Cannabis debate
-
@taniwharugby said in Cannabis debate:
@Mokey i think the roadside testing has long been an issue with marijuana in NZ, although as someone mentioned above there are some better testing being used in Aus presently
In my opinion we’re really going to need it too. My suspicion is there will be a decent number of people who have little sense of responsibility who will take decriminalisation as a green light (no pun intended!) to use regardless of circumstances.
Ideally people will use the expected discipline around drinking as a starting point, i.e. don’t drive under the influence, don’t turn up to work with it in your system etc. But some will get that balance wrong and be pissed off when they get sacked for doing something legal, forgetting that there are many things that are legal that you still shouldn’t do at work.
-
@canefan said in Cannabis debate:
@voodoo said in Cannabis debate:
@Kirwan said in Cannabis debate:
@canefan said in Cannabis debate:
@voodoo said in Cannabis debate:
@taniwharugby said in Cannabis debate:
I'm a def yes for medicinal cannabis, but am still on the fence re decriminalising it.
I did have a chuckle reading the article the other day, Whinny saying NZ First would make ciggies cheaper, then had a dig at the making NZ Smoke FRee by 2025 and legalizing weed...
So if NZ becomes smoke free (Yeah Right) does that make Tobacco illegal then? Assume Weed would be too, for smoking at least?
Was listening to something the other day and NZ is def not going down the route of some of the US states with gummies and all sorts of products and paraphenalia
I think its absolutely staggering that anyone could not be for medicinal cannabis, but be ok with being prescribed opioids like oxycontin or morphine...🤔
I've no problem with medicinal cannabis. I'm yet to be convinced that the government would appropriately manage recreational cannabis
Maybe start with that and gradually shift.
Not for me mate. I don't see why the public should have any say over what doctors can prescribe. We didn't vote in morphine, we shouldn't be voting out marijuana.
Recreational is a totally differently of fish, though I'm still in favour of it.
I think you are confused. I said the public shouldn't be consulted about medicinal. Its a health issue for the professionals. And I agreed with Kirwan that phasing in medicinal first then looking at recreational after might be a good idea
Got it 👍
-
Medicinal use of cannabis - yes. If it offers pain relief to those who are suffering then that's clearly a good thing. However, I'm unconvinced that it offers much direct benefit to individuals with neurodegenerative disorders.
Recreational/Social use of cannabis - on the fence. Heavy use of HTC over time exacerbates the chance of developing many cancers. Sustained cannabis use does damage to the teenage brain and makes it less receptive to learning. However, I generally think what an adult individual does in their own home isn't the business of state.
-
I’ve heard anecdotally that in the places that have legalised weed, teenage use decreased rather than increased. Does anyone have any data on this? They thought the reason was that it took the rebellion factor away.
The impairment vs trace in system thing needs to be cleared up.
I don’t want weed cafes in nz but I would like to see it decriminalised.
-
@Hooroo said in Cannabis debate:
.I don’t want weed cafes in nz but I would like to see it decriminalised.
Why not?
Is it any worse than seeing 18yr olds stumble out of pubs at 2am? Vomiting in gutters?
I've been to a bunch of weed cafes and they were all very civil
-
See here (linked from a ranked peer-reviewed journal):
CONFLICTING DATA ON TEENAGE USE Marijuana use is historically common among adolescents, and the drug has typically been easy to come by regardless of its legal status. Several studies have attempted to gauge its use among teens, but there have been contradictions in the findings as well as potential issues with the methodology. A recent study found that adolescents residing in states with liberal marijuana laws (medical and/or recreational) were more than twice as likely to try alternative means of use-vaping and edibles-than those living in states with stricter laws. The study's lead author, Jacob T. Borodovsky of the Center for Technology and Behavioral Health at the Geisel School of Medicine at Dartmouth College, explains that this finding reinforces the idea that if marijuana is more available, teens are more likely to try it. But Borodovsky notes that one of the problems associated with studying the effects of marijuana legalization is that laws and oversight differ by state. "New Hampshire has four medical marijuana dispensaries and one of the most restrictive medical marijuana laws in the country," he says, "while California has much looser oversight. So putting New Hampshire and California in the same analysis doesn't make sense. We have to sort this out if we want to figure out how legal dispensaries affect usage." However, other studies have found that marijuana use among teens has not increased despite changing laws. Findings from the National Institute on Drug Abuse's annual Monitoring the Future survey, which measures drug use and related attitudes among eighth, 10th, and 12th graders, showed that past-year marijuana use is at its lowest level in over 20 years among eighth and 10th graders, and that between 2015 and 2016, the percentage of eighth and 10th graders using marijuana daily dropped from 1.1% to 0.7% and from 3% to 2.5%, respectively. Marijuana use by 12th graders remained the same, however, with 6% reporting daily use.
