Coronavirus - New Zealand
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@taniwharugby said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@nzzp I had pretty much stopped watching the news, only scanned headlines, but back into lockdown went back to being interested in the updates...now, scan headlines, back to avoiding our news.
I try not to watch the live updates. They are just slow, waffly, and the data comes out super fast on the Fern and other, less reliable news sources too
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@nzzp prime example was the night they made the announcement about going into lockdown last month...I was at the gym, at 6pm >30 people stopped and were watching the screen, by the time they made the announcement at about 6.20 we were going to L4 again, maybe 10 people were still watching.
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I think we should end elimination strategy now.
Ideally we would be ending it in about 2 or 3 months. But, stuff happens.
So, I've now transitioned from my elimination until vaccination standpoint. I think the time has now come.
I don't think Auckland should stay in lockdown, in order to eliminate something which seems a bit trickier than last time, just to then re-open (either voluntarily, or because of the next border leak) just a few months later. If you understand that "re-opening" will mean prolonged periods of level 2 and 3 restrictions as the exit curve(s) work through the population, much longer than our previous elimination experiences.
I think we will be exhausting peoples reserves, tolerance, patience, finances now - when there are some tougher months ahead we need to be up for.
For someone like me, outside of Auckland. The rumours of an almost constant level 2+ until at least christmas. I don't see the point.
The benefit of the elimination strategy has been that it is (usually) short and sharp and then back to normal life (so normal, that we complain about complacency). Complacency is the reward of elimination.
I'm ok with living in this level 2+ world for a prolonged period of time. That is for when the virus is here and we are dealing with it by slowing it, flattening the curve.
I'm not ok with living in a 4 months period of Level2+, with no local virus situation, just to provide the pre-conditions that re-elimination can be quickly achieved if needed.
I think we should be 'fast and early' on identifying our NSW moment.
Do we have enough vax coverage now in the vulnerable that we think we can be "she'll be right" as we race for the double dose coverage while the virus expands from what is currently a small base? -
@rapido said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
So, I've now transitioned from my elimination until vaccination standpoint. I think the time has now come.
Can't see it happening to be fair. There's one shot at controlling Delta, and if that means 6-8 weeks of L4, I think the Govt will jump at it. Once you open up, I don't think you can go back to L4 for this.
We won't have everyone with the opportunity two doses for another 3-4 months, and for me that's a really key driver for this. If we can get Delta under control, then relaxing makes sense. If not, the consequences are still very high until everyone is vaccinated.
For me, what Delta has done is highlight that elimination is not a viable long term strategy. Otherwise you'll be into sudden lockdowns, over and over again, and if they become less effective (like this one has), you're lockign down for little return. That said, our health system won't cope with uncontrolled spreading, so I can see Level 2 or 1.5 being a 'thing' for six months or so. God help you if your business relies on crowds (sports, conferences, etc)
There isn't an easy answer here, but elimination is dead in the medium term.
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was a woman caught in Maccas Drive through in Kamo who had been turned back at an Auckland check point at 11pm one night, diverted onto some farmland to get around the border controls, also fueled up at a petrol station and then did a runner....she tested negative.
Stupid people will always do stupid things.
Yeah they need to be looking at life with covid: Get busy living or get busy dying
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@rapido If I read your post right you've changed your position based on rumours?
I do agree with most of what Jegga posted. I've said for a long time that the govt's strategy seems to be 'get lucky - over and over again'
What pisses me off about Cindyrella is the seeming determinant of policy is "will anyone get upset?"
Countless examples of unpopular decisions that the government should have taken to give their elimination strategy more chance of success. They rode their luck sufficiently to give themselves time to do all of the below but didn't and instead went for pious sentiment and hand wringing
Work at the Border and aren't vaccinated - you don't work at the border
Compulsory mask wearing indoors
Compulsory QR Code scanning
Priority vaccinations for all essential workers - what you don't want to get a jab ? Fuck off then.
Saliva testing
COVID Passports. - Sorry you want to do what? but you haven't been jabbed. Fuck off.All of the above would be unpopular, but it would have made us better prepared for the inevitable outbreak.
