All Blacks 2025
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@Canes4life said in All Blacks 2025:
@Chris said in All Blacks 2025:
@Canes4life said in All Blacks 2025:
@Chris said in All Blacks 2025:
@Canes4life said in All Blacks 2025:
@Chris said in All Blacks 2025:
@Canes4life said in All Blacks 2025:
@Chris said in All Blacks 2025:
@Canes4life said in All Blacks 2025:
@Chris said in All Blacks 2025:
@frugby said in All Blacks 2025:
@Canes4life said in All Blacks 2025:
@george33 said in All Blacks 2025:
@sparky respect your opinion, but Proctor , just don't see it ,let's see how he goes in next couple months.,
It’s not only my opinion mate. The drums have been beating pretty loudly for Proctor to start for a while now and at some point he’ll be too hard to ignore.
I take it you didn’t watch his performance against the Brumbies on Saturday? Either that or you didn’t have your contacts in because he was all class on both sides of the ball and that’s what the ABs have been missing consistently in a centre for far too long.
Personally I wouldn’t mind if the ABs rolled out this team against the French.
- Williams
- Taylor
- Lomax
- Barrett
- Va’ai
- Sititi
- Lakai
- Savea
- Roigard
- McKenzie
- Ioane (I’d back him over Clarke)
- Barrett
- Proctor
- Jordan
- Love
- Taukei’aho
- De Groot
- Tosi
- Holland
- Kirifi
- Ratima
- Barrett
- Lam
I may be a moron, but I don't think the best All Blacks team includes six Hurricanes starting, with a further two on the bench.
With the form he is in, Jordan should and will get first crack at fullback, and I don't think you should see Savea, Lakai and Kirifi all in the same 23. Need another big body (probably Finau).
Yeah I agree I can’t see that team happening
Or deserve those selections
.Says the Blackadder fan.
Says the in love with Love
man who has done fuck all.
And 2 midget Cane LFs is not the way to go one yeah but two nah.I’d have Jordan at fullback but he lacks a proper kicking game which you need at international level. IMO, he’s also a better wing for the ABs.
That leaves either Beaudy or Love at fullback and I would sway towards Love because he’s only going to get better, while Barrett is only going to decline with age.
Jordan has been very good the last few weeks with his kicking game certainly he is getting better at it.
And Jordan will be the FB his form means he deserves the spot.
Love for me just has not done enough to earn a starting spot as yet.
He has talent for sure but for me needs to show more to walk in to a starting spot .Fair call, I’m more worried that we shoe horn Barrett into the mix at 15 if we start DMac at 10. I guess what I’m trying to say with my selections is that we need to start blooding young talent. The Proctor’s, Lam’s and Love’s of the world need to at least start seeing more time so we know what they are made of at the next level.
Nah to BB at fb I don’t want to see that again.
Proctor I would like to see get a crack at 13 something different if might add a fair bit.So what’s your backline then? If you have Jordan at 15, who are your wingers?
Tangitau adds pace so I would try him probably stick with Clarke
Or Ioane on the wing I don’t mind that.Good call on Tangitau, really liking what I’m seeing there and you can’t coach pace. Clarke though I’m not sold, I’d prefer to move Ioane back to the left wing.
I don’t mind that either the high ball will be a factor on who they pick I think.
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@Chris said in All Blacks 2025:
@Chris said in All Blacks 2025:
@Canes4life said in All Blacks 2025:
@Chris said in All Blacks 2025:
@Canes4life said in All Blacks 2025:
@Chris said in All Blacks 2025:
@Canes4life said in All Blacks 2025:
@Chris said in All Blacks 2025:
@Canes4life said in All Blacks 2025:
@Chris said in All Blacks 2025:
@frugby said in All Blacks 2025:
@Canes4life said in All Blacks 2025:
@george33 said in All Blacks 2025:
@sparky respect your opinion, but Proctor , just don't see it ,let's see how he goes in next couple months.,
It’s not only my opinion mate. The drums have been beating pretty loudly for Proctor to start for a while now and at some point he’ll be too hard to ignore.
