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@voodoo said in Climate Change #3 & Other Environmental Issues:
I agree that right now EV's don't make much sense, they are too expensive still, we still need to power them with predominantly coal,
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Climate Change #3 & Other Environmental Issues:
I think we can agree that f there are cleaner ways of creating energy that are economically viable without massive govt subsidies then they should be used.
Two good full posts there.
My comments though:EV price, yes, which is one of the reasons that I haven't got one in spite of having solar as I have a battery. They do make sense for some though. As has been mentioned the power companies don't pay much for surplus solar so running an EV makes a lot of sense. Effectively you get about %10 (8% at worst) return on investment in an EV compared to petrol if you have solar generation and do average mileage. That is likely to go up too as fuel costs rise. Find me low risk 8% return in NZ!
Again, as an economic exercise even EV can work and NZ only has Huntly left as coal I think from an environmental view? Different to Aus obviously.
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Update on power generation and spot pricing in Australia. It's baking hot under the sun today almost everywhere, so aircon will be pumping:
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@chimoaus said in Climate Change #3 & Other Environmental Issues:
Its official, yesterday was the hottest ever day recorded in Australia overall at 40.9. It maybe even hotter today.
I don't think there can be any debate the planet is warming, the question is why.
NZ is very cold at the moment. Therefore the planet isn't warming.....
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The earth has been hotter in the past; the earth has been cooler in the past.
The qualifying factor in the date above is “recorded history,” in other words, when man recorded it.
But if the earth has been both hotter and cooler before mankind existed, is it even remotely possible, just a teeny-weeny little bit, that maybe mankind isn’t exclusively responsible for climate change, and that maybe the sun and water vapour are factors too?
Just asking, in good faith, before we’re forced to abandon civilization to make temperatures drop maybe 1/100th of a degree.
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@Salacious-Crumb said in Climate Change #3 & Other Environmental Issues:
before we’re forced to abandon civilization to make temperatures drop maybe 1/100th of a degree.
I don't think anybody is going to be doing that.
Interesting that the shipping industry were called out on the news last night. I mentioned them earlier and good to see that they are trying to clean up their act. Before I get any statements about economics - yes 90% of freight is done by sea and that won't change but they really don't have to burn the crap they do. Good to see that they are willing as it won't cost much. Hong Kong forced them to burn cleaner fuel when going into port quite some years ago.
As a slightly different slant on reducing emissions and having spent 15 years in Hong Kong, breathing in bloody awful air (Beijing and India are worse) then we are still better off with clean energy - climate change is then relevant, but not the key driver to a less polluted environment and man made climate change deniers can't deny air quality is shit in a lot of the world's cities.
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@Baron-Silas-Greenback pretty warm up here, but more about average than above or below...less than ave rainfall for the year though, well at my house anyway.
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@Salacious-Crumb said in Climate Change #3 & Other Environmental Issues:
The earth has been hotter in the past; the earth has been cooler in the past.
The qualifying factor in the date above is “recorded history,” in other words, when man recorded it.
But if the earth has been both hotter and cooler before mankind existed, is it even remotely possible, just a teeny-weeny little bit, that maybe mankind isn’t exclusively responsible for climate change, and that maybe the sun and water vapour are factors too?
Just asking, in good faith, before we’re forced to abandon civilization to make temperatures drop maybe 1/100th of a degree.
Don't take any notice if the graph above (the first post). Its crap
Climate change is just a weird modern day end of world cult. Where CO2 somehow through a process called back radiation (radiation leaving earth and returning about a second later) creates more warming than the sun does. And this process will almost destroy planet earth
Our sin now though is driving car and heating our house. And we must pay indulgences for our sinfulness in the form of contributions to climate funds etc.
Its amazing what garbage people believe. If the elite said there was health giving mineral on the moon and we all need to pay into a fund to get the minerals and repeated it over and over and over etc in the papers most would demand the Govt pay into this fund to save lives.
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@Winger said in Climate Change #3 & Other Environmental Issues:
You are mixing up two issues. One is REAL air pollution.
