Censorship and the Mosque Shooting
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@booboo and yet, increased security across the board in the last 20 years has coincided with more terrorist acts.🤔
The only option is to search every car and every person at every gathering of more than 20 people.
Or cancel every gathering.
Ring fence the world isn't a good strategy
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Similar to @No-Quarter I've seen at least