-
@voodoo said in Cannabis debate:
@Hooroo said in Cannabis debate:
.I don’t want weed cafes in nz but I would like to see it decriminalised.
Why not?
Is it any worse than seeing 18yr olds stumble out of pubs at 2am? Vomiting in gutters?
I've been to a bunch of weed cafes and they were all very civil
You certainly won't get bar fights in a hash spot
-
@taniwharugby said in Cannabis debate:
@Mokey i think the roadside testing has long been an issue with marijuana in NZ, although as someone mentioned above there are some better testing being used in Aus presently
Not where I work. It is still the basic test of whether it's in your system or not. It's a low grade charge and it's amazing how many people fail the tests. Not sure making it legal will mean more people driving 'stoned' because they are doing it already now.
-
@Crazy-Horse It think a guy in Oz fought a conviction (charge?) because of that limitation on the test. Can't recall if he won, lost, or if it's ongoing. Similar to alcohol there needs to be a test based on impairment rather than whether you've had some in the last 24-48 hours.
-
@Crazy-Horse ah ok, i thought there had been improvements in recent years, that does create a big hurdle if there isn't a way to test like alcohol.
@Paekakboyz impairment varies with alcohol in different people so ideally you have a measure like we do with alcohol...
-
@Paekakboyz I haven't heard that before.
It's a tough law. The ones getting charged are drivers who are not showing any signs of indicia. If there is sufficient indicia they get charged with diving UID.
We often get asked how long it stays in the system. It's a bit like how long is a piece of string? I have heard some people who have returned a positive test claim they haven't had any at all for at least four days, while others who returned a negative test have admitted to having some the night before. But then again, people don't always tell the truth.
-
Driving under the influence.
Smoked cannabis is no different than smoked tobacco when it comes to health.If these issues are addressed I wouldn’t necessarily be opposed to some sort of legalisation.
-
@gt12 said in Cannabis debate:
See here (linked from a ranked peer-reviewed journal):
CONFLICTING DATA ON TEENAGE USE Marijuana use is historically common among adolescents, and the drug has typically been easy to come by regardless of its legal status. Several studies have attempted to gauge its use among teens, but there have been contradictions in the findings as well as potential issues with the methodology. A recent study found that adolescents residing in states with liberal marijuana laws (medical and/or recreational) were more than twice as likely to try alternative means of use-vaping and edibles-than those living in states with stricter laws. The study's lead author, Jacob T. Borodovsky of the Center for Technology and Behavioral Health at the Geisel School of Medicine at Dartmouth College, explains that this finding reinforces the idea that if marijuana is more available, teens are more likely to try it.
Geisel School of Medicine. What an awesome name..
-
Seems to be a lot of confusion around 'medicinal use'
At the moment use of any 'cannabanoid' product is grouped alongside the use of THC.
For some bizarre reason, non THC products have to be prescribed by a doctor if your GP is 'anti' then you are shit out of luck.
Even more strangely we are looking at legalising the use of THC but not making CBD legal (without a prescription and high cost). So you could get high but not take a 'health supplement'.
Some may argue that CBD belongs in the woo thread and there is plenty of reasearch and argument to go into that topic yet. However there is next to no evidence of harm from this product and lots of anecdotal evidence of postive effects. It is sold openly without restriction in many countries with zero harm.
This all has nothing to do with the referendum though as nothing in this area will change.
Just pointing out that 'medicinal use' is already catered for under law but the many variations are all grouped alongside getting stoned to relieve pain.
-
@voodoo said in Cannabis debate:
@Hooroo said in Cannabis debate:
.I don’t want weed cafes in nz but I would like to see it decriminalised.
Why not?
Is it any worse than seeing 18yr olds stumble out of pubs at 2am? Vomiting in gutters?
I've been to a bunch of weed cafes and they were all very civil
True. I suppose they will only be able to take the shape of a eatery as you can't smoke inside in NZ.
-
@taniwharugby similar to Amsterdam where most folks going overboard at the cafes are tourists not the locals.... although there will no doubt be some hardcore Dutchies
-
Important also to understand that this is a referendum to indicate to parliament that you want them to work out how to do this practically, safely, and with input over concerns.
This is not a binding 'as proposed' thing.I am going to decide based on whether I want them to have the chance to sort it out and put it to the floor. I would be hoping that many of the concerns would be debated and ironed out.
-
just read this Letter to the Editor in the Northern Advocate...
I have not fact checked it