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@rembrandt said in Aussie Politics:
I don't watch any TV but it seemed like the Liberals had no real visibility, are they low on funds or something?
A lot of the funding was tied up in litigation, whose fault it was is up for debate. It all got there in the end but too late.
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The sooner the Liberals have it out, the better off they'll be, There's literally no way they can win a Federal election by pursuing votes on the far right - there simply aren't enough up for grabs.
When your own polling is telling you your base is embarrassed to vote for you and is deserting you, take note, take action.
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@antipodean said in Aussie Politics:
The sooner the Liberals have it out, the better off they'll be, There's literally no way they can win a Federal election by pursuing votes on the far right - there simply aren't enough up for grabs.
When your own polling is telling you your base is embarrassed to vote for you and is deserting you, take note, take action.
How are they pursuing votes on the far-right?
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By listening to these lunatics in the media:
- Miranda Devine thinks the Coalition got torched in Victoria because they didn’t freak out enough about Safe Schools. This would presumably be news to literally anyone who, unlike Miranda, occasionally thinks about other things.
- Alan Jones, who does not live in Victoria and doesn’t really seem to know anything about it, addressed Sky from his apartment next to the Opera House where he railed against the Libs for not going hard enough about gang crime – one of the few things they actually campaigned on – before claiming that it doesn’t matter anyway because Scott Morrison is a much better campaigner.
- Tony Abbott‘s former chief of staff Peta Credlin made the frankly astounding claim on Sky that the fact a terrorist attack happened in Melbourne made it much harder for the Opposition to get terrorism on the agenda. What? What?
- The black hole of stupidity that is Outsiders featured Rowan Dean and Piers Akerman claiming that “something needs to change” in the Liberal Party, despite the fact something has already changed, about three months ago, that they desperately wanted.
- Ray Hadley‘s big lesson from all of this is that the Coalition needs to promise to build a coal-fired power station. Okay.
- The Sydney Morning Herald has published an op-ed from a Liberal Party activist who says that the lesson for NSW Premier Gladys Berejiklian is that she needs to become more right-wing. Of course.
https://www.pedestrian.tv/news/victoria-election-liberal-party/
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@antipodean said in Aussie Politics:
By listening to these lunatics in the media:
- Miranda Devine thinks the Coalition got torched in Victoria because they didn’t freak out enough about Safe Schools. This would presumably be news to literally anyone who, unlike Miranda, occasionally thinks about other things.
- Alan Jones, who does not live in Victoria and doesn’t really seem to know anything about it, addressed Sky from his apartment next to the Opera House where he railed against the Libs for not going hard enough about gang crime – one of the few things they actually campaigned on – before claiming that it doesn’t matter anyway because Scott Morrison is a much better campaigner.
- Tony Abbott‘s former chief of staff Peta Credlin made the frankly astounding claim on Sky that the fact a terrorist attack happened in Melbourne made it much harder for the Opposition to get terrorism on the agenda. What? What?
- The black hole of stupidity that is Outsiders featured Rowan Dean and Piers Akerman claiming that “something needs to change” in the Liberal Party, despite the fact something has already changed, about three months ago, that they desperately wanted.
- Ray Hadley‘s big lesson from all of this is that the Coalition needs to promise to build a coal-fired power station. Okay.
- The Sydney Morning Herald has published an op-ed from a Liberal Party activist who says that the lesson for NSW Premier Gladys Berejiklian is that she needs to become more right-wing. Of course.
https://www.pedestrian.tv/news/victoria-election-liberal-party/
Those are journalists right, not the liberal party itself? But, just looking at those opinions of journalists (not the party itself) what is exactly far-right? Safe Schools is a concern for many kids of people, both left and right. The gang problem the same. The same with power prices. Pauline Hanson specially targeting Asians and Muslims is far-right, as is some God botherer trying to impose moral censorship on everyone (that Haradine bastard back in the day). You cannot seriously call the above far-right surely?