CO2 though is not a real pollutant. Without CO2 there is no life on earth
I'm not mixing up the issues. I clearly said "a different slant". I'm also well aware of what CO2 is, thanks.
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@Winger said in Climate Change #3 & Other Environmental Issues:
@Salacious-Crumb said in Climate Change #3 & Other Environmental Issues:
The earth has been hotter in the past; the earth has been cooler in the past.
The qualifying factor in the date above is “recorded history,” in other words, when man recorded it.
But if the earth has been both hotter and cooler before mankind existed, is it even remotely possible, just a teeny-weeny little bit, that maybe mankind isn’t exclusively responsible for climate change, and that maybe the sun and water vapour are factors too?
Just asking, in good faith, before we’re forced to abandon civilization to make temperatures drop maybe 1/100th of a degree.
Don't take any notice if the graph above (the first post). Its crap
Climate change is just a weird modern day end of world cult. Where CO2 somehow through a process called back radiation (radiation leaving earth and returning about a second later) creates more warming than the sun does. And this process will almost destroy planet earth
Our sin now though is driving car and heating our house. And we must pay indulgences for our sinfulness in the form of contributions to climate funds etc.
Its amazing what garbage people believe. If the elite said there was health giving mineral on the moon and we all need to pay into a fund to get the minerals and repeated it over and over and over etc in the papers most would demand the Govt pay into this fund to save lives.
I could be wrong but I think people believing all kinds of moronic conspiracy theories wasn't as prevalent before the internet . Now it seems like theres hordes of morons who will never be convinced 9/11 wasn't an inside job or even more dangerously they believe nonsense like homeopathy or that the measles vaccine causes autism. 72 people died in Samoa and these nutters are still posting lies about vaccines on social media.
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@jegga said in Climate Change #3 & Other Environmental Issues:
@Winger said in Climate Change #3 & Other Environmental Issues:
@Salacious-Crumb said in Climate Change #3 & Other Environmental Issues:
The earth has been hotter in the past; the earth has been cooler in the past.
The qualifying factor in the date above is “recorded history,” in other words, when man recorded it.
But if the earth has been both hotter and cooler before mankind existed, is it even remotely possible, just a teeny-weeny little bit, that maybe mankind isn’t exclusively responsible for climate change, and that maybe the sun and water vapour are factors too?
Just asking, in good faith, before we’re forced to abandon civilization to make temperatures drop maybe 1/100th of a degree.
Don't take any notice if the graph above (the first post). Its crap
Climate change is just a weird modern day end of world cult. Where CO2 somehow through a process called back radiation (radiation leaving earth and returning about a second later) creates more warming than the sun does. And this process will almost destroy planet earth
Our sin now though is driving car and heating our house. And we must pay indulgences for our sinfulness in the form of contributions to climate funds etc.
Its amazing what garbage people believe. If the elite said there was health giving mineral on the moon and we all need to pay into a fund to get the minerals and repeated it over and over and over etc in the papers most would demand the Govt pay into this fund to save lives.
I could be wrong but I think people believing all kinds of moronic conspiracy theories wasn't as prevalent before the internet . Now it seems like theres hordes of morons who will never be convinced 9/11 wasn't an inside job or even more dangerously they believe nonsense like homeopathy or that the measles vaccine causes autism. 72 people died in Samoa and these nutters are still posting lies about vaccines on social media.
Try to stick to the topic. Or do you always do this in a group. Butt in with irrelevant crap
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@Winger said in Climate Change #3 & Other Environmental Issues:
@jegga said in Climate Change #3 & Other Environmental Issues:
@Winger said in Climate Change #3 & Other Environmental Issues:
@Salacious-Crumb said in Climate Change #3 & Other Environmental Issues:
The earth has been hotter in the past; the earth has been cooler in the past.
The qualifying factor in the date above is “recorded history,” in other words, when man recorded it.
But if the earth has been both hotter and cooler before mankind existed, is it even remotely possible, just a teeny-weeny little bit, that maybe mankind isn’t exclusively responsible for climate change, and that maybe the sun and water vapour are factors too?