Plus the most transparent government in the history of the universe really should have been - y'know - transparent.
This is the plan (include all of the above). Do this and when we get to x then this is what happens, y - this, z this. Explain plan will almost inevitably have to be tweaked but at least have a framework and a timeline.
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@nzzp said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@taniwharugby said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@nzzp I had pretty much stopped watching the news, only scanned headlines, but back into lockdown went back to being interested in the updates...now, scan headlines, back to avoiding our news.
I try not to watch the live updates. They are just slow, waffly, and the data comes out super fast on the Fern and other, less reliable news sources too
Hah i'm the same. I also dont like being spoken at like I am a 4 year old child either.
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Unfortunately the more I think about it the more I despair, we are simply locked into the elimination strategy as there's no other viable option.
And this is because precious little has been done to give us any other.
There's been billions of dollars spent ($77b and counting) yet precious little on boosting our healthcare system, no new hospitals, no new ICU's, no significant raise in ICU capacity.
Add to this even if we were to build additional capacity we would not have the staff trained to run it.
So you would think knowing this there would be a priority on getting qualified staff in or developing them.
But instead the government has introduced pay freezes for our nurses. The government has also frozen immigration and residency applications so getting more qualified people in appears impossible. What's worse with the residency issues we have qualified doctors and nurses (probably more-so nurses) actively looking to leave NZ because they can't get residency and bring their families here. Or even worse have families here but they can't stay as their temporary visa's are running out. They might as well head off to Canada or Australia where they can make a life for themselves and their family instead of living in NZ alone.
I support the theory of flattening the curve so the healthcare systems can cope. But when the healthcare system appears to be so stuffed that even a small offshore break let alone a wave is going to cause the thing to collapse then what's the point?
If you're not building the wall higher your sacrifice is useless, what's even odder is that some government policy is tearing down bits of the wall we have in place...
Unfortunately the team of $55 million (the media) is doing precious little to hold the government to account, opposition parties appear to be nit-picking minor detail instead of highlighting the larger issues at play and the nay-sayers of the elimination strategy only appear to come across as complete fruit loop anti -vax conspiracy theorists (probably because they are).
I really feel like one of those old Testament prophets howling in the wilderness (but must reassure you I'm not at the point of being clothed in sack cloth and ashes and having a diet of wild honey).
Is this just me? Can someone pat me on the head and tell me it's all going to be ok...
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@anonymous they said 32/33 linked already I thnk
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@snowy said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@nzzp said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
the Fern and other, less reliable news sources too
Ummm...
Betoota Advocate? The Onion?
thought I'd compare sources today. The Fern delivered. Betoota - well, that too
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@godder said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@smudge said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@kirwan said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
It’s what gets me about this situation, peoples empathy seems to have gone missing.
Someone on Twitter (seemed to be friendly with Red Beard) proclaimed they were happy for the borders to stay closed for years because, and I quote, "I did all my travelling in my 20s" so they didn't see the need to travel again.
Small-minded, self-absorbed fuckwit.
I'm not a fan of Fortress NZ long term but international travel was not likely to be the same for some time, at least until Covid-19 variants eventually drop down to something more mild, and nobody is actually stopped from going on the standard 2-3 year OE - it's the return trip home and MIQ that's the bastard, not the leaving.
Carbon pricing and other similar Climate-related issues are likely to be longer-term problems with overseas travel, not Covid-19.
Bit of a trite comment this.
Firstly, there are no flights to get on. A good friend ours is flying back to NZ on the "red" flight Wednesday as her sister has terminal cancer. 2 weeks in MIQ await, then travel home. Looking at return flights to Sydney, and she couldn't see anything until late October.
Second and more importantly, and I know you kind of mention it, but it's really fucking hard to find flights home. You have to get into MIQ which is nigh-on impossible (she only managed because of the gravity of her situation), and finding flights is just as hard. Even these red flights, we have no idea when the next one is.
When people go overseas on an OE they don't typically go with the understanding that it could be years before they get home, even if some tragedy were to happen at home while away.