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@kirwan said in NZ Politics:
Not a good idea IMO. You don't want a business that needs people to be in prison to survive, opens up a path for corruption with Judges being paid to send people away (as has happened in the US).
It's about getting the incentives correct.
If a prison was contracted to have x prisoners over a set period of time, the drive for more profit via more prisoners only comes up at renegotiation time. The problem with the US system is that pressure is continual.
Continuing with the incentives. Having fines for mistreatment of prisoners is a no brainer to maintain standards.
An obvious positive incentive would be the company getting bonuses based on lowering, and then keeping a low, recidivism rate.
Thats what the society wants isn't it?With that bonus system every employee will be getting judged on how well they are helping the company reach that goal of low recidivism. That links the workers daily efforts with the outcome that we all want.
The monolithic public system doesn't judge workers in that way.. there is no incentive toA system like that would allow trials of different methods of lowering recidivism. Some will succeed, some will fail. The successful ones will spread. Under a monolithic system a poor system can be imposed everywhere and correcting any mistakes is a slow process.
tldr - US private prisons are shitty but that does not mean all private prisons would be shitty.
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@duluth said in NZ Politics:
@kirwan said in NZ Politics:
Not a good idea IMO. You don't want a business that needs people to be in prison to survive, opens up a path for corruption with Judges being paid to send people away (as has happened in the US).
It's about getting the incentives correct.
If a prison was contracted to have x prisoners over a set period of time, the drive for more profit via more prisoners only comes up at renegotiation time. The problem with the US system is that pressure is continual.
Continuing with the incentives. Having fines for mistreatment of prisoners is a no brainer to maintain standards.
An obvious positive incentive would be the company getting bonuses based on lowering, and then keeping a low, recidivism rate.
Thats what the society wants isn't it?With that bonus system every employee will be getting judged on how well they are helping the company reach that goal of low recidivism. That links the workers daily efforts with the outcome that we all want.
The monolithic public system doesn't judge workers in that way.. there is no incentive toA system like that would allow trials of different methods of lowering recidivism. Some will succeed, some will fail. The successful ones will spread. Under a monolithic system a poor system can be imposed everywhere and correcting any mistakes is a slow process.
tldr - US private prisons are shitty but does not mean all private prisons would be shitty.
US private prisons are shitty for sure , also prison guard unions lobbying to keep dope illegal is dodgy too.
I like the ideas about trials to reduce recidivism, I’ve got a mate who employs a few ex cons . The trouble is not with the work ethic but keeping them from hanging out with their idiot mates and slipping into old habits.
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@duluth said in NZ Politics:
@kirwan said in NZ Politics:
Not a good idea IMO. You don't want a business that needs people to be in prison to survive, opens up a path for corruption with Judges being paid to send people away (as has happened in the US).
It's about getting the incentives correct.
If a prison was contracted to have x prisoners over a set period of time, the drive for more profit via more prisoners only comes up at renegotiation time. The problem with the US system is that pressure is continual.
Continuing with the incentives. Having fines for mistreatment of prisoners is a no brainer to maintain standards.
An obvious positive incentive would be the company getting bonuses based on lowering, and then keeping a low, recidivism rate.
Thats what the society wants isn't it?With that bonus system every employee will be getting judged on how well they are helping the company reach that goal of low recidivism. That links the workers daily efforts with the outcome that we all want.
The monolithic public system doesn't judge workers in that way.. there is no incentive toA system like that would allow trials of different methods of lowering recidivism. Some will succeed, some will fail. The successful ones will spread. Under a monolithic system a poor system can be imposed everywhere and correcting any mistakes is a slow process.
tldr - US private prisons are shitty but that does not mean all private prisons would be shitty.
I agree, but would still be concerened about unintended consequences. It would be pretty tough to get the incentives right because it's essentially like starting a hotel where the goal is to have as few guests as possible.
It naturally leans the other way.
It's fair to say what we are doing now doesn't work, so we probably should try something new. Maybe start with lower security, shorter term prisoners so any mistakes are less serious.
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https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12135775
The President of FIANZ, Mustafa Farouk, discussed some of the challenges and opportunities that lie ahead in the New Zealand Muslim community. Farouk spoke of the need to have Muslims visible in key government sectors of society. The Muslim community provides New Zealand with a point of access to the global halal market.
In response to Dr Farouk’s speech the Hon Salesa shared her priority around increasing ethnic representation on State sector boards. She spoke of the recent approval of a cabinet paper that will collect ethnicity data on State sector boards. She hopes this achievement will aid her desire to see more ethnic people appointed to boards.
The Hon Salesa encouraged attendees to register with the Office of Ethnic Communities’ nominations service and participate in Kōrero Mātauranga, a public consultation from the Ministry of Education. She thanked the Muslim community for their contribution to New Zealand, and spoke of New Zealand’s diversity as a source of richness.
http://ethniccommunities.govt.nz/story/federation-islamic-associations-new-zealand-annual-general-meeting -
As usual, shit that embarrasses the ship of fools is released to the media on Friday .
