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@jc said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@stodders So will cold cases, as it’s winter. Why should we care again? Unless you’re claiming that people are being hospitalised and dying despite the vaccination rate being so high. Is that what you’re claiming?
No. I'm not claiming that. All I know is:
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The vaccines do not confer immunity or prevent transmission.
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Any beneficial effect the vaccines do have wears off, the vaccine manufacturers don’t know when.
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Vaccines possibly don’t protect against new variants or mutations. Omicron testing will tell us more, but history suggests these types of virus are very difficult to vaccinate against.
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Vaccines have unknown longterm side effects.
The vaccine rhetoric started with the position that vaccines were a two-shot ticket out of the pandemic.
Then this was amended to say that they stopped transmission in the vaccinated (that it was a pandemic of the unvaccinated).
Now we're at the point where the vaccines don't stop transmission or infection but they reduce the impact of the disease if you're unlucky enough to get it (given the statistics of infection). But, here comes the caveat, this only applies if you continue to get boosters for an unspecified period into the future.
I don't like the demonisation of people who have chosen to not get the vaccine. And when you look at the above and see how often the goalposts keep getting moved (as a result of hard scientific evidence, but why come out with statements claiming outlandish benefits if you doubt they will stand the test of time), it becomes harder to argue with people that have doubts about the true efficacy of the vaccines.
Which is when you get to the stage of vaccine mandates/compelled medical intervention. And IMO, that is a place I thought we'd never get back to, which saddens me immensely.
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@stodders said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@jc said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@stodders So will cold cases, as it’s winter. Why should we care again? Unless you’re claiming that people are being hospitalised and dying despite the vaccination rate being so high. Is that what you’re claiming?
No. I'm not claiming that. All I know is:
-
The vaccines do not confer immunity or prevent transmission.
-
Any beneficial effect the vaccines do have wears off, the vaccine manufacturers don’t know when.
-
Vaccines possibly don’t protect against new variants or mutations. Omicron testing will tell us more, but history suggests these types of virus are very difficult to vaccinate against.
-
Vaccines have unknown longterm side effects.
The vaccine rhetoric started with the position that vaccines were a two-shot ticket out of the pandemic.
Then this was amended to say that they stopped transmission in the vaccinated (that it was a pandemic of the unvaccinated).
Now we're at the point where the vaccines don't stop transmission or infection but they reduce the impact of the disease if you're unlucky enough to get it (given the statistics of infection). But, here comes the caveat, this only applies if you continue to get boosters for an unspecified period into the future.
I don't like the demonisation of people who have chosen to not get the vaccine. And when you look at the above and see how often the goalposts keep getting moved (as a result of hard scientific evidence, but why come out with statements claiming outlandish benefits if you doubt they will stand the test of time), it becomes harder to argue with people that have doubts about the true efficacy of the vaccines.
Which is when you get to the stage of vaccine mandates/compelled medical intervention. And IMO, that is a place I thought we'd never get back to, which saddens me immensely.
By the by, I'm vaccinated. If someone isn't vaccinated, I'm still protected from severe illness if I were contract the disease by virtue of the fact of my vaccination status. I weighed the risks and made my decision. Effectively prohibiting people from engaging in society as a result of their vaccine status is a very slippery slope. What's next? Internment camps for unvaccinated?
If mandates are purely about risks to public health, then why are we not discussing more the elephant in the room which is that the majority of people dying (that are not elderly) of COVID have co-morbidities linked to diet and lack of exercise that put them more at risk from the disease. Longer term, improving the overall fitness of the population is probably the key to overcoming COVID.
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@stodders said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@stodders said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@jc said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@stodders So will cold cases, as it’s winter. Why should we care again? Unless you’re claiming that people are being hospitalised and dying despite the vaccination rate being so high. Is that what you’re claiming?
No. I'm not claiming that. All I know is:
-
The vaccines do not confer immunity or prevent transmission.
-
Any beneficial effect the vaccines do have wears off, the vaccine manufacturers don’t know when.