I take it you didn’t watch his performance against the Brumbies on Saturday? Either that or you didn’t have your contacts in because he was all class on both sides of the ball and that’s what the ABs have been missing consistently in a centre for far too long.
Personally I wouldn’t mind if the ABs rolled out this team against the French.
- Williams
- Taylor
- Lomax
- Barrett
- Va’ai
- Sititi
- Lakai
- Savea
- Roigard
- McKenzie
- Ioane (I’d back him over Clarke)
- Barrett
- Proctor
- Jordan
- Love
- Taukei’aho
- De Groot
- Tosi
- Holland
- Kirifi
- Ratima
- Barrett
- Lam
I may be a moron, but I don't think the best All Blacks team includes six Hurricanes starting, with a further two on the bench.
With the form he is in, Jordan should and will get first crack at fullback, and I don't think you should see Savea, Lakai and Kirifi all in the same 23. Need another big body (probably Finau).
Yeah I agree I can’t see that team happening
Or deserve those selections
.Says the Blackadder fan.
Says the in love with Love
man who has done fuck all.
And 2 midget Cane LFs is not the way to go one yeah but two nah.I’d have Jordan at fullback but he lacks a proper kicking game which you need at international level. IMO, he’s also a better wing for the ABs.
That leaves either Beaudy or Love at fullback and I would sway towards Love because he’s only going to get better, while Barrett is only going to decline with age.
Jordan has been very good the last few weeks with his kicking game certainly he is getting better at it.
And Jordan will be the FB his form means he deserves the spot.
Love for me just has not done enough to earn a starting spot as yet.
He has talent for sure but for me needs to show more to walk in to a starting spot .Fair call, I’m more worried that we shoe horn Barrett into the mix at 15 if we start DMac at 10. I guess what I’m trying to say with my selections is that we need to start blooding young talent. The Proctor’s, Lam’s and Love’s of the world need to at least start seeing more time so we know what they are made of at the next level.
Nah to BB at fb I don’t want to see that again.
Proctor I would like to see get a crack at 13 something different if might add a fair bit.So what’s your backline then? If you have Jordan at 15, who are your wingers?
Tangitau adds pace so I would try him probably stick with Clarke
Or Ioane on the wing I don’t mind that.The one thing that worries me wings have to be decent under the high ball for test rugby.
That was kind of my thinking of having Jordan and Love in the back three. But if we have Barrett at 15 that will help big time.
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@frugby said in All Blacks 2025:
@Bones said in All Blacks 2025:
@frugby said in All Blacks 2025:
@Canes4life said in All Blacks 2025:
@frugby said in All Blacks 2025:
@Canes4life said in All Blacks 2025:
@george33 said in All Blacks 2025:
@sparky respect your opinion, but Proctor , just don't see it ,let's see how he goes in next couple months.,
It’s not only my opinion mate. The drums have been beating pretty loudly for Proctor to start for a while now and at some point he’ll be too hard to ignore.
I take it you didn’t watch his performance against the Brumbies on Saturday? Either that or you didn’t have your contacts in because he was all class on both sides of the ball and that’s what the ABs have been missing consistently in a centre for far too long.
Personally I wouldn’t mind if the ABs rolled out this team against the French.
- Williams
- Taylor
- Lomax
- Barrett
- Va’ai
- Sititi
- Lakai
- Savea
- Roigard
- McKenzie
- Ioane (I’d back him over Clarke)
- Barrett
- Proctor
- Jordan
- Love
- Taukei’aho
- De Groot
- Tosi
- Holland
- Kirifi
- Ratima
- Barrett
- Lam
I may be a moron, but I don't think the best All Blacks team includes six Hurricanes starting, with a further two on the bench.
With the form he is in, Jordan should and will get first crack at fullback, and I don't think you should see Savea, Lakai and Kirifi all in the same 23. Need another big body (probably Finau).
