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Aussies are offering 2000 bucks to go there and do horticulture work. Cindy is asking people to stay.
I'm not sure how market forces, pay people a decent wage/offer good working conditions and they will come work for you continues to be such a mystery. Really sick of seeing stories about owners whining about lost crops who have been exploiting overseas workers for years.
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@Mokey or just saying we pay well and totally sidestepping people having to uproot their lives/families for a temporary job. It's a not a simple equation for sure. I'm hoping we improved conditions and pay for our migrant workforce longer term. I'm sure heaps of growers do value and treat their workers well, but we know that ain't the case across the board.
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@Paekakboyz also, some don't pay by the hour, but by the load or container etc. So if you are new, you'll be slow and not pick as much.
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@Mokey said in NZ Politics:
@Paekakboyz also, some don't pay by the hour, but by the load or container etc. So if you are new, you'll be slow and not pick as much.
Perfectly reasonable considering you're paying people to be productive.
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@antipodean said in NZ Politics:
@Mokey said in NZ Politics:
@Paekakboyz also, some don't pay by the hour, but by the load or container etc. So if you are new, you'll be slow and not pick as much.
Perfectly reasonable considering you're paying people to be productive.
Now don't be silly. Forums like this couldn't exist if we were all paid by productivity.
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@antipodean at the moment they are paying no one because they can't get workers. The pay wasn't flash to begin with. Exactly who do they think is going to move them/and or family to another region for average pay that will be even lower to start while they train?
Being pissy about productivity is all well and good if the market is over supplied with workers. There is a gross shortage. So they can either come up with a new plan that will attract the resources available, or go bankrupt with rotting crops. Their choice.
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@Mokey said in NZ Politics:
@antipodean at the moment they are paying no one because they can't get workers. The pay wasn't flash to begin with. Exactly who do they think is going to move them/and or family to another region for average pay that will be even lower to start while they train?
Being pissy about productivity is all well and good if the market is over supplied with workers. There is a gross shortage. So they can either come up with a new plan that will attract the resources available, or go bankrupt with rotting crops. Their choice.
Perhaps people on the dole could be volunteered?
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@Snowy said in NZ Politics:
@Kirwan said in NZ Politics:
Perhaps people on the dole could be volunteered?
One step further - chain gangs could help.
Why does nobody listen to us?
National service for lazy teens?
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@Mokey said in NZ Politics:
@antipodean at the moment they are paying no one because they can't get workers. The pay wasn't flash to begin with. Exactly who do they think is going to move them/and or family to another region for average pay that will be even lower to start while they train?
Being pissy about productivity is all well and good if the market is over supplied with workers. There is a gross shortage. So they can either come up with a new plan that will attract the resources available, or go bankrupt with rotting crops. Their choice.
Normally it's itinerant workers, backpackers make up a sizeable proportion. With covid-19 the borders have effectively slammed shut so the ask is for the population that normally can't be arsed moving to job opportunities to do so.
The issue about pay is unfortunately tied to what we're prepared to pay at the register. The same market that still has manufacturing based in countries with poor to non-existent health and safety legislation. Out of sight, out of mind.
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@Snowy said in NZ Politics:
@Kirwan said in NZ Politics:
lazy teens
Tautology, but I think we have this sorted.
I'll call Jacinda and let her know our ideas.
There's a lot of Polish chicks that have nothing better to do...
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@Crucial said in NZ Politics:
@Snowy said in NZ Politics:
@Kirwan said in NZ Politics:
lazy teens
Tautology, but I think we have this sorted.
I'll call Jacinda and let her know our ideas.
There's a lot of Polish chicks that have nothing better to do...
We are busy solving all of these other issues. There is no time for picking fruit.
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@antipodean said in NZ Politics:
@Mokey said in NZ Politics:
@antipodean at the moment they are paying no one because they can't get workers. The pay wasn't flash to begin with. Exactly who do they think is going to move them/and or family to another region for average pay that will be even lower to start while they train?
Being pissy about productivity is all well and good if the market is over supplied with workers. There is a gross shortage. So they can either come up with a new plan that will attract the resources available, or go bankrupt with rotting crops. Their choice.
Normally it's itinerant workers, backpackers make up a sizeable proportion. With covid-19 the borders have effectively slammed shut so the ask is for the population that normally can't be arsed moving to job opportunities to do so.
The issue about pay is unfortunately tied to what we're prepared to pay at the register. The same market that still has manufacturing based in countries with poor to non-existent health and safety legislation. Out of sight, out of mind.
And what supermarkets are prepared to pay producers to keep their margins.
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@Crucial and keep fruit/veges at a reasonable cost level...lose-lose situation.
I think I read NZ Supermarkets are some of the only ones in the world that dont use milk as a loss leader, hence why our prices are some of the highest in the world.
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@taniwharugby for a strong dairy/agriculture producing nation, we pay ridiculous prices for milk, meat, and fruit/veg. And they export the best quality. So quite often its super high price for crap.
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@Mokey said in NZ Politics:
@taniwharugby for a strong dairy/agriculture producing nation, we pay ridiculous prices for milk, meat, and fruit/veg. And they export the best quality. So quite often its super high price for crap.
Agree, but what can you do besides price control. The market is established at a point where dropping the price won't really increase sales so there is no incentive there. We pay it because we are used to paying it and that suits the suppliers .
Any control on the supermarkets will just shift the problem down the chain. I'm not against producers getting a fair price either but without some kind of equal/fair spread along the whole chain the consumer won't see benefits.
The thing that really pisses me off is the supermarket model that has developed where the likes of foodstuffs take cuts at every step. They charge suppliers to pass the goods through their warehouses, then through their distribution transport, then whacks them with the cost of doing a 'special'. The producer is only getting the same as they are exporting (maybe even less) but the consumer ends up lining the pockets of the supermarkets. -
@Crucial said in NZ Politics:
@Mokey said in NZ Politics:
@taniwharugby for a strong dairy/agriculture producing nation, we pay ridiculous prices for milk, meat, and fruit/veg. And they export the best quality. So quite often its super high price for crap.
Agree, but what can you do besides price control. The market is established at a point where dropping the price won't really increase sales so there is no incentive there. We pay it because we are used to paying it and that suits the suppliers .
Any control on the supermarkets will just shift the problem down the chain. I'm not against producers getting a fair price either but without some kind of equal/fair spread along the whole chain the consumer won't see benefits.
The thing that really pisses me off is the supermarket model that has developed where the likes of foodstuffs take cuts at every step. They charge suppliers to pass the goods through their warehouses, then through their distribution transport, then whacks them with the cost of doing a 'special'. The producer is only getting the same as they are exporting (maybe even less) but the consumer ends up lining the pockets of the supermarkets.Easier said than done, but the only thing we can do as individual consumers is to shop elsewhere, ie your local butcher, fruitstore etc
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wasnt there somehting similar with Power Companies, how'd that turn out, discounts all round...
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@canefan said in NZ Politics:
asier said than done, but the only thing we can do as individual consumers is to shop elsewhere, ie your local butcher, fruitstore etc
Yep. I get alot of our fruit and vege from road side stalls or from the our own garden. All of it spray free, most of it effectively organic. We are lucky to have that avialable but @crucial is right the supermarket supply chain is pretty fucked up.
The last government was trying to stop small sales of produce and even people swapping it IIRC.
Conspiracy theory - how much do Foodstuffs and Progressive enterprises / Woolworths pour into our politcal parties? How much lobbying? Even the Covid - "only supermarkets" can sell food (of which there are two) seemed unfair to the butchers, bakers and greengrocers.
NZ Politics