-
Vaccines possibly don’t protect against new variants or mutations. Omicron testing will tell us more, but history suggests these types of virus are very difficult to vaccinate against.
-
Vaccines have unknown longterm side effects.
The vaccine rhetoric started with the position that vaccines were a two-shot ticket out of the pandemic.
Then this was amended to say that they stopped transmission in the vaccinated (that it was a pandemic of the unvaccinated).
Now we're at the point where the vaccines don't stop transmission or infection but they reduce the impact of the disease if you're unlucky enough to get it (given the statistics of infection). But, here comes the caveat, this only applies if you continue to get boosters for an unspecified period into the future.
I don't like the demonisation of people who have chosen to not get the vaccine. And when you look at the above and see how often the goalposts keep getting moved (as a result of hard scientific evidence, but why come out with statements claiming outlandish benefits if you doubt they will stand the test of time), it becomes harder to argue with people that have doubts about the true efficacy of the vaccines.
Which is when you get to the stage of vaccine mandates/compelled medical intervention. And IMO, that is a place I thought we'd never get back to, which saddens me immensely.
By the by, I'm vaccinated. If someone isn't vaccinated, I'm still protected from severe illness if I were contract the disease by virtue of the fact of my vaccination status. I weighed the risks and made my decision. Effectively prohibiting people from engaging in society as a result of their vaccine status is a very slippery slope. What's next? Internment camps for unvaccinated?
If mandates are purely about risks to public health, then why are we not discussing more the elephant in the room which is that the majority of people dying (that are not elderly) of COVID have co-morbidities linked to diet and lack of exercise that put them more at risk from the disease. Longer term, improving the overall fitness of the population is probably the key to overcoming COVID.
Because if Labour promoted health for obese people in this country to help with COVID it would be deeply unpopular. Some one in the Greens would probably call them racist.
Labour math is equals unpopular don’t do it or drag it out as long as possible. Only interested in votes.
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@taniwharugby said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
what piston wristed gibbons!
Absolute fluffybunnies. Kids shouldn’t be exposed to that bullshit.
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@stodders said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@jc said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@stodders So will cold cases, as it’s winter. Why should we care again? Unless you’re claiming that people are being hospitalised and dying despite the vaccination rate being so high. Is that what you’re claiming?
No. I'm not claiming that. All I know is:
-
The vaccines do not confer immunity or prevent transmission.
-
Any beneficial effect the vaccines do have wears off, the vaccine manufacturers don’t know when.
-
Vaccines possibly don’t protect against new variants or mutations. Omicron testing will tell us more, but history suggests these types of virus are very difficult to vaccinate against.
-
Vaccines have unknown longterm side effects.
- vaccines are not 100% so why bother; also masks aren't 100% so why bother; also distancing isn't 100% so why bother; seatbelts aren't 100% so why bother etc etc.
- the virus has unknown long term side effects.
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I came on to say the same thing. Can I say C##ts?
Talking to the ex wife today who works in the beauty industry and manages a clinic. They have already had fake passports presented, and people crying about not being able to come in till green light. The instahoes won't get a jab but will get botox.
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@taniwharugby said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@mikedogz yeah type see you next tuesday and the word filter takes over to produce: fluffybunnies
I bet they dont even realise the stupidity of what have done in order to protest 'freedom of choice'
Logic and reasoning aren’t particularly high on anti vaccers list of redeeming qualities. Fuck the government for making them lose their jobs…..but they’ll still go to that same government for the dole when this happens.
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So a bunch of halfwit ferals* decide to interrupt kids sport at the end of a lockdown... a protest instigated by Mr Tamaki I see. Every time I think we've hit peak idiocy lately, someone has to surpass it...
(*) Interrupt kids sport and that's what someone is, regardless of whatever cause.
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@donsteppa said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
So a bunch of halfwit ferals* decide to interrupt kids sport at the end of a lockdown... a protest instigated by Mr Tamaki I see. Every time I think we've hit peak idiocy lately, someone has to surpass it...