I didn’t say it was the team Razor would pick, it’s the team I would pick. I reckon that loose trio would be bloody hard to stop. Forget Finau, what’s he actually done apart from putting a few big shots on a couple of tiny number 10s?
I know that is your team, but I personally don't think it is a coincidence Moana have been so good, with Ardie looking like a million bucks with a proper blindisde and a proper eight next to him. Ardie excels in the wide channels, and is the best openside we have. Peter Lakai is a fucken awesome player, so I'd probably stick him on the bench, because i think he has 100 test AB written all over him.
I am also not overly convinced by Finau, so potentially if we are looking for an eight to do the dirty work with Sititi roaming at six, I couple be intrigued to see CLW rewarded with the spot at eight.
I can't really spot the logic of saying Ardie is going great guns with a big 6/8 alongside him and then offering up CLW and Sititi as those guys.
Kind of agree, but also Miracle Fai'ilagi isn't eligible for the All Blacks, and IMO he'd stroll into the six jersey. Tupou Ta'eiloa isn't huge height wise, but the key is he plays like a proper number eight, as does Christian Lio-Willie. I'm not yet 100% sold on Sititi at eight, because he plays much looser than a traditional eight.
Either way, both those guys play a lot "bigger" than CLW (another hard worker who just seems to lack oomph).
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@Bones said in All Blacks 2025:
@frugby said in All Blacks 2025:
@Bones said in All Blacks 2025:
@frugby said in All Blacks 2025:
@Canes4life said in All Blacks 2025:
@frugby said in All Blacks 2025:
@Canes4life said in All Blacks 2025:
@george33 said in All Blacks 2025:
@sparky respect your opinion, but Proctor , just don't see it ,let's see how he goes in next couple months.,
It’s not only my opinion mate. The drums have been beating pretty loudly for Proctor to start for a while now and at some point he’ll be too hard to ignore.
I take it you didn’t watch his performance against the Brumbies on Saturday? Either that or you didn’t have your contacts in because he was all class on both sides of the ball and that’s what the ABs have been missing consistently in a centre for far too long.
Personally I wouldn’t mind if the ABs rolled out this team against the French.
- Williams
- Taylor
- Lomax
- Barrett
- Va’ai
- Sititi
- Lakai
- Savea
- Roigard
- McKenzie
- Ioane (I’d back him over Clarke)
- Barrett
- Proctor
- Jordan
- Love
- Taukei’aho
- De Groot
- Tosi
- Holland
- Kirifi
- Ratima
- Barrett
- Lam
I may be a moron, but I don't think the best All Blacks team includes six Hurricanes starting, with a further two on the bench.
With the form he is in, Jordan should and will get first crack at fullback, and I don't think you should see Savea, Lakai and Kirifi all in the same 23. Need another big body (probably Finau).
I didn’t say it was the team Razor would pick, it’s the team I would pick. I reckon that loose trio would be bloody hard to stop. Forget Finau, what’s he actually done apart from putting a few big shots on a couple of tiny number 10s?
I know that is your team, but I personally don't think it is a coincidence Moana have been so good, with Ardie looking like a million bucks with a proper blindisde and a proper eight next to him. Ardie excels in the wide channels, and is the best openside we have. Peter Lakai is a fucken awesome player, so I'd probably stick him on the bench, because i think he has 100 test AB written all over him.
I am also not overly convinced by Finau, so potentially if we are looking for an eight to do the dirty work with Sititi roaming at six, I couple be intrigued to see CLW rewarded with the spot at eight.
I can't really spot the logic of saying Ardie is going great guns with a big 6/8 alongside him and then offering up CLW and Sititi as those guys.
Kind of agree, but also Miracle Fai'ilagi isn't eligible for the All Blacks, and IMO he'd stroll into the six jersey. Tupou Ta'eiloa isn't huge height wise, but the key is he plays like a proper number eight, as does Christian Lio-Willie. I'm not yet 100% sold on Sititi at eight, because he plays much looser than a traditional eight.
Either way, both those guys play a lot "bigger" than CLW (another hard worker who just seems to lack oomph).