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@rancid-schnitzel said in Aussie Politics:
@antipodean said in Aussie Politics:
By listening to these lunatics in the media:
- Miranda Devine thinks the Coalition got torched in Victoria because they didn’t freak out enough about Safe Schools. This would presumably be news to literally anyone who, unlike Miranda, occasionally thinks about other things.
- Alan Jones, who does not live in Victoria and doesn’t really seem to know anything about it, addressed Sky from his apartment next to the Opera House where he railed against the Libs for not going hard enough about gang crime – one of the few things they actually campaigned on – before claiming that it doesn’t matter anyway because Scott Morrison is a much better campaigner.
- Tony Abbott‘s former chief of staff Peta Credlin made the frankly astounding claim on Sky that the fact a terrorist attack happened in Melbourne made it much harder for the Opposition to get terrorism on the agenda. What? What?
- The black hole of stupidity that is Outsiders featured Rowan Dean and Piers Akerman claiming that “something needs to change” in the Liberal Party, despite the fact something has already changed, about three months ago, that they desperately wanted.
- Ray Hadley‘s big lesson from all of this is that the Coalition needs to promise to build a coal-fired power station. Okay.
- The Sydney Morning Herald has published an op-ed from a Liberal Party activist who says that the lesson for NSW Premier Gladys Berejiklian is that she needs to become more right-wing. Of course.
https://www.pedestrian.tv/news/victoria-election-liberal-party/
Those are journalists right, not the liberal party itself? But, just looking at those opinions of journalists (not the party itself) what is exactly far-right? Safe Schools is a concern for many kids of people, both left and right. The gang problem the same. The same with power prices. Pauline Hanson specially targeting Asians and Muslims is far-right, as is some God botherer trying to impose moral censorship on everyone (that Haradine bastard back in the day). You cannot seriously call the above far-right surely?
If safe schools was a concern, it didn't play out in the results. Ditto with power pricing, gang crime etc. The problem is the Liberal Party is trying to get back the lunatics voting for the fringe (e.g. PHON). Those preferences you can count on, it's the middle that wins elections and the current party is riven by perception the religious and non-scientific nut jobs are in control.
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@antipodean said in Aussie Politics:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Aussie Politics:
@antipodean said in Aussie Politics:
By listening to these lunatics in the media:
- Miranda Devine thinks the Coalition got torched in Victoria because they didn’t freak out enough about Safe Schools. This would presumably be news to literally anyone who, unlike Miranda, occasionally thinks about other things.
- Alan Jones, who does not live in Victoria and doesn’t really seem to know anything about it, addressed Sky from his apartment next to the Opera House where he railed against the Libs for not going hard enough about gang crime – one of the few things they actually campaigned on – before claiming that it doesn’t matter anyway because Scott Morrison is a much better campaigner.
- Tony Abbott‘s former chief of staff Peta Credlin made the frankly astounding claim on Sky that the fact a terrorist attack happened in Melbourne made it much harder for the Opposition to get terrorism on the agenda. What? What?
- The black hole of stupidity that is Outsiders featured Rowan Dean and Piers Akerman claiming that “something needs to change” in the Liberal Party, despite the fact something has already changed, about three months ago, that they desperately wanted.
- Ray Hadley‘s big lesson from all of this is that the Coalition needs to promise to build a coal-fired power station. Okay.
- The Sydney Morning Herald has published an op-ed from a Liberal Party activist who says that the lesson for NSW Premier Gladys Berejiklian is that she needs to become more right-wing. Of course.
https://www.pedestrian.tv/news/victoria-election-liberal-party/
Those are journalists right, not the liberal party itself? But, just looking at those opinions of journalists (not the party itself) what is exactly far-right? Safe Schools is a concern for many kids of people, both left and right. The gang problem the same. The same with power prices. Pauline Hanson specially targeting Asians and Muslims is far-right, as is some God botherer trying to impose moral censorship on everyone (that Haradine bastard back in the day). You cannot seriously call the above far-right surely?
If safe schools was a concern, it didn't play out in the results. Ditto with power pricing, gang crime etc. The problem is the Liberal Party is trying to get back the lunatics voting for the fringe (e.g. PHON). Those preferences you can count on, it's the middle that wins elections and the current party is riven by perception the religious and non-scientific nut jobs are in control.
