Should the Crusaders change their name?
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@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@SammyC said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@Siam said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@SammyC wouldn't the right decision be to have discussions with the whole community including muslims?
This is a members and community issue with inputs from other groups within the community as I see it
Not really, I don't see how anyone in my position can feel that strongly about it.
It's just a brand name to me, I'd support the team and continue to buy my season ticket no matter whats it's called because I'm from Christchurch. If it's offensive to the Muslim community in general then change it, the team name isn't something worth fighting about.
Offensive? That is the most inane reason to change anything. I am offended by your posts, should you stop posting?
Claiming something is offensive is just the lame brains attempt at making someone else change position on a topic.Fine, change offensive to inappropriate if it’s that big a deal.
I don’t know why it’s such a big issue for guys like you? My point is that it doesn’t matter what the team is called, as long as we wear red and black and ply in Christchurch.
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@ACT-Crusader said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@SammyC said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@ACT-Crusader said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
I’m a Crusaders fan, so some might think I’m blinkered in my view of this. But for me this smacks of looking for something that simply is not there.
I get that sometimes certain events can lead to a situation where it is the “right time to have that debate”, but there needs to be a genuine issue to debate rather than some convenient headline. The name of a team that has been well known for more than two decades in my view does not remotely fit that.
On the other hand the firearms debate is/will be had and the events in Christchurch have expedited that debate jug.
On the other hand I'm a Crusaders fan too, and it doesn’t Jie bother me if we change the name or not.
I support the team because it’s where I’m from and branding ddoesn’t change that stance.The right approach (in my opinion) is to hold discussions with the Muslim community and make a considered decisions based on that feedback.
If they change the name I’ll still keep supporting them, but I’m yet to see any reason why this even needs to be debated other than a few fringe headlines.
Is there genuine concern in the community about this? And has there been concern over this for some time?
I agree with you... more than anything it amuses me that it’s such a big deal for so many on here.
It’s a minor issue for me, so I don’t care if we keep the name or lose it. If it makes a few people happy to change it then go ahead.
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@Siam said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@SammyC similar thoughts if ( when) a debate about changing the All Blacks name?
Just a musing question mate. Culture often runs on precedents
Any change should be driven by the franchise. I am sure the muslim community would not want the heat that comes with externally demanding change
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@Siam said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@SammyC similar thoughts if ( when) a debate about changing the All Blacks name?
Just a musing question mate. Culture often runs on precedents
Bit of tangent? But yes my point stands, I’ll support the New Zealand rugby team no matter what they are called.
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@SammyC said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@SammyC said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@Siam said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@SammyC wouldn't the right decision be to have discussions with the whole community including muslims?
This is a members and community issue with inputs from other groups within the community as I see it
Not really, I don't see how anyone in my position can feel that strongly about it.
It's just a brand name to me, I'd support the team and continue to buy my season ticket no matter whats it's called because I'm from Christchurch. If it's offensive to the Muslim community in general then change it, the team name isn't something worth fighting about.
Offensive? That is the most inane reason to change anything. I am offended by your posts, should you stop posting?
Claiming something is offensive is just the lame brains attempt at making someone else change position on a topic.Fine, change offensive to inappropriate if it’s that big a deal.
I don’t know why it’s such a big issue for guys like you? My point is that it doesn’t matter what the team is called, as long as we wear red and black and ply in Christchurch.
Inappropriate? Nope just as inane.
As for it being a big issue?... shouldn't that be directed at the people wanting a change?
I am just amazed at the lame reasons for doing so. -
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@SammyC said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@SammyC said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@Siam said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@SammyC wouldn't the right decision be to have discussions with the whole community including muslims?
This is a members and community issue with inputs from other groups within the community as I see it
Not really, I don't see how anyone in my position can feel that strongly about it.
It's just a brand name to me, I'd support the team and continue to buy my season ticket no matter whats it's called because I'm from Christchurch. If it's offensive to the Muslim community in general then change it, the team name isn't something worth fighting about.
Offensive? That is the most inane reason to change anything. I am offended by your posts, should you stop posting?
Claiming something is offensive is just the lame brains attempt at making someone else change position on a topic.Fine, change offensive to inappropriate if it’s that big a deal.
