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@chimoaus said in US Politics:
Can anyone explain why the US elections are often close to 50/50. It is amazing that a population of 300+ Million can be equally divided. Is it a concern that 160 Million people don't agree with the other 160 Million on a lot of topics?
It does seem convieniant, I'd suspect gerrymandering (from both sides) to try and chase their voters as populations relocate
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@Kirwan said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
For the sake of the country I hope as many of the remaining states to call go to Biden to shut down the squabbling over a couple of close ones.
(I say Biden because it is looking like he could sit bang on 270 after the initial counting which will open a desire on both sides to litigate results)Whoever wins, litigation is a certainty at this point.
Probably, as we know that America loves their lawyers, however the squabbling will get dampened somewhat if the 68? remaining EC votes give Biden an advantage of about 50. That means flipping 3 states minimum via the courts.
Hey, it is their duty to question things if they have grounds. I don't think that right should be taken away. I just hope that spurious fishing expeditions don't become the standard.
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@chimoaus said in US Politics:
@Kirwan said in US Politics:
@chimoaus said in US Politics:
@Kirwan said in US Politics:
@chimoaus said in US Politics:
@Winger said in US Politics:
@chimoaus said in US Politics:
Can someone explain why the voting process is not digital yet?
Most are not that easy to verify. But there arre systems that have paper backups. And voters can login to confirn there vote. But there are issues with security etc too
Yeah, I understand it would be a nightmare, but banks, tax office, passports etc seem to have done a pretty good job of it.
I wonder where they keep all the voting papers, must be a big fucken warehouse somewhere, and I wonder for how long they must keep them.
Plenty of fraud in those areas as well, and most of it gets caught in time. Voting is more time sensitive though
What stops the hacking of the results that are entered into the digital system, or is there a manual way of doing that? Are the papers scanned through a machine that adds it up?
The process is overseen at multiple steps, that's why the reports of people being kicked out is so serious
I would hope so, hate to be the vote counter who gets to 1,234,567 and loses count
That's a lot of fingers and toes.
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@Winger said in US Politics:
@Frank said in US Politics:
because I think he is being irresponsible for the whole country
Its the opposite. If the republicians have evidence of fraud he needs to voice this straight away. I would expect the democrats to do likewise
What is his evidence?
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@Frank said in US Politics:
@Winger said in US Politics:
@Frank said in US Politics:
because I think he is being irresponsible for the whole country
Its the opposite. If the republicians have evidence of fraud he needs to voice this straight away. I would expect the democrats to do likewise
What is his evidence?
One (and its serious) is that the checkers weren't allowed to do their job
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I’d be amazed if there hasn’t been fraud of some type. But whether it is coordinated or material enough to invalidate the result isn’t clear. I also don’t know whether there’s much merit in the assumption that the Democrats are more likely to cheat than the Republicans. There are some shifty people on both sides.
You have to wonder what would have happened if the Dems had fielded an inspiring candidate. And also whether the situation would be the same if Trump had taken some advice and tried to reach out to some more moderate swing voters.
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@Winger why does he need to announce it publicly...why not just lodge the legal action...like a profressional
side bar, some of these are genuinely funny
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@Frank said in US Politics:
@Winger said in US Politics:
@Frank said in US Politics:
because I think he is being irresponsible for the whole country
Its the opposite. If the republicians have evidence of fraud he needs to voice this straight away. I would expect the democrats to do likewise
What is his evidence?
Quite obviously it is impossible for him to lose. That's all the evidence required unless you can point to another reason.
I do agree with @winger in that there is an obligation to fix something wrong but to dive in on a whim when you were quite happy up until the point of losing isn't enough to claim as 'evidence'
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@Kiwiwomble said in US Politics:
@Winger why does he need to announce it publicly...why not just lodge the legal action...like a profressional
side bar, some of these are genuinely funny
To keep the people informed. They have a right to know.
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@chimoaus identity theft/fraud still occurs whether it’s banking, tax etc, but there is a motivation for institutions and law enforcement to follow that up because more likely someone has been disadvantaged or there’s been corruption.
I think with elections and voting it’s a little more challenging because what is the motivation? Especially in countries like the US that don’t have compulsory voting, how can someone verify that the vote has come from a particular individual?
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@Winger said in US Politics:
@Frank said in US Politics:
@Winger said in US Politics:
@Frank said in US Politics:
because I think he is being irresponsible for the whole country
Its the opposite. If the republicians have evidence of fraud he needs to voice this straight away. I would expect the democrats to do likewise
What is his evidence?
One (and its serious) is that the checkers weren't allowed to do their job
That isn't evidence of wrongdoing (as you keep claiming). It is evidence that there was potential for fraud.
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@Crucial said in US Politics:
@Winger said in US Politics:
@Frank said in US Politics:
@Winger said in US Politics:
@Frank said in US Politics:
because I think he is being irresponsible for the whole country
Its the opposite. If the republicians have evidence of fraud he needs to voice this straight away. I would expect the democrats to do likewise
What is his evidence?
One (and its serious) is that the checkers weren't allowed to do their job
That isn't evidence of wrongdoing (as you keep claiming). It is evidence that there was potential for fraud.
if you're so paranoid you honestly believe most people are out to cheat you
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@Crucial said in US Politics:
I do agree with @winger in that there is an obligation to fix something wrong but to dive in on a whim when you were quite happy up until the point of losing isn't enough to claim as 'evidence'
Trump has bene unhappy withj the mail in for everyone. And I agree. How can this process be managed when dead people are getting ballots. And the postal service is being used. It almost impossible to check and verify this system. I don't think a worse system could be used
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@JC said in US Politics:
I’d be amazed if there hasn’t been fraud of some type. But whether it is coordinated or material enough to invalidate the result isn’t clear. I also don’t know whether there’s much merit in the assumption that the Democrats are more likely to cheat than the Republicans. There are some shifty people on both sides.
You have to wonder what would have happened if the Dems had fielded an inspiring candidate. And also whether the situation would be the same if Trump had taken some advice and tried to reach out to some more moderate swing voters.
I'm fairly sure there have been some well analysed reports over the years of the amount of voting fraud in the US and its material effect. The conclusions were that while elections aren't 100% clean the ability to commit fraud on a scale that would affect a result is very minimal.
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@chimoaus said in US Politics:
Can anyone explain why the US elections are often close to 50/50. It is amazing that a population of 300+ Million can be equally divided. Is it a concern that 160 Million people don't agree with the other 160 Million on a lot of topics?
It's a really good question.
This a reasonably good answer:
http://nautil.us/issue/42/fakes/why-are-us-presidential-elections-so-closeI liked this, because it shows that people are willing to change and vote either way, but that would not actually appear to be the case.
"Perhaps the U.S. presidential election is usually close simply because so many Americans are constantly dissatisfied with the status quo."However they have so few one term Presidents overall that I doubt that is it.
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This cracked me up:
“People should be on the alert for dead people voting."
https://nypost.com/2020/11/02/dead-people-caught-voting-in-nyc-elections-records-show/
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half are one term (23/44) by my debatable arithmetic.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_presidents_of_the_United_States_by_time_in_office
Which in the next 2 terms could change again..(25/46)nb am wondering if "only one Nevada away" becomes a catchphrase..
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@Virgil said in US Politics:
@Kirwan said in US Politics:
@Virgil said in US Politics:
Think many are confusing fraud with incompetence.
I think you might be downplaying Trump derangement syndrome. I think there are some people who would do anything to get Trump out.
Plenty would do anything to keep him in, including himself.
Around 49% of voters in fact. This whole conspiracy thing sounds fantastical and ridiculous
US Politics