Reshuffling the All Blacks backline

tubbyj

I think Crotty lost out in the WC because they already had spades of what he offered. Ie leadership, organisation. If Conrad Smith went down injured I am sure he would have been first man on the plane and leapfrogged Fekitoa into the team.
 
Again I like Fekitoa and don't want to run him down as a footballer but I just don't see them going from Conrad Smith whose strength lay completely in those areas to Fekitoa who last year missed alot of tackles in the Black shirt and ran out of the line alot which he continues to do for the Highlanders even if he has been more sucessful so far (which I am sure was not all the AB selectors were asking of him). Defense is way to important to the way the All Blacks play and centre is the lynchpin position in the backline.
 
Fekiota made the WC squad ahead of Crotty as he is a very dynamic runner and covers 3 positions from 12 to wing. No way were they starting a WC knockout match with Crotty on the wing.
 
If Fekitoa starts this season I think it will probably be on the wing (if we are exposed there by injuries as we are at the moment) or at 12 inside of Crotty which is also a strong possibilty that should be added to my contenders in the above post..

Crucial

I get the argument for Crotty as the level head in the centres but I think Ngatai can also fill that role and has far more future in him as a long term AB

Frye

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Crucial" data-cid="567785" data-time="1459126721">
I get the argument for Crotty as the level head in the centres but I think Ngatai can also fill that role and has far more future in him as a long term AB</blockquote>
 
No brainer really. 
He has the same if not more leadership experience than Crotty. Better player, too. 
I think guys like McKenzie will get an opportunity in the third test after the Welsh have had their spirits well and truly broken.

No Quarter

So if we are to believe they will change as little as possible due to changes already being forced onto them, then I guess we have: 
15. B Smith 
14. 
13. 
12. 
11. Savea 
10. Cruden 
9. A Smith. 
Cruden is the obvious choice at 10 due to his experience and extended run of world class performances in Black pre-injury. 
They won't drop Savea on the back of Super form, that's not how these coaches have operated. His defense is still fine which is hugely important at test level. 
B Smith is the number 1 fullback and we will need plenty of experience from the back. 
14 was NMS or Naholo pre injury, so if neither of them are fit then we will have to try someone else. Moala probably has the inside running. 
Then it's down to Ngatai, Crotty and Fekitoa to fill 12/13. I'm not overly fussed who they choose but if we want experience then Fekitoa/Crotty get the nod, though Ngatai's form is very hard to deny at the moment. 
D Mac would be good from the bench but I can't see him getting past Barrett. TKB should be the reserve half back and one of Crotty/Fekitoa/Ngatai to cover the centres. 
I'm pretty happy with those players given who we are missing from the RWC.

Cantab79

My question with Ngatai is if he's as good as his fans have been saying is, why hasn't he had more opportunities? I understand that we've had a locked in midfield for years, but there have been some opportunities for new players to be brought into the midfield and consistently other players have been chosen over Ngatai. What is it about Ngatai that the selectors have struggled to embrace? It's not as if he's just burst onto the scene, he debuted six or seven years ago for the Canes.

bobily

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="tubbyj" data-cid="567783" data-time="1459126304">
<div>
I think Crotty lost out in the WC because they already had spades of what he offered. Ie leadership, organisation. If Conrad Smith went down injured I am sure he would have been first man on the plane and leapfrogged Fekitoa into the team.
 
Again I like Fekitoa and don't want to run him down as a footballer but I just don't see them going from Conrad Smith whose strength lay completely in those areas to Fekitoa who last year missed alot of tackles in the Black shirt and ran out of the line alot which he continues to do for the Highlanders even if he has been more sucessful so far (which I am sure was not all the AB selectors were asking of him). Defense is way to important to the way the All Blacks play and centre is the lynchpin position in the backline.
 
Fekiota made the WC squad ahead of Crotty as he is a very dynamic runner and covers 3 positions from 12 to wing. No way were they starting a WC knockout match with Crotty on the wing.
 