I don’t know why it’s such a big issue for guys like you? My point is that it doesn’t matter what the team is called, as long as we wear red and black and ply in Christchurch.
Inappropriate? Nope just as inane.
As for it being a big issue?... shouldn't that be directed at the people wanting a change?
I am just amazed at the lame reasons for doing so.Inane to you maybe but so what if others think of it inappropriate? Should we all have the same train of thought around everything?
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@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@SammyC said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@SammyC said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@Siam said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@SammyC wouldn't the right decision be to have discussions with the whole community including muslims?
This is a members and community issue with inputs from other groups within the community as I see it
Not really, I don't see how anyone in my position can feel that strongly about it.
It's just a brand name to me, I'd support the team and continue to buy my season ticket no matter whats it's called because I'm from Christchurch. If it's offensive to the Muslim community in general then change it, the team name isn't something worth fighting about.
Offensive? That is the most inane reason to change anything. I am offended by your posts, should you stop posting?
Claiming something is offensive is just the lame brains attempt at making someone else change position on a topic.Fine, change offensive to inappropriate if it’s that big a deal.
I don’t know why it’s such a big issue for guys like you? My point is that it doesn’t matter what the team is called, as long as we wear red and black and ply in Christchurch.
Inappropriate? Nope just as inane.
As for it being a big issue?... shouldn't that be directed at the people wanting a change?
I am just amazed at the lame reasons for doing so.Jeez ......Stop trying to assign a position to me based on one word in my original post.
If you want an argument, then my position is as follows: I don't care if the name changes, the team and where it comes from is what is important. If the Crusaders change their name to appease even a small part of the local community then so be it.
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@Hooroo said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@dogmeat said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
as a by the by - they've already changed their name once
From Canterbury Crusaders? They forgot to tell the Aussies!
Nah, let them continue to think the team hails from the Sydney suburbs
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@SammyC said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@SammyC said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@SammyC said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@Siam said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@SammyC wouldn't the right decision be to have discussions with the whole community including muslims?
This is a members and community issue with inputs from other groups within the community as I see it
Not really, I don't see how anyone in my position can feel that strongly about it.
It's just a brand name to me, I'd support the team and continue to buy my season ticket no matter whats it's called because I'm from Christchurch. If it's offensive to the Muslim community in general then change it, the team name isn't something worth fighting about.
Offensive? That is the most inane reason to change anything. I am offended by your posts, should you stop posting?
Claiming something is offensive is just the lame brains attempt at making someone else change position on a topic.Fine, change offensive to inappropriate if it’s that big a deal.
I don’t know why it’s such a big issue for guys like you? My point is that it doesn’t matter what the team is called, as long as we wear red and black and ply in Christchurch.
Inappropriate? Nope just as inane.
As for it being a big issue?... shouldn't that be directed at the people wanting a change?
I am just amazed at the lame reasons for doing so.Jeez ......Stop trying to assign a position to me based on one word in my original post.
If you want an argument, then my position is as follows: I don't care if the name changes, the team and where it comes from is what is important. If the Crusaders change their name to appease even a small part of the local community then so be it.
Right from the start the entire name change discussion has triggered people who have no real stake in the franchise. Someone mentioned it got kicked off by a twitter post? I bet it wasn't from anyone connected with the team or the mosques. I think Sammy's position is very even. Whatever they name the franchise they will still be your team
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@dogmeat said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@canefan they couldn't be so foolish. The Crusaders win.
They probably worked it out because the unis are red and black, not blue and white. But SBW playing for them a couple of years might have created confusion
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@Hooroo said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@SammyC said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@SammyC said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@Siam said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@SammyC wouldn't the right decision be to have discussions with the whole community including muslims?
This is a members and community issue with inputs from other groups within the community as I see it
Not really, I don't see how anyone in my position can feel that strongly about it.
It's just a brand name to me, I'd support the team and continue to buy my season ticket no matter whats it's called because I'm from Christchurch. If it's offensive to the Muslim community in general then change it, the team name isn't something worth fighting about.
Offensive? That is the most inane reason to change anything. I am offended by your posts, should you stop posting?
Claiming something is offensive is just the lame brains attempt at making someone else change position on a topic.Fine, change offensive to inappropriate if it’s that big a deal.