I think CLW's form over a few years probably warrants a call-up. I have no idea how impactful he'd be at test level, but I'm not sure the starting ABs pack is likely to lack ball carriers (all the locks they used last year were certainly ball-players rather than a workhorse like a Whitelock), and there will be no shortage of X-Factor runners with Sititi and Savea. We might legitimately just need a guy who plays like a proper number eight, who lets Ardie be the best version of Ardie.
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@Bones said in All Blacks 2025:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:
@george33 said in All Blacks 2025:
@sparky unless Reiko, gets injured which doesn't happen that much, he will be 13, Proctor 1 game against Fiji, missed 3 tackles, and was dropped, Test Rugby
Maybe that's an issue. Have a poor debut and no matter how talented get a black mark in the coaching staff's book. Coach then makes comfortable selections. Which us fine - until the comfortable choices get injured or form dissappears.
It's simply bollocks. If missed tackles are that big of an issue, then the cantab props and EB are in a world of trouble.
They're already in the club, though.
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Just a snapshot on where i’m leaning
I would’nt pick Telea or Ioane
Whats the point ? It would be another lost opportunity to look somewhere else15.W Jordon
14.C Tangitau
11.C Clark
13.B Proctor
12 J Barrett
10 D Mac
9 C Roigard8.H.Sotutu
7. A Savea
6.W Sititi
5.F Holland
4.S Barrett
3.T Lomax
2.C Taylor
1.T WilliamsE Narawa
B Barrett
C Ratima
D Kirifi
T Vai
F Newall
P Tosi
S TaukeiahoI know Hoskings would never get a look in but that back row would be out the gate , i dont see Holland as an off the bench player but hes a big lineout target
given we dont have a rangy 6 .
Narawa gets the outside cover role because he can play midfield and wing
Thought a bit about Fihaki as he can cover wing a fullback and has a massive boot , Tavatavanawai i know would bring so much energy off the bench
I would suggest there are some viable options in this space depending on whom you were playing
Tangitau brings some extra wheels ,stuck with Clark as he creates opportunites with his kickoff chase game , and does offer that power gameHoping Tosi can play both sides , dont rate De Groot
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@frugby said in All Blacks 2025:
intrigued to see CLW rewarded with the spot at eight.
CLW is a good player, and they obviously rate him as he stayed with the ABs on the EOYT. But, he is another undersized loose forward. They seem to like them though.
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Apart from one wing, the backline picks itself. Is Tangitau good under the highball and is his defensive positioning good enough? If not, a long night of high balls would be coming his way.
Love seems like the natural option at 23. 22 is a question mark.If Sitit and Savea are in the same back row, and big 6 with good ruck work is a must. The forward lock and backrow bench is a big question mark. If Kirifi is 20, then it’s a massive burden on the three locks and 6. We need players that can go toe to toe with the South Africans and French.
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@Canes4life said in All Blacks 2025:
In all seriousness though I’m just hoping Proctor at least gets more of a chance to show what he has at international level because he was the best centre in Super Rugby last year and in his first start in 2025 he arguably has already had the best game by a centre this season when you factor in the opposition and where they played.
Ioane and Leinert-Brown have had plenty of time to nail down the 13 AB jersey and haven’t. No point in the ABs doing the same shit because we’ll just get the same results. No better opportunity to give Proctor an opportunity outside Jordie against an understrength French side in July as well.
I am joining your bandwagon @Canes4life
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@Canes4life said in All Blacks 2025:
Ioane and Leinert-Brown have had plenty of time to nail down the 13 AB jersey and haven’t.
Reiko was good on D last year but hasn't kicked on in setting up players. He's only 28 so I'd expect Robertson will stick with him as his no. 1 for now. No excuse for not giving Proctor more game-time though - ee really need to give Billy P plenty of time against France and hopefully a start in at least one game.
In ALB's case, it's fair to say he's been mucked about so much it's been difficult for him to do that. I do think he's an ideal bench player to enable us to develop new players as 12/13 with his versatility.
