer leave their property to exercise. Everyone else can use their one hour of exercise as normal.
Stiff shit if you can't get your exercise done within 5km and an hour. Otherwise people will die.
Childcare?
Dan Andrews will discuss childcare with the Prime Minister "It's not so much about whether it's a yes or no [in relation to childcare being open]," Mr Andrews said. "It's about trying to work out what will be the impact be. How many kids will be going to childcare? How many childcare workers will need to move around the community? How much movement will that add? How much will that undermine our general push to have as little movement as possible? "We'll get the clarity as quickly as we possibly can. We'll inform people and we'll try and make it as simple and as easy to understand as we possibly can."
Why do you need childcare if everyone has to stay at home ffs? Why should the country pay for your incompetence? Tax your own State.
Work permits?
Permit to be issued for workers who have to work past the 8:00pm curfew Mr Andrews said a permit would be issued for those who need to be out after 8:00pm from tomorrow. "It's a piece of paper. Your employer fills it out. They sign it. You sign it. You carry it with you and then you're able to demonstrate so there's not a sense of anxiety or a sense of having to tell your story 17 times. "If you're pulled up by police, you can simply provide that piece of paper and then you would be waved on to go about your business."
No loophole there. No sirree.
I'm pleasantly surprised they have allowed Racing to continue in Victoria.
Racing cannot be killed by conventional weapons
That said, we'll happily run the Cox Plate at Cannon Park
and we (Polsy) will travel.... (Dreams are very free on my part)
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@Hooroo said in Coronavirus - Australia:
I'm pleasantly surprised they have allowed Racing to continue in Victoria.
Their network must be amazing.