I don’t know why it’s such a big issue for guys like you? My point is that it doesn’t matter what the team is called, as long as we wear red and black and ply in Christchurch.
Inappropriate? Nope just as inane.
As for it being a big issue?... shouldn't that be directed at the people wanting a change?
I am just amazed at the lame reasons for doing so.Inane to you maybe but so what if others think of it inappropriate? Should we all have the same train of thought around everything?
Thats my point....... anyone can find anything offensive.
This will be the thin end of a wedge that will lead to very bad results.
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@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@Hooroo said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@SammyC said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@SammyC said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@Siam said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@SammyC wouldn't the right decision be to have discussions with the whole community including muslims?
This is a members and community issue with inputs from other groups within the community as I see it
Not really, I don't see how anyone in my position can feel that strongly about it.
It's just a brand name to me, I'd support the team and continue to buy my season ticket no matter whats it's called because I'm from Christchurch. If it's offensive to the Muslim community in general then change it, the team name isn't something worth fighting about.
Offensive? That is the most inane reason to change anything. I am offended by your posts, should you stop posting?
Claiming something is offensive is just the lame brains attempt at making someone else change position on a topic.Fine, change offensive to inappropriate if it’s that big a deal.
I don’t know why it’s such a big issue for guys like you? My point is that it doesn’t matter what the team is called, as long as we wear red and black and ply in Christchurch.
Inappropriate? Nope just as inane.
As for it being a big issue?... shouldn't that be directed at the people wanting a change?
I am just amazed at the lame reasons for doing so.Inane to you maybe but so what if others think of it inappropriate? Should we all have the same train of thought around everything?
Thats my point....... anyone can find anything offensive.
This will be the thin end of a wedge that will lead to very bad results.
For who? I think if, for the most, people are happy with change, then change. If it is a few that are unhappy with this, then too bad.
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@Hooroo said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@Hooroo said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@SammyC said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@SammyC said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@Siam said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@SammyC wouldn't the right decision be to have discussions with the whole community including muslims?
This is a members and community issue with inputs from other groups within the community as I see it
Not really, I don't see how anyone in my position can feel that strongly about it.
It's just a brand name to me, I'd support the team and continue to buy my season ticket no matter whats it's called because I'm from Christchurch. If it's offensive to the Muslim community in general then change it, the team name isn't something worth fighting about.
Offensive? That is the most inane reason to change anything. I am offended by your posts, should you stop posting?
Claiming something is offensive is just the lame brains attempt at making someone else change position on a topic.Fine, change offensive to inappropriate if it’s that big a deal.
I don’t know why it’s such a big issue for guys like you? My point is that it doesn’t matter what the team is called, as long as we wear red and black and ply in Christchurch.
Inappropriate? Nope just as inane.
As for it being a big issue?... shouldn't that be directed at the people wanting a change?
I am just amazed at the lame reasons for doing so.Inane to you maybe but so what if others think of it inappropriate? Should we all have the same train of thought around everything?
Thats my point....... anyone can find anything offensive.
This will be the thin end of a wedge that will lead to very bad results.
For who? I think if, for the most, people are happy with change, then change. If it is a few that are unhappy with this, then too bad.
I agree with that. But this process isnt likely to work like that.
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@SammyC said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@Siam said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
@SammyC similar thoughts if ( when) a debate about changing the All Blacks name?
Just a musing question mate. Culture often runs on precedents
Bit of tangent? But yes my point stands, I’ll support the New Zealand rugby team no matter what they are called.
I’d struggle tbh with the NZ Wallabies.
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https://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=12216943
Who's outraged? The Muslim community haven't said anything. Who are all these upset people?
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@canefan said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
Who's outraged? The Muslim community haven't said anything. Who are all these upset people?
Another take on it is that those that are upset aren't making a big cry about it but are expecting that once the point is recognised it is dealt with responsibly?
Isn't that the line the gets trotted out regularly by some here? Stop all the virtue signalling and grievance noise?I think (as stated earlier in the thread) that maybe it is a case of recognising on one side that there is no offence intended in the name as it has a modern 'meaning' different to the literal meaning, while the other side recognise that the imagery possibly pushes that boundary a bit far and meeting halfway may entail an image change (if not a name change).
All perfectly reasonable to me and possibly a good example of working this shit out without listening to the loud noises from either side's extremities.