Coronavirus - New Zealand
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@No-Quarter said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
If Adern is warning against "border perfection" - I.E. expect there to be issues at the border and breaches - then why in the ever living fuck are we striving for complete elimination? That means we have to keep locking down every time it gets in. Which is just such a fucking absurd idea I don't even know where to begin. We are facing economic ruin at the hands of an idiotic government.
She is being ridiculous. Perfection, as we have already seen, is unattainable. What I expect is a robust testing regime for border and quarantine workers. Just as Trump has his sleepy Joe, we have our clueless Cindy
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@Kirwan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@canefan She is just trying to setup her opponents/critics as asking for something unattainable. Where in realtity we are asking for basic competenance and a primary school understanding of the world quarantine.
The opposition parties need to focus on the testing. That is the real crime here
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"And we can produce for Australia, for New Zealand, for our South Pacific region to help others."
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@Tim said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
"And we can produce for Australia, for New Zealand, for our South Pacific region to help others."
Tim, what are your thoughts on this. Do you think this is near future (2020, early 2021) or quite some time away?
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It would also be nice if at the press conferences they could have someone talking about the predicted economic impacts of the lockdown and what that means in layman's terms to people in New Zealand. Really lay that out so NZers actually know what we are getting ourselves in to.
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@Hooroo Some phase III trials might end in that period, but with manufacturing lag I'd expect mid 2021 at the earliest, and availability in NZ for end 2021 at the earliest. Could be wrong, haven't checked timelines again recently.
Big trials don't always go to plan (vast majority of new drug candidates fail), so it's good that there are about 20 candidates in trials.
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@No-Quarter said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
Really lay that out to NZers actually know what we are getting ourselves in to.
Sadly I think that most of us already know - we just don't want to talk about it - or hear it...which is why they don't say anything.
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@Snowy said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@No-Quarter said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
Really lay that out to NZers actually know what we are getting ourselves in to.
Sadly I think that most of us already know - we just don't want to talk about it - or hear it...which is why they don't say anything.
See I don't know about that. I think plenty are in denial, or don't appreciate the linkage between gov debt and their economic future.
You're making the mistake of assuming that the extraordinary levels of intellect in the Fern is representative of the wider population 😉
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@Hooroo my brother in law works in pharma (cancer drugs most recently) and he said the other day not to expect anything before mid 2021, they'll want to do pretty full on testing before rolling out something to pretty much the whole world
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@voodoo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Snowy said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@No-Quarter said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
Really lay that out to NZers actually know what we are getting ourselves in to.
Sadly I think that most of us already know - we just don't want to talk about it - or hear it...which is why they don't say anything.
See I don't know about that. I think plenty are in denial, or don't appreciate the linkage between gov debt and their economic future.
You're making the mistake of assuming that the extraordinary levels of intellect in the Fern is representative of the wider population 😉
There's probably a bit of a disconnect between people that are out of work right now, and people that are still sitting pretty in their job thinking it won't happen to them.
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@No-Quarter thats a little harsh, im lucky enough to still be working (lockdown in melbourne) but am very much aware no work might be just around the corner and have been, if not planning for, keeping an eye on how to keep going without the same income
i hear all this talk about people spending up large online shopping during lockdown on social/press but when i actually talk to my work mates/friends they all seem to have been trying to save a penny (no tolls, public transport, bought lunch) in case the worst happens
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@No-Quarter Economic activity for the June 1/4 was down 13% nationally although some of the regions did much better.
The month of June was 0.9% up on 2019 while July was up 2%.
Largely fueled by consumer spending.
Sept /Oct would have been the crunch months as the wage subsidy came off but second lockdown has muddied the waters.
General economic consensus appears to be that NZ economy is weathering the pandemic better than most, validating to an extent govt's assertion of a go hard go early approach is better for health and economic outcomes.
Clear evidence that while sports journo's and AB selectors follow the Fern assiduously, economists do not.
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@Kiwiwomble yeah I was generalising for sure - I'm like you, safe in my job and further to that it's unlikely to go anywhere as my work is the least impacted by all of this. I'm just surprised by how many people are supportive of these lockdowns with little consideration for the economy and what that actually mean for real people.
Also, I agree with you re: online shopping. My wife runs a little online store and her sales have slowed big time, particularly after this second lockdown. Thankfully that's more of a side income for us and we can get by on my salary, but I'd hate to think what it's like for business owners who have invested everything, it must be stressful as hell.
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@dogmeat said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@No-Quarter Economic activity for the June 1/4 was down 13% nationally although some of the regions did much better.
The month of June was 0.9% up on 2019 while July was up 2%.
Largely fueled by consumer spending.
Sept /Oct would have been the crunch months as the wage subsidy came off but second lockdown has muddied the waters.
General economic consensus appears to be that NZ economy is weathering the pandemic better than most, validating to an extent govt's assertion of a go hard go early approach is better for health and economic outcomes.
Clear evidence that while sports journo's and AB selectors follow the Fern assiduously, economists do not.
I'm no economist so am well outside my sphere of expertise here, but I would expect second and third lockdowns to really start hitting us hard. One lockdown and then restrictions lifted is one thing, further lockdowns and the PM herself saying expect more as the border is not ever going to be secure is quite another. People are getting extremely anxious about their financial situation now.
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Collins has labelled the Government's testing and border controls sub-standard. They propose a new agency to oversee quarantine and covid19 border control in anticipation for ongoing challenges from covid19 and future viral threats
Meanwhile the government looks reactive, talking about increasing CCTV at quarantine facilities, and bluetooth tracing. Can no one see they are talking out their ass? They had months to sort stuff out. Now defence facilities could be used to quarantine, why now? Cindy is out front with her signature caring frown while her team are asleep at the wheel. And we all paying the price. Not that I expect the sheeple in the electorate to see any of it
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@No-Quarter said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Kiwiwomble yeah I was generalising for sure - I'm like you, safe in my job and further to that it's unlikely to go anywhere as my work is the least impacted by all of this. I'm just surprised by how many people are supportive of these lockdowns with little consideration for the economy and what that actually mean for real people.
Also, I agree with you re: online shopping. My wife runs a little online store and her sales have slowed big time, particularly after this second lockdown. Thankfully that's more of a side income for us and we can get by on my salary, but I'd hate to think what it's like for business owners who have invested everything, it must be stressful as hell.
i think, and ive heard this from others too, there is a completely simplistic view of things
an economy isn't actually alive...so it cant die, in any reasonably capitalist society a new economy will rise pretty quick from any failed one...there'll just be some real rough times inbewteen
people are alive and cant come back once theyre gone
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@No-Quarter Westpac have done some forecasting on the impact on a second 6 week L4 lockdown and said it would not have as serious an impact as first time round. I only caught the beginning of the report on RNZ as it started as I arrived at work but what I caught was tourism etc are already totally fucked - they don't get a train run on them. That might not have been the analogy the Westpac guy used....
Overall it appears the economy is holding up better than most but obviously there are sectors that have been really badly impacted. However this has been offset by many that have suffered no impact at all -agriculture, freight etc and a few that have done well.
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@No-Quarter said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
If Adern is warning against "border perfection" - I.E. expect there to be issues at the border and breaches - then why in the ever living fuck are we striving for complete elimination? That means we have to keep locking down every time it gets in. Which is just such a fucking absurd idea I don't even know where to begin. We are facing economic ruin at the hands of an idiotic government.
I'm reading it a little bit differently. I'm wondering if a combination of:
- The ruling out of Auckland moving to Level 4
- Talk of a Level 1.5
- Not locking down Tokoroa, or sending the wider Waikato region to Level 3
... along with those border comments is a sign that there's a softening up of people for 'as good as we can but not perfect' Covid control (i.e. not regularly going to full-on lockdowns) while the wait for rapid tests/vaccines continues.
Highly anecdotally, the feeling around here seems to be that while Level 2 isn't ideal, but we can make it work for now. Also an interesting sign that all the rest homes have gone straight to Level 4.