If Fekitoa starts this season I think it will probably be on the wing (if we are exposed there by injuries as we are at the moment) or at 12 inside of Crotty which is also a strong possibilty that should be added to my contenders in the above post..
</div>
</blockquote>
 
Fekitoa has not started any games at wing for the All Blacks. Ever. I doubt they'd be playing him on the wing in a knockout match, either. Except as a last resort where they couldn't bring someone in fast enough. If NMS and Naholo were out, I think they would have gone for Barrett at 15 and Smith and 14. So it would have required 3 injuries before that would have been an option, by which point they could have brought in Piutau.
 
Fekitoa definitely does push up on defense, but he tends to time it quite well. Additionally, the other Highlanders tend to push up with him. So it could very well be a part of the Highlanders tactics. In which case, if the All Blacks have a different pattern, I'm sure he could adapt to it.

Cantab79

Can I also just say that I think George Moala is the ideal no.23 to partner Barrett on the bench because he covers all the positions that BB doesn't (ie. 12, 13 and wing).

antipodean

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="tubbyj" data-cid="567783" data-time="1459126304">Fekiota made the WC squad ahead of Crotty</blockquote> That's the factual component of your post. With Wayne Smith in the coaching set up, Fekitoa's perceived frailties would be ironed out. No doubt during the selection meetings they canvassed the "what-if" scenario of Conrad going down and were more than happy with Malakai's ability to step in, particularly when they've opted for him to replace an unavailable Conrad in 2014. What makes you think something has changed?

bobily

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Cantab79" data-cid="567791" data-time="1459127657">
<div>
My question with Ngatai is if he's as good as his fans have been saying is, why hasn't he had more opportunities? I understand that we've had a locked in midfield for years, but there have been some opportunities for new players to be brought into the midfield and consistently other players have been chosen over Ngatai. What is it about Ngatai that the selectors have struggled to embrace? It's not as if he's just burst onto the scene, he debuted six or seven years ago for the Canes.
</div>
</blockquote>
 
He has always had all the skills, but has had a lot of problems getting consistent game time together due to injuries.

Unco

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="tubbyj" data-cid="567783" data-time="1459126304">
<div>
I think Crotty lost out in the WC because they already had spades of what he offered. Ie leadership, organisation. If Conrad Smith went down injured I am sure he would have been first man on the plane and leapfrogged Fekitoa into the team.
 
Again I like Fekitoa and don't want to run him down as a footballer but I just don't see them going from Conrad Smith whose strength lay completely in those areas to Fekitoa who last year missed alot of tackles in the Black shirt and ran out of the line alot which he continues to do for the Highlanders even if he has been more sucessful so far (which I am sure was not all the AB selectors were asking of him). Defense is way to important to the way the All Blacks play and centre is the lynchpin position in the backline.
 
Fekiota made the WC squad ahead of Crotty as he is a very dynamic runner and covers 3 positions from 12 to wing. No way were they starting a WC knockout match with Crotty on the wing.
 
If Fekitoa starts this season I think it will probably be on the wing (if we are exposed there by injuries as we are at the moment) or at 12 inside of Crotty which is also a strong possibilty that should be added to my contenders in the above post..
</div>
</blockquote>
Crotty was obviously first in line if any midfielders went down during the RWC but you're dreaming if you think he would've leapfrogged anyone into the team. If Conrad went down, we would've seen a SBW/Nonu midfield (just like the second half of the final), with Fekitoa on the bench.
 
If we want a Conrad-like in the backline then Ngatai would already fill that spot at 12, letting Fekitoa slot into his best position outside him. On top of that, Ngatai's just a better player than Crotty. A noticeably better runner, kicker and offloader at the very least.
 
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Cantab79" data-cid="567791" data-time="1459127657">
<div>
My question with Ngatai is if he's as good as his fans have been saying is, why hasn't he had more opportunities? I understand that we've had a locked in midfield for years, but there have been some opportunities for new players to be brought into the midfield and consistently other players have been chosen over Ngatai. What is it about Ngatai that the selectors have struggled to embrace? It's not as if he's just burst onto the scene, he debuted six or seven years ago for the Canes.
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</blockquote>
He's struggled with injuries a lot but it's also worth remembering that two of those six years were in Hammett's Hurricanes as well. He still did enough in his first couple of years at the Chiefs to guarantee a starting spot if he was fit, he just wasn't fit very often. Last year was the first time he really went through most of the season injury free and he's built on that this year.