(*) Interrupt kids sport and that's what someone is, regardless of whatever cause.
I get pissed off when the rain interrupts my boys cricket like it did today, I’d be ropable if those fuckwits did it for one of his games.
The irony of them protesting “freedom” by taking away a kids pastime even if it’s only once is completely lost on them.
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@mn5 said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@donsteppa said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
So a bunch of halfwit ferals* decide to interrupt kids sport at the end of a lockdown... instigated by Mr Tamaki I see. Every time I think we've hit peak idiocy lately, someone has to surpass it...
(*) Interrupt kids sport and that's what someone is, regardless of whatever cause.
I get furious when the rain interrupts my boys cricket like it did today, I’d be ropable if those fuckwits did it for one of his games.
The irony of them protesting “freedom” by taking away a kids pastime even if it’s only once is completely lost on them.
Yep, I can't fathom looking up this morning to see the sort of scenes in those photos, and then it willfully moving onto the kids fields... yet up at Auckland Domain...
If those particular protesters had a half a mind, surely they'd have found a way to change their location or plans on the fly...
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@donsteppa said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@mn5 said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@donsteppa said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
So a bunch of halfwit ferals* decide to interrupt kids sport at the end of a lockdown... instigated by Mr Tamaki I see. Every time I think we've hit peak idiocy lately, someone has to surpass it...
(*) Interrupt kids sport and that's what someone is, regardless of whatever cause.
I get furious when the rain interrupts my boys cricket like it did today, I’d be ropable if those fuckwits did it for one of his games.
The irony of them protesting “freedom” by taking away a kids pastime even if it’s only once is completely lost on them.
Yep, I can't fathom looking up this morning to see the sort of scenes in those photos, and then it willfully moving onto the kids fields... yet up at Auckland Domain...
If those particular protesters had a half a mind, surely they'd have found a way to change their location or plans on the fly...
They’re too “oppressed” to think that logically or kindly.
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@mn5 said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@taniwharugby said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@mikedogz yeah type see you next tuesday and the word filter takes over to produce: fluffybunnies
I bet they dont even realise the stupidity of what have done in order to protest 'freedom of choice'
Logic and reasoning aren’t particularly high on anti vaccers list of redeeming qualities. Fuck the government for making them lose their jobs…..but they’ll still go to that same government for the dole when this happens.
And they will beg for treatment from the government funded hospital when they get sick
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@mn5 said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@donsteppa said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
So a bunch of halfwit ferals* decide to interrupt kids sport at the end of a lockdown... a protest instigated by Mr Tamaki I see. Every time I think we've hit peak idiocy lately, someone has to surpass it...
(*) Interrupt kids sport and that's what someone is, regardless of whatever cause.
I get pissed off when the rain interrupts my boys cricket like it did today, I’d be ropable if those fuckwits did it for one of his games.
The irony of them protesting “freedom” by taking away a kids pastime even if it’s only once is completely lost on them.
Would have been time to fire up the quick roller
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While I disagree in interrupting a kids game it may be a government funded hospital but don’t forget where the government gets its money. From the people. Whether you like it or not these protestors probably pay taxes and are therefore entitled to hospital care. I am amazed at the disdain that the vaxed have for those who choose not to have the vaccine. You are really showing you colors.
So after 2 years of trying to isolate a microscopic virus with failure now you probably will spend another 2 years figuring out how to manage living with it. Well of course you have your piñata to beat, the unvaxed, instead of blaming your government for the arrogance of containment. They should have focused on those at risk rather than controlling a healthy population. The NZ government has created ruin in peoples lives and brought you to a position where you look down on your fellow man. Don’t blame the unvaxed. Blame the government and the fools that voted for them.
Just want to let you know that if I see you on the street I will not look at you as potentially contagious. I am past the fear of covid. Most of you should be too if you look at then stats and science. I will shake your hand and not look down on you because you choose to obey a government that has their head up their ass.
What have we become?