Just asking, in good faith, before we’re forced to abandon civilization to make temperatures drop maybe 1/100th of a degree.
Don't take any notice if the graph above (the first post). Its crap
Climate change is just a weird modern day end of world cult. Where CO2 somehow through a process called back radiation (radiation leaving earth and returning about a second later) creates more warming than the sun does. And this process will almost destroy planet earth
Our sin now though is driving car and heating our house. And we must pay indulgences for our sinfulness in the form of contributions to climate funds etc.
Its amazing what garbage people believe. If the elite said there was health giving mineral on the moon and we all need to pay into a fund to get the minerals and repeated it over and over and over etc in the papers most would demand the Govt pay into this fund to save lives.
I could be wrong but I think people believing all kinds of moronic conspiracy theories wasn't as prevalent before the internet . Now it seems like theres hordes of morons who will never be convinced 9/11 wasn't an inside job or even more dangerously they believe nonsense like homeopathy or that the measles vaccine causes autism. 72 people died in Samoa and these nutters are still posting lies about vaccines on social media.
Try to stick to the topic. Or do you always do this in a group. Butt in with irrelevant crap
Odd response. I was responding to a point you made and agreeing with you . Don’t you agree there’s far too much bullshit science being peddled by useful idiots for people who ultimately use it to gain influence power or money ?
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@taniwharugby said in Climate Change #3 & Other Environmental Issues:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback pretty warm up here, but more about average than above or below...less than ave rainfall for the year though, well at my house anyway.
Sorry my bad.. the climate emergency is back on. Let me know if it cools down tomorrow and we can downgrade to DEFCON 17
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@Baron-Silas-Greenback apology accepted
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@Salacious-Crumb said in Climate Change #3 & Other Environmental Issues:
The earth has been hotter in the past; the earth has been cooler in the past.
The qualifying factor in the date above is “recorded history,” in other words, when man recorded it.
But if the earth has been both hotter and cooler before mankind existed, is it even remotely possible, just a teeny-weeny little bit, that maybe mankind isn’t exclusively responsible for climate change, and that maybe the sun and water vapour are factors too?
Just asking, in good faith, before we’re forced to abandon civilization to make temperatures drop maybe 1/100th of a degree.
Yep and from my understanding the planet warms when emissions go up, namely from volcanoes. Climate change 250 million years ago nearly wiped out all life on the planet. I also believe the natural warming and cooling of the earth takes a lot longer than the 50 years we have seen dramatic change.
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@chimoaus said in Climate Change #3 & Other Environmental Issues:
@Salacious-Crumb said in Climate Change #3 & Other Environmental Issues:
The earth has been hotter in the past; the earth has been cooler in the past.
The qualifying factor in the date above is “recorded history,” in other words, when man recorded it.
But if the earth has been both hotter and cooler before mankind existed, is it even remotely possible, just a teeny-weeny little bit, that maybe mankind isn’t exclusively responsible for climate change, and that maybe the sun and water vapour are factors too?
Just asking, in good faith, before we’re forced to abandon civilization to make temperatures drop maybe 1/100th of a degree.
Yep and from my understanding the planet warms when emissions go up, namely from volcanoes. Climate change 250 million years ago nearly wiped out all life on the planet. I also believe the natural warming and cooling of the earth takes a lot longer than the 50 years we have seen dramatic change.
It usually follows not leads. So warming from natural cycles leads to higher CO2. Not the other way a =round
And what dramatic change? The temperature has changed very little over the last 50 years. Unlike the past when the world moved out of a ice age for example. And just maybe the NY Times is not the best place to get reliable data from
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@Winger said in Climate Change #3 & Other Environmental Issues:
And just maybe the NY Times is not the best place to get reliable data from
I really want to know who you get your reliable data from?
Not saying that it is or isn't but who do you rely on?
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@Snowy said in Climate Change #3 & Other Environmental Issues:
@Winger said in Climate Change #3 & Other Environmental Issues:
And just maybe the NY Times is not the best place to get reliable data from
I really want to know who you get your reliable data from?
Not saying that it is or isn't but who do you rely on?
why is in 13 month blocks?
Climate Change