booboo

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Cantab79" data-cid="567795" data-time="1459127867">
Can I also just say that I think George Moala is the ideal no.23 to partner Barrett on the bench because he covers all the positions that BB doesn't (ie. 12, 13 and wing).</blockquote>
 
Good point

Billy Tell

I don't think the worlds best side, if it wants to remain so, can afford 70 to 75% goal kickers. Which is what AC & BB are. Maybe Cruden can be coached to a better percentage. 80% is the minimum. 
I hope Cruden & Sopoaga get at least a test each vs Wales.

Wurzel

This thread really puts a dent in the notion that New Zealand produces the world's finest rugby minds

hydro11

Fekitoa is in the category of "too much natural talent not to pick." I have been critical of his distribution skills on here in the past. If Crotty was in good form last year, I would have picked him if Conrad went down. I just think Fekitoa has the potential to be a great and Crotty doesn't have that. I just don't think the selectors can turn down su h great talent. If a player isn't 00% perfect or well rounded, that's what you have coaches for.
 
I think the 12 position is most exciting. Ngatai deserves first shot as things stand but Thompson, Crotty, Laumape and Moala are all doing good things.

hydro11

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Crucial" data-cid="567785" data-time="1459126721">
<div>
I get the argument for Crotty as the level head in the centres but I think Ngatai can also fill that role and has far more future in him as a long term AB
</div>
</blockquote>
 
Sumo had an article last year about how Polynesian players are called explosive and pakehas are called solid even when that isn't even the case. Ngatai seems a perfect example of this. Not only does Ngatai fill the Conrad role but he also has a far better kicking game as well. If you want one 'solid' guy in midfield then Ngatai fills that role superbly (while also being a fantastic attacking player in his own right).

Nepia

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Billy Tell" data-cid="567866" data-time="1459143585">
<div>
I don't think the worlds best side, if it wants to remain so, can afford 70 to 75% goal kickers. Which is what AC & BB are. Maybe Cruden can be coached to a better percentage. 80% is the minimum. 
I hope Cruden & Sopoaga get at least a test each vs Wales.
</div>
</blockquote>
Who of our kickers are over 80%?

Wurzel

It's a pretty boring viewpoint but here's how I say the first All Blacks squad...
 
Halfback: One will miss out of TJP, TKB and Weber
First Five: All of Cruden, Barrett and Sopoaga will be in given BB's utility value in the 23
Midfield: One will miss out of Ngatai, Fekitoa, Moala and Crotty
Back Three: Anyone's guess given injuries but Smith and Savea are definites. Don't be surprised to see Moala and Lowe in the mix especially if Naholo and Dagg can't re-find their form.

Frank

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Nepia" data-cid="567877" data-time="1459147661">
<div>
Who of our kickers are over 80%?
</div>
</blockquote>
 
Sopoaga is at 80 this year to date. <a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://rugby.statbunker.com/competitions/KickingStrikeRate?comp_id=511'>https://rugby.statbunker.com/competitions/KickingStrikeRate?comp_id=511</a>
Only 67% last year
But then 84% the year before.
I guess a lot depends on where the tries were scored.

Nepia

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Frank" data-cid="567880" data-time="1459148811">
<div>
Sopoaga is at 80 this year to daye. <a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://rugby.statbunker.com/competitions/KickingStrikeRate?comp_id=511'>https://rugby.statbunker.com/competitions/KickingStrikeRate?comp_id=511</a>
Only 67% last year
But then 84% the year before.
I guess a lot depends on where the tries were scored.
</div>
</blockquote>
TBF, we don't know over what timeframe Billy Tell means. Is it currently, career etc.

Billy Tell

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Nepia" data-cid="567877" data-time="1459147661">
Who of our kickers are over 80%?</blockquote>
 
Well they are playing for Racing & Pau now... 
But being serious we do need someone who can kick at 80%. 
Cruden might be able to recover those stats, I have no faith in Barrett, Sopoaga and McKenzie are unknowns but strike me as having the temperament.

The Silver Fern

Reshuffling the All Blacks backline