This was an incumbent, first term govt. Just because those issues didn't swing an election doesn't mean they are irrelevant or that they are somehow an appeal to win over the far right. Sometimes it's impossible to get your message across regardless of the incompetence of the govt. Just look at Labour in Qld under Beatty and Bligh. Claiming that it's just a desperate attempt to win over lunatics is laying it on incredibly thick.
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@rancid-schnitzel said in Aussie Politics:
@antipodean said in Aussie Politics:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Aussie Politics:
@antipodean said in Aussie Politics:
By listening to these lunatics in the media:
- Miranda Devine thinks the Coalition got torched in Victoria because they didn’t freak out enough about Safe Schools. This would presumably be news to literally anyone who, unlike Miranda, occasionally thinks about other things.
- Alan Jones, who does not live in Victoria and doesn’t really seem to know anything about it, addressed Sky from his apartment next to the Opera House where he railed against the Libs for not going hard enough about gang crime – one of the few things they actually campaigned on – before claiming that it doesn’t matter anyway because Scott Morrison is a much better campaigner.
- Tony Abbott‘s former chief of staff Peta Credlin made the frankly astounding claim on Sky that the fact a terrorist attack happened in Melbourne made it much harder for the Opposition to get terrorism on the agenda. What? What?
- The black hole of stupidity that is Outsiders featured Rowan Dean and Piers Akerman claiming that “something needs to change” in the Liberal Party, despite the fact something has already changed, about three months ago, that they desperately wanted.
- Ray Hadley‘s big lesson from all of this is that the Coalition needs to promise to build a coal-fired power station. Okay.
- The Sydney Morning Herald has published an op-ed from a Liberal Party activist who says that the lesson for NSW Premier Gladys Berejiklian is that she needs to become more right-wing. Of course.
https://www.pedestrian.tv/news/victoria-election-liberal-party/
Those are journalists right, not the liberal party itself? But, just looking at those opinions of journalists (not the party itself) what is exactly far-right? Safe Schools is a concern for many kids of people, both left and right. The gang problem the same. The same with power prices. Pauline Hanson specially targeting Asians and Muslims is far-right, as is some God botherer trying to impose moral censorship on everyone (that Haradine bastard back in the day). You cannot seriously call the above far-right surely?
If safe schools was a concern, it didn't play out in the results. Ditto with power pricing, gang crime etc. The problem is the Liberal Party is trying to get back the lunatics voting for the fringe (e.g. PHON). Those preferences you can count on, it's the middle that wins elections and the current party is riven by perception the religious and non-scientific nut jobs are in control.
This was an incumbent, first term govt. Just because those issues didn't swing an election doesn't mean they are irrelevant or that they are somehow an appeal to win over the far right. Sometimes it's impossible to get your message across regardless of the incompetence of the govt. Just look at Labour in Qld under Beatty and Bligh. Claiming that it's just a desperate attempt to win over lunatics is laying it on incredibly thick.
How else do you explain getting wiped out? no one can be deluding themselves that Vic Labor are doing such a sterling job they should be returned in a landslide, so the alternative explanation is the utter uselessness of the opposition party.
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@antipodean said in Aussie Politics:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Aussie Politics:
@antipodean said in Aussie Politics:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Aussie Politics:
@antipodean said in Aussie Politics:
By listening to these lunatics in the media:
- Miranda Devine thinks the Coalition got torched in Victoria because they didn’t freak out enough about Safe Schools. This would presumably be news to literally anyone who, unlike Miranda, occasionally thinks about other things.
- Alan Jones, who does not live in Victoria and doesn’t really seem to know anything about it, addressed Sky from his apartment next to the Opera House where he railed against the Libs for not going hard enough about gang crime – one of the few things they actually campaigned on – before claiming that it doesn’t matter anyway because Scott Morrison is a much better campaigner.
- Tony Abbott‘s former chief of staff Peta Credlin made the frankly astounding claim on Sky that the fact a terrorist attack happened in Melbourne made it much harder for the Opposition to get terrorism on the agenda. What? What?
- The black hole of stupidity that is Outsiders featured Rowan Dean and Piers Akerman claiming that “something needs to change” in the Liberal Party, despite the fact something has already changed, about three months ago, that they desperately wanted.
- Ray Hadley‘s big lesson from all of this is that the Coalition needs to promise to build a coal-fired power station. Okay.
- The Sydney Morning Herald has published an op-ed from a Liberal Party activist who says that the lesson for NSW Premier Gladys Berejiklian is that she needs to become more right-wing. Of course.
https://www.pedestrian.tv/news/victoria-election-liberal-party/
Those are journalists right, not the liberal party itself? But, just looking at those opinions of journalists (not the party itself) what is exactly far-right? Safe Schools is a concern for many kids of people, both left and right. The gang problem the same. The same with power prices. Pauline Hanson specially targeting Asians and Muslims is far-right, as is some God botherer trying to impose moral censorship on everyone (that Haradine bastard back in the day). You cannot seriously call the above far-right surely?
If safe schools was a concern, it didn't play out in the results. Ditto with power pricing, gang crime etc. The problem is the Liberal Party is trying to get back the lunatics voting for the fringe (e.g. PHON). Those preferences you can count on, it's the middle that wins elections and the current party is riven by perception the religious and non-scientific nut jobs are in control.
This was an incumbent, first term govt. Just because those issues didn't swing an election doesn't mean they are irrelevant or that they are somehow an appeal to win over the far right. Sometimes it's impossible to get your message across regardless of the incompetence of the govt. Just look at Labour in Qld under Beatty and Bligh. Claiming that it's just a desperate attempt to win over lunatics is laying it on incredibly thick.
How else do you explain getting wiped out? no one can be deluding themselves that Vic Labor are doing such a sterling job they should be returned in a landslide, so the alternative explanation is the utter uselessness of the opposition party.
Wiped out?
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@rancid-schnitzel said in Aussie Politics:
Wiped out?
Permit me the slightest hyperbole as the party sheds seats, with a swing against it of 6% taking it's primary vote to 30%.
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@antipodean said in Aussie Politics:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Aussie Politics:
Wiped out?
Permit me the slightest hyperbole as the party sheds seats, with a swing against it of 6% taking it's primary vote to 30%.
Look I get the whole incompetence thing. I get people want stability and I get how some people will just hate a party because they hate their leader, regardless of what they have to say. But you've yet to explain how the issues you outlined above are some kind of desperate attempt to court the far right.
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@rancid-schnitzel said in Aussie Politics:
@antipodean said in Aussie Politics:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Aussie Politics:
Wiped out?
Permit me the slightest hyperbole as the party sheds seats, with a swing against it of 6% taking it's primary vote to 30%.
Look I get the whole incompetence thing. I get people want stability and I get how some people will just hate a party because they hate their leader, regardless of what they have to say. But you've yet to explain how the issues you outlined above are some kind of desperate attempt to court the far right.
What do you think Abetz, Abbott, Dutton, Andrews, Seselja, Hastie etc. are doing? That's before we witness the Vic Liberal Party stacking social conservatives in it.
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@antipodean said in Aussie Politics:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Aussie Politics:
@antipodean said in Aussie Politics:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Aussie Politics:
Wiped out?
Permit me the slightest hyperbole as the party sheds seats, with a swing against it of 6% taking it's primary vote to 30%.
Look I get the whole incompetence thing. I get people want stability and I get how some people will just hate a party because they hate their leader, regardless of what they have to say. But you've yet to explain how the issues you outlined above are some kind of desperate attempt to court the far right.
What do you think Abetz, Abbott, Dutton, Andrews, Seselja, Hastie etc. are doing? That's before we witness the Vic Liberal Party stacking social conservatives in it.
Examples please.
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@rancid-schnitzel said in Aussie Politics:
@antipodean said in Aussie Politics:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Aussie Politics:
@antipodean said in Aussie Politics:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Aussie Politics:
Wiped out?
Permit me the slightest hyperbole as the party sheds seats, with a swing against it of 6% taking it's primary vote to 30%.
Look I get the whole incompetence thing. I get people want stability and I get how some people will just hate a party because they hate their leader, regardless of what they have to say. But you've yet to explain how the issues you outlined above are some kind of desperate attempt to court the far right.
What do you think Abetz, Abbott, Dutton, Andrews, Seselja, Hastie etc. are doing? That's before we witness the Vic Liberal Party stacking social conservatives in it.
Examples please.
Examples of the above named supporting a social conservative policy position?
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@antipodean said in Aussie Politics:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Aussie Politics:
@antipodean said in Aussie Politics:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Aussie Politics:
@antipodean said in Aussie Politics:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Aussie Politics:
Wiped out?
Permit me the slightest hyperbole as the party sheds seats, with a swing against it of 6% taking it's primary vote to 30%.
Look I get the whole incompetence thing. I get people want stability and I get how some people will just hate a party because they hate their leader, regardless of what they have to say. But you've yet to explain how the issues you outlined above are some kind of desperate attempt to court the far right.
What do you think Abetz, Abbott, Dutton, Andrews, Seselja, Hastie etc. are doing? That's before we witness the Vic Liberal Party stacking social conservatives in it.
Examples please.
Examples of the above named supporting a social conservative policy position?
No. Actively courting the far right or lunatics. Unless you deem socially conservative to be far right. In which case, there is no further point in continuing this discussion.
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@rancid-schnitzel said in Aussie Politics:
the alarm bells in Canberra then! Ffs.
Btw anyone who thinks the Libs can improve their polling position by going hard on climate change is absolutely kidding themselves.Liberal MP Tim Wilson, may disagree with you:
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@nta said in Aussie Politics:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Aussie Politics:
the alarm bells in Canberra then! Ffs.
Btw anyone who thinks the Libs can improve their polling position by going hard on climate change is absolutely kidding themselves.Liberal MP Tim Wilson, may disagree with you:
Cherry picking much?
Yes, both him and his constituents are certainly representative of the population at large. For a balanced view on capitalism, let's cross over to Adam Bandt.
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@rancid-schnitzel said in Aussie Politics:
Cherry picking much?
Yes, both him and his constituents are certainly representative of the population at large.They're a fair bit closer than the LNP whacko religious right, holed up in their echo chamber/compound, thinking they need to go MORE right to "appeal to the base".
The issue is that people like Abbott, Abetz, Andrews and, yes Dutton, have effectively created a second base further out than where the Libs traditionally sit. And that makes it hard to appeal to all of them. As @antipodean said: there aren't enough votes way out in the far right of centre to make a difference.
If the swing vote starts to desert the Liberals, they're sunk. That's where elections are won and lost.
The moves are already starting as they realise their grip is getting tenuous. These two might find their rhetoric and voter popularity gets them isolated:
Jim Molan pulls out of Q&A after being relegated on Coalition's Senate ticket
Liberal senator says he cannot bring himself to defend his party after preselectors drop him to unwinnable position
Craig Kelly won't rule out crossbench switch if he loses Liberal preselection
Colleagues anticipate outspoken conservative MP will run as an independent if he is dumped from seat of Hughes
Now, I completely get you don't like Turnbull at all because he was only in it for himself. These guys are equally as bad.
But I think its the right move - the Libs have shown they are no more united than the ALP back was in the Rudd/Gillard/Rudd days. They can limit the damage in May by starting to tiptoe back to the centre, and cut some of their loony fringe away at the election booth.
They could even return to government next time around, having decided on a unified direction. Let's face it: Labor are hardly operating under dizzying competence.
In any case, the next battleground at this stage is NSW, and here I think the Libs are giving themselves a glimmer of hope with a few recent policy announcements. Not the fucking light rail that has turned the CBD into an even bigger shit hole, of course.
I'd be keen to get @barbarian 's opinion on the new opposition leader, who from what I've seen is miles ahead of Luke Foley.
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