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@broughie said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
While I disagree in interrupting a kids game it may be a government funded hospital but don’t forget where the government gets its money. From the people. Whether you like it or not these protestors probably pay taxes and are therefore entitled to hospital care. I am amazed at the disdain that the vaxed have for those who choose not to have the vaccine. You are really showing you colors.
So after 2 years of trying to isolate a microscopic virus with failure now you probably will spend another 2 years figuring out how to manage living with it. Well of course you have your piñata to beat, the unvaxed, instead of blaming your government for the arrogance of containment. They should have focused on those at risk rather than controlling a healthy population. The NZ government has created ruin in peoples lives and brought you to a position where you look down on your fellow man. Don’t blame the unvaxed. Blame the government and the fools that voted for them.
Just want to let you know that if I see you on the street I will not look at you as potentially contagious. I am past the fear of covid. Most of you should be too if you look at then stats and science. I will shake your hand and not look down on you because you choose to obey a government that has their head up their ass.
What have we become?
Showing disdain for the minority fucking things up the rest of us ?
I’m happy to show those colours.
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@mn5 said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@broughie said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
While I disagree in interrupting a kids game it may be a government funded hospital but don’t forget where the government gets its money. From the people. Whether you like it or not these protestors probably pay taxes and are therefore entitled to hospital care. I am amazed at the disdain that the vaxed have for those who choose not to have the vaccine. You are really showing you colors.
So after 2 years of trying to isolate a microscopic virus with failure now you probably will spend another 2 years figuring out how to manage living with it. Well of course you have your piñata to beat, the unvaxed, instead of blaming your government for the arrogance of containment. They should have focused on those at risk rather than controlling a healthy population. The NZ government has created ruin in peoples lives and brought you to a position where you look down on your fellow man. Don’t blame the unvaxed. Blame the government and the fools that voted for them.
Just want to let you know that if I see you on the street I will not look at you as potentially contagious. I am past the fear of covid. Most of you should be too if you look at then stats and science. I will shake your hand and not look down on you because you choose to obey a government that has their head up their ass.
What have we become?
Showing disdain for the minority fucking things up the rest of us ?
I’m happy to show those colours.
The unvaxxed are "fucking things up" for the rest of you?
Bro, that's some serious fucking arrogance.
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@voodoo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@mn5 said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@broughie said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
While I disagree in interrupting a kids game it may be a government funded hospital but don’t forget where the government gets its money. From the people. Whether you like it or not these protestors probably pay taxes and are therefore entitled to hospital care. I am amazed at the disdain that the vaxed have for those who choose not to have the vaccine. You are really showing you colors.
So after 2 years of trying to isolate a microscopic virus with failure now you probably will spend another 2 years figuring out how to manage living with it. Well of course you have your piñata to beat, the unvaxed, instead of blaming your government for the arrogance of containment. They should have focused on those at risk rather than controlling a healthy population. The NZ government has created ruin in peoples lives and brought you to a position where you look down on your fellow man. Don’t blame the unvaxed. Blame the government and the fools that voted for them.
Just want to let you know that if I see you on the street I will not look at you as potentially contagious. I am past the fear of covid. Most of you should be too if you look at then stats and science. I will shake your hand and not look down on you because you choose to obey a government that has their head up their ass.
What have we become?
Showing disdain for the minority fucking things up the rest of us ?
I’m happy to show those colours.
The unvaxxed are "fucking things up" for the rest of you?
Bro, that's some serious fucking arrogance.
Actually no they’re not so much anymore, more for themselves. I think the inconvenience of not being able to really go anywhere without a vaccine pass will hopefully spur some of them on to actually getting jabbed.
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They have a choice and they made it. They still get access to health care, they can go to the shops, they can drive. No one is making them wear a yellow star or anything. But don't expect all out compassion from the rest of us who also bear the consequences of their actions. There are things they can't do and at the moment that is the consequence of their choice. They should live with that happy to have a choice, and not ruin someone else's weekend by being inconsiderate fluffybunnies
Coronavirus - New Zealand