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12137532
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@jegga said in NZ Politics:
This is a splendid rant that sums things up quite nicely
That's a comprehensive effort by the author Jegga, thanks for posting it. My knowledge of NZ politics is sparse - not much more than reading occasional pieces over the years on the leaders from Robert Muldoon on - and this KiwiFirewalker's account has certainly improved my understanding of the current machinations.
I was astonished when your voters elected Why-the-Long-Face, a prepubescent school girl, because she had precisely nothing at all to offer. I see now that the lustre has dulled considerably and I am pleased to read that. There was no surprise in this description:
"Bottom line is that the rather undefined image of Jacinda Ardern as something special is what got Labour back into office but as the pressures mounts the image has faded away to reveal a rather inexperienced individual who has about as much control over her party as other backbench MP that was suddenly thrust into the spotlight on account of their having some quirk of character which temporarily snagged the public's interest."
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@mick-gold-coast-qld that’s the most galling thing about having this cretin as pm , she wasn’t elected and Winston Peters who is effectively pm had no intention of going into coalition with national . After he announced he was entering a coalition with labour and the gunts he sued two national MPs , if he had of made that clear before the election things would have been different.
The next poll will be interesting, simon bridges has the charisma of a white spot on a white wall and I don’t see him lasting till the next election. . But Ardern is looking increasingly out of her depth , one of her MPs Meka the Muss assaulted one of her staff and when it became public announced she “ was blown away by her support” which is code for “ sack me and I reckon I can win a bielection as an independent “. So she only got demoted .
There’s the ongoing saga of the labour rape camp and the fact they were so unprepared to be in government they didn’t actually have any proper plans so have kicked the can fown the road with about 150 inquiries.
Also there’s the a minister for open government busted twice for having secret meetings and communications that have ruined people’s employment opportunities when they came to light.
All of this is within 12 months
Oh “ why the long face” had a baby too , apparently some people give a shit about that . You can probably guess how many fucks I give about her ability to sully the gene pool .
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@siam said in NZ Politics:
@jegga said in NZ Politics:
This is a splendid rant that sums things up quite nicely
Yeah that's a good read for those outside of NZ.
Did the author get the pervading feeling right?
There should be a lot of angry people because they have fucked over much of their base ie teachers nurses and now everyone with the fuel tax. But it's hard to know and I reckon there are lots of left wing sheeple slurping the red cool aid
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Have to love Taxinda desperately trying to blame the evil corporations for the petrol rises her governments taxes have caused.
My favourite line was her saying even if we took the exudes off the petrol companies could leave the prices up. Nothing to do with us, honest!
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Like I said, they are going to try and eradicate the tahr and trout are next .
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12137630
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@kirwan said in NZ Politics:
Have to love Taxinda desperately trying to blame the evil corporations for the petrol rises her governments taxes have caused.
My favourite line was her saying even if we took the exudes off the petrol companies could leave the prices up. Nothing to do with us, honest!
Could someone with a better understanding of economics than me (and the current government) give their take on this? Obviously labour introducing the tax against all advice is what kicked it off, but interested to understand what's happening now and how it can be fixed if at all.
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@jegga He doesn't address the major issue in NZ politics which the rise of St Cindy has done nothing to distill.
The Nats have no likely coalition partner and none on the horizon. So unless Winston does a total about face (unlikely but not impossible) then they have to do what no previous govt has done and take >50% of the party vote. Now if John Key couldn't do that it's very unlikely Bridges (or Crusher) will be able to.
National support is holding up really well but I figure that already reflects those that are pissy with Winnie for rolling National last year.
So they really need NZF to poll as high as possible without reaching 5% and hope that allows them to gain a majority. Or the Greens to do likewise or Simple Simon's wet dream - both.
I can't see either party failing to get to 5% next time. The greens are probably most exposed as Winnie is promoting his independence and pork barrelling as if there is no tomorrow but I think they have a hard core support above the threshold.
So what's National's alternative-some sort of right wing / Christian coalition emerging? Almost happened with the Conservatives but for Colin Craig's indiscretions. Any other rich pricks out there that want to fund a vanity project?
At this stage I think their best bet is a total rebrand of ACT that allows them to gain a couple of percentage points and bring some overhang MP's on board - unlikely thought that seems.
Otherwise cue much wailing about changing MMP and prepare for another 3 years of really important stuff like Neve's first tooth.
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@dogmeat said in NZ Politics:
At this stage I think their best bet is a total rebrand of ACT that allows them to gain a couple of percentage points and bring some overhang MP's on board - unlikely thought that seems.
Yep, you just nailed it. I think Peters has a risk of dropping below 5%; he'll have money, but once in government is no longer 'anti the establishment'. Also, his natural constituency is dying off. I cannot see Shane Jones getting there -- he can't even win an electorate.
But, this is MMP. The down side for the current labour led government is that any anti-govt votes can only go to National. Greens and NZF prop it up, so it's National (or another minor party)
NZ Politics