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What, no one is on the FAB Hurricane Higgins bandwagon? You lot are getting so sensible in your autumn years..
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It was only a couple of seasons ago that Billy Proctor's five-year contract was largely considered one of the worst deals done in contracting history and Peter Umaga-Jensen and Bailyn Sullivan were being regularly touted as All-Blacks-in-waiting... How things change.
Provided Proctor is showing decent form throughout the rest of the season, he has definitely earned a few starts at 13 for the All Blacks, especially now that ALB is out of action for a decent length of time and there's not really anyone else in consideration. If it were me, Proctor would be starting in the midfield in two Tests against France and if that doesn't pan out, Razor can revert back to Ioane for the two games against Argentina to kick off the Rugby Championship before the Boks come a calling.
Taylor, Taukei'aho and Aumua will be the three hookers selected for July without a doubt. Taukei'aho has been in good form the past couple of weeks and Aumua showed enough improvement throughout the Test season in 2024 to remain in the squad. McAlister has been excellent for the past few years and it was likely only injuries that prevented him getting a call-up to the All Blacks. If there were a World Cup this year and one of the other three went down injured, he'd be the next cab off the ranks. Given that's not the case, however, I suspect Razor and co will look to invest in Moananu (but I'm sure both will feature for the All Blacks XV - it's a real shame neither of them are eligible for the MABs though).
If Love keeps playing (and performing) at 10 for the Hurricanes then he should be selected as the third option ahead of Perofeta and any other young flyhalves. He would be a considerably better bench player than Beauden Barrett moving forward, with McKenzie the obvious starting playmaker.
I can see Razor plumping for Holland ahead of Lord in the July squad with Lord left to the MABs for their games in Japan, unless he starts hitting his straps very quickly now that he's back (again) from injury for the Chiefs. Beehre is definitely there or thereabouts but Holland is next cab off the ranks.
Somewhat ironically, Razor doesn't think Christian Lio-Willie is big enough to play for the All Blacks. The only slightly left-field selection I can see in the loosies is Cam Christie, otherwise it'll be the same guys as last year.
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@Canes4life said in All Blacks 2025:
@george33 said in All Blacks 2025:
@sparky respect your opinion, but Proctor , just don't see it ,let's see how he goes in next couple months.,
It’s not only my opinion mate. The drums have been beating pretty loudly for Proctor to start for a while now and at some point he’ll be too hard to ignore.
I take it you didn’t watch his performance against the Brumbies on Saturday? Either that or you didn’t have your contacts in because he was all class on both sides of the ball and that’s what the ABs have been missing consistently in a centre for far too long.
Personally I wouldn’t mind if the ABs rolled out this team against the French. I’ve also included AJ Lam because for me he’s been pretty damn classy for the Blues and can cover wing if required.
- Williams
- Taylor
- Lomax
- Barrett
- Va’ai
- Sititi
- Lakai
- Savea
- Roigard
- McKenzie
- Ioane (I’d back him over Clarke)
- Barrett
- Proctor
- Jordan
- Love
- Taukei’aho
- De Groot
- Tosi
- Holland
- Kirifi
- Ratima
- Barrett
- Lam
It's the subtle stuff I see with Proctor.
Carrying the ball in two hands, pump fakes, delaying of pass etc.A centre needs to have some "rope a dope" in his arsenal. Proctor knows the assignment.
Is he test class? Who knows...but he is the next and most obvious cab off the rank.
Rieko is game as fuck to his credit and his scramble D is exemplary.
I really want him to succeed becasue I like that he is a bit of an arsehole (on the field anyway).But he isnt a centre, and I feel we have enough evidence now to say that with confidence.
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@Mr-Fish said in All Blacks 2025:
It was only a couple of seasons ago that Billy Proctor's five-year contract was largely considered one of the worst deals done in contracting history and Peter Umaga-Jensen and Bailyn Sullivan were being regularly touted as All-Blacks-in-waiting... How things change.
Provided Proctor is showing decent form throughout the rest of the season, he has definitely earned a few starts at 13 for the All Blacks, especially now that ALB is out of action for a decent length of time and there's not really anyone else in consideration. If it were me, Proctor would be starting in the midfield in two Tests against France and if that doesn't pan out, Razor can revert back to Ioane for the two games against Argentina to kick off the Rugby Championship before the Boks come a calling.
Taylor, Taukei'aho and Aumua will be the three hookers selected for July without a doubt. Taukei'aho has been in good form the past couple of weeks and Aumua showed enough improvement throughout the Test season in 2024 to remain in the squad. McAlister has been excellent for the past few years and it was likely only injuries that prevented him getting a call-up to the All Blacks. If there were a World Cup this year and one of the other three went down injured, he'd be the next cab off the ranks. Given that's not the case, however, I suspect Razor and co will look to invest in Moananu (but I'm sure both will feature for the All Blacks XV - it's a real shame neither of them are eligible for the MABs though).
If Love keeps playing (and performing) at 10 for the Hurricanes then he should be selected as the third option ahead of Perofeta and any other young flyhalves. He would be a considerably better bench player than Beauden Barrett moving forward, with McKenzie the obvious starting playmaker.
I can see Razor plumping for Holland ahead of Lord in the July squad with Lord left to the MABs for their games in Japan, unless he starts hitting his straps very quickly now that he's back (again) from injury for the Chiefs. Beehre is definitely there or thereabouts but Holland is next cab off the ranks.
Somewhat ironically, Razor doesn't think Christian Lio-Willie is big enough to play for the All Blacks. The only slightly left-field selection I can see in the loosies is Cam Christie, otherwise it'll be the same guys as last year.
Cam Christie is an insane take
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@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:
@Canes4life said in All Blacks 2025:
Ioane and Leinert-Brown have had plenty of time to nail down the 13 AB jersey and haven’t.
Reiko was good on D last year but hasn't kicked on in setting up players. He's only 28 so I'd expect Robertson will stick with him as his no. 1 for now. No excuse for not giving Proctor more game-time though - ee really need to give Billy P plenty of time against France and hopefully a start in at least one game.
In ALB's case, it's fair to say he's been mucked about so much it's been difficult for him to do that. I do think he's an ideal bench player to enable us to develop new players as 12/13 with his versatility.
For ALB to have racked up 81 caps and not be a consensus pick at either 12,13 or bench says it all really.
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@Jet said in All Blacks 2025:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:
@Canes4life said in All Blacks 2025:
Ioane and Leinert-Brown have had plenty of time to nail down the 13 AB jersey and haven’t.
Reiko was good on D last year but hasn't kicked on in setting up players. He's only 28 so I'd expect Robertson will stick with him as his no. 1 for now. No excuse for not giving Proctor more game-time though - ee really need to give Billy P plenty of time against France and hopefully a start in at least one game.
In ALB's case, it's fair to say he's been mucked about so much it's been difficult for him to do that. I do think he's an ideal bench player to enable us to develop new players as 12/13 with his versatility.
For ALB to have racked up 81 caps and not be a consensus pick at either 12,13 or bench says it all really.
He'd be my no.1 pick on the bench right now. Fucked around by every AB coach (esp. Foster) since he debuted and never allowed to settle. His talent was wasted IMHO
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Everybody picks De Groot as the reserve LHP. His form has been abysmal this season. He hasn't shown any sign of physicality. Is he carrying a niggle ? On current form, my bench LHP would be Norris who has improved a lot at scrum time. He has a huge workrate and is certainly the most dynamic prop in NZ at the moment, Xavier Numia not being the same player he was last year.
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@1kiwi said in All Blacks 2025:
ALB gone for the season
Poor bastard. The AB Midfield Injury Curse strikes again
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@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:
@1kiwi said in All Blacks 2025:
ALB gone for the season
Poor bastard. The AB Midfield Injury Curse strikes again
Opens up a spot on the bench now. The reaction will be interesting when it's David Havili (I assume).
