Hurricanes v Reds
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@nepia said in Hurricanes v Reds:
Toala gets slightly less then the 2 mins that @Stargazer predicted.
Ha ha, snap.
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@nepia said in Hurricanes v Reds:
Toala gets slightly less then the 2 mins that @Stargazer predicted.
He came on in the 74th minute. The commentators just didn't notice/mention it.
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@kiwimurph they were too excited about Laumape leaving
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@crucial said in Hurricanes v Reds:
@antipodean said in Hurricanes v Reds:
@damo said in Hurricanes v Reds:
I think that is really harsh. The ball was way up in the air. Very hard to successfully force it. I didn't think he intentionally knocked that dead.
Then don't try to. He didn't attempt to catch it and that's not a genuine attempt to ground a ball when it's that high off the ground. Good decision.
What law are you applying there?
Unfair play
A player must not:
Intentionally knock, place, push or throw the ball with arm or hand from the playing area.
If judging the same way deliberate knock ins are you are probably right but these dead ball area ones are usually judged with a different threshold.
He propelled the ball out, not downwards. Guessing intent from anything other than the clear evidence is for ignorant morons on Facebook.
Remove that and Laumape probably would've got to the ball.
Good application of the laws of the game.
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@rebound said in Hurricanes v Reds:
@crucial but that the law. Knocking the ball dead with an opposite player in a position to score is PT and yellow.
No. Deliberately knocking the ball dead when the opposition player would otherwise probably score is.
I just think that both of those aspects are debatable so to call them both is harsh. -
@antipodean How can you say he 'probably would have got to the ball' though? He'd already missed it by the time Hegarty took a swipe.
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@crucial said in Hurricanes v Reds:
@rebound said in Hurricanes v Reds:
@crucial but that the law. Knocking the ball dead with an opposite player in a position to score is PT and yellow.
No. Deliberately knocking the ball dead when the opposition player would otherwise probably score is.
I just think that both of those aspects are debatable so to call them both is harsh.And here I am thinking both of them are clear and obvious. Must be watching different games
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@antipodean said in Hurricanes v Reds:
@crucial said in Hurricanes v Reds:
@antipodean said in Hurricanes v Reds:
@damo said in Hurricanes v Reds:
I think that is really harsh. The ball was way up in the air. Very hard to successfully force it. I didn't think he intentionally knocked that dead.
Then don't try to. He didn't attempt to catch it and that's not a genuine attempt to ground a ball when it's that high off the ground. Good decision.
What law are you applying there?
Unfair play
A player must not:
Intentionally knock, place, push or throw the ball with arm or hand from the playing area.
If judging the same way deliberate knock ins are you are probably right but these dead ball area ones are usually judged with a different threshold.
He propelled the ball out, not downwards. Guessing intent from anything other than the clear evidence is for ignorant morons on Facebook.
Remove that and Laumape probably would've got to the ball.
Good application of the laws of the game.
I’m confused. You (and the ref) are guessing the intent.
It may have been intentional but I have no clue what was in his mind. Could just as easily have been a futile attempt to ground the ball.
Still can’t see how it was probable that Laumape would have scored. Possible yes. Not probable.
A guess in both aspects in my opinion -
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@crucial said in Hurricanes v Reds:
@antipodean said in Hurricanes v Reds:
@damo said in Hurricanes v Reds:
I think that is really harsh. The ball was way up in the air. Very hard to successfully force it. I didn't think he intentionally knocked that dead.
Then don't try to. He didn't attempt to catch it and that's not a genuine attempt to ground a ball when it's that high off the ground. Good decision.
What law are you applying there?
If judging the same way deliberate knock ins are you are probably right but these dead ball area ones are usually judged with a different threshold. The SBW example was a straight out deliberate knock dead and I can’t remember many others since.How would it make any sense for the threshold to be different? Don't both use the term "deliberate"? It's clearly a deliberate knock dead, in the same way most deliberate knock ons the player is still trying to catch the ball. He just isn't in a realistic position to catch it.
It shouldn't be a PT though because I think it is 50/50 that Laumape gets there.
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@derpus said in Hurricanes v Reds:
@antipodean How can you say he 'probably would have got to the ball' though? He'd already missed it by the time Hegarty took a swipe.
Because you have to remove Hegarty from the occasion. Given Hegarty only just beat him to the ball and it was still well inside the in goal area, it's reasonable to deduce Laumape would've got to the ball still in the in goal area.
That's how it works.
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@crucial said in Hurricanes v Reds:
@antipodean said in Hurricanes v Reds:
@crucial said in Hurricanes v Reds:
@antipodean said in Hurricanes v Reds:
@damo said in Hurricanes v Reds:
I think that is really harsh. The ball was way up in the air. Very hard to successfully force it. I didn't think he intentionally knocked that dead.
Then don't try to. He didn't attempt to catch it and that's not a genuine attempt to ground a ball when it's that high off the ground. Good decision.
What law are you applying there?
Unfair play
A player must not:
Intentionally knock, place, push or throw the ball with arm or hand from the playing area.
If judging the same way deliberate knock ins are you are probably right but these dead ball area ones are usually judged with a different threshold.
He propelled the ball out, not downwards. Guessing intent from anything other than the clear evidence is for ignorant morons on Facebook.
Remove that and Laumape probably would've got to the ball.
Good application of the laws of the game.
I’m confused. You (and the ref) are guessing the intent.
It may have been intentional but I have no clue what was in his mind.Holy fuck, then you'd never apply the law. What else do you have other than his actions which clearly propelled the ball dead?
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@crucial said in Hurricanes v Reds:
@antipodean said in Hurricanes v Reds:
@crucial said in Hurricanes v Reds:
@antipodean said in Hurricanes v Reds:
@damo said in Hurricanes v Reds:
I think that is really harsh. The ball was way up in the air. Very hard to successfully force it. I didn't think he intentionally knocked that dead.
Then don't try to. He didn't attempt to catch it and that's not a genuine attempt to ground a ball when it's that high off the ground. Good decision.
What law are you applying there?
Unfair play
A player must not:
Intentionally knock, place, push or throw the ball with arm or hand from the playing area.
If judging the same way deliberate knock ins are you are probably right but these dead ball area ones are usually judged with a different threshold.
He propelled the ball out, not downwards. Guessing intent from anything other than the clear evidence is for ignorant morons on Facebook.
Remove that and Laumape probably would've got to the ball.
Good application of the laws of the game.
I’m confused. You (and the ref) are guessing the intent.
It may have been intentional but I have no clue what was in his mind. Could just as easily have been a futile attempt to ground the ball.
Still can’t see how it was probable that Laumape would have scored. Possible yes. Not probable.
A guess in both aspects in my opinionFor the probable try, isn't it based on the player committing foul play completely taken out of the equation?
If the player knocking it dead wasn't there at all, would Laumape have probably grounded it? I'd say yes.
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@antipodean No you don't. You just have to remove the part where he taps the ball back.
Does the ref create an alternate reality where the 'offending' player just doesn't exist to determine if he would have got the ball? must have missed those instructions in the rule book.
He missed the ball, then Hegarty got to it. If Hegarty is deemed to have tapped it back rather than attempting to ground it then it's a five metre scrum.
Laumape was 'probably going to score'? not for shit.
Anyway, this was not even the worst decision of the night. On what planet is a shoulder charge to the head not a red? Aren't we supposed to be protecting players.
