NZ and World Rugby Awards 2020
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@Stargazer said in NZ and World Rugby Awards 2020:
World Rugby Awards
World Rugby Men’s 15s Team of the Decade
North at 14 feels like a push, I don't know if Jonny May plays at 14, but he'd be another option here who has been good and dangerous for years on end. I can also see the argument for having Folau at 15 and Smith at 14 too.
O'Driscoll at 13 is silly - he was basically gone in the early part of the decade. If they are picking the best players to have played in the decade, then perhaps, but his best work wasn't this decade. No way. If it isn't Smith here, then Jean de Villiers or Wesley Fofana would be better picks.
Although I think Smith was the best halfback of the decade, I can just live with Murray, given that he was a huge part of the success of Ireland and the Lions.
Number 8 is a joke - this has to be Vermeulen.
At 6, how it can't be Kaino, Dusatoir, or even Steph du Toit is completely beyond me.
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@Stargazer How does the winner of the women's 15s player of the decade not make their team of the decade?
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@Dice said in NZ and World Rugby Awards 2020:
Is Kieran Read not liked on here anymore?
Surprised no one has mentioned him for the 8 spot.
if we are honest, one team dominated the ver loving fuck out of the decade, and it would not be a big call to just stick 15 ABs in there.
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@mariner4life said in NZ and World Rugby Awards 2020:
@Dice said in NZ and World Rugby Awards 2020:
Is Kieran Read not liked on here anymore?
Surprised no one has mentioned him for the 8 spot.
if we are honest, one team dominated the ver loving fuck out of the decade, and it would not be a big call to just stick 15 ABs in there.
Two time RWC winner and 2013 POTY and most people here wouldn’t have him as their first choice. Quite astounding.
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@Kiwiwomble said in NZ and World Rugby Awards 2020:
@Dice I don't know if i'll get roasted, he was great and deserved his AB spot...but I really felt he was only "best in the world" for a couple of years
All due respect to Vermuelen, who is an amazing player, but when was he ever in the conversation as the best in the world other than on 2019?
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@junior said in NZ and World Rugby Awards 2020:
@mariner4life said in NZ and World Rugby Awards 2020:
@Dice said in NZ and World Rugby Awards 2020:
Is Kieran Read not liked on here anymore?
Surprised no one has mentioned him for the 8 spot.
if we are honest, one team dominated the ver loving fuck out of the decade, and it would not be a big call to just stick 15 ABs in there.
Two time RWC winner and 2013 POTY and most people here wouldn’t have him as their first choice. Quite astounding.
POTY is nice, but they gave it to Dusatoir over Jerome in 2011. Flabbers were gasted, but we had the Monkey Off The Back, so it slid.
Read was sensational for a long time, but the last few years still feel a bit raw. Wild eyes, etc. None of the highlights reels, but still broke a few people in half from time to time. Seriously good player.
But Vermeulen was next level.
I had more issues with Fall Over Owen, and Coulda Doid, and most of all Smith.
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@nzzp said in NZ and World Rugby Awards 2020:
@junior said in NZ and World Rugby Awards 2020:
@mariner4life said in NZ and World Rugby Awards 2020:
@Dice said in NZ and World Rugby Awards 2020:
Is Kieran Read not liked on here anymore?
Surprised no one has mentioned him for the 8 spot.
if we are honest, one team dominated the ver loving fuck out of the decade, and it would not be a big call to just stick 15 ABs in there.
Two time RWC winner and 2013 POTY and most people here wouldn’t have him as their first choice. Quite astounding.
POTY is nice, but they gave it to Dusatoir over Jerome in 2011. Flabbers were gasted, but we had the Monkey Off The Back, so it slid.
Read was sensational for a long time, but the last few years still feel a bit raw. Wild eyes, etc. None of the highlights reels, but still broke a few people in half from time to time. Seriously good player.
But Vermeulen was next level.
I had more issues with Fall Over Owen, and Coulda Doid, and most of all Smith.
Using Dusatoir as an example here is a bit disingenuous, as we all know that you only need to have one goo game in a RWC year to pick up the award. When Read won it, he was the best player in far and away the best team in the world.
Also, although I agree he fell off a cliff post-2017, and he had his captaincy issues, that's largely irrelevant to a discussion about who was the best over a decade long period. Even if his cliff had happened post-2015, he's still got a body of 5 years' amazing work when he won 2x World Cups and 1x POTY. Again, what the actual fuck does Vermuelen have to show that compares to that?
I agree, Read's omission is not the most egregious in that list. What I can't fathom is just how underrated he is on this forum.
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@MajorRage said in NZ and World Rugby Awards 2020:
It's the wrong decade. That team is the best from 2005-2015.
2015-2020 would be a bloody tough decade to pick given how many teams played really well at various stages over that period
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@junior said in NZ and World Rugby Awards 2020:
I agree, Read's omission is not the most egregious in that list. What I can't fathom is just how underrated he is on this forum.
Recency bias. Since 2015, he didn't hit the heights he had previously. We've got short memories here.
Also, what have you done for me lately?
I looked up POTY by the way. From 09 to 17, it was All Blacks all the way - except our friend Thierry in 2011. GOAT got nominated 8 times, which is pretty good going consdiering.
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@Bovidae said in NZ and World Rugby Awards 2020:
@Stargazer How does the winner of the women's 15s player of the decade not make their team of the decade?
Democracy?
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See for me, the starting point is to take the 10 POTY's and include them on a mandatory basis. Although when you multiple players for one position, it completely falls apart (Barrett/Carter/Sexton, Dusatoir/PTSD)
Playing at a high level for 10 years is great, but being the best player of 1 year is arguably the bigger achievement. That's why I'd have no issues with Pieter Steph Du-Toit in the team over Pocock.
That's tough on Pocock, but thats how I'd do it.
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@junior said in NZ and World Rugby Awards 2020:
@Kiwiwomble said in NZ and World Rugby Awards 2020:
@Dice I don't know if i'll get roasted, he was great and deserved his AB spot...but I really felt he was only "best in the world" for a couple of years
All due respect to Vermuelen, who is an amazing player, but when was he ever in the conversation as the best in the world other than on 2019?
I don’t know
why ask me? -
@MajorRage said in NZ and World Rugby Awards 2020:
See for me, the starting point is to take the 10 POTY's and include them on a mandatory basis. Although when you multiple players for one position, it completely falls apart (Barrett/Carter/Sexton, Dusatoir/PTSD)
Playing at a high level for 10 years is great, but being the best player of 1 year is arguably the bigger achievement. That's why I'd have no issues with Pieter Steph Du-Toit in the team over Pocock.
That's tough on Pocock, but thats how I'd do it.
Those awards have been rooted for years though. The methodology at least was (I haven't looked in a few years) was a bit random (not all games are weighted equally, some are not weighted at all) and obviously has an arbitrary cycle and in World Cup years always seem to be a MoTM for the final/tournament.
I'm certainly not against giving McCaw more gongs though.
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Good AB prop, but I wondered if Franks was clearly no1. in his position.
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hmm and 14 is a bit contentious methinks.
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@Stargazer said in NZ and World Rugby Awards 2020:
World Rugby Awards
World Rugby Men’s 15s Team of the Decade
For comparison here is the TSF teams of the decade (AB & Foreign, plus 2nd XV's)
https://www.thesilverfern.com/post/413234-tsf-teams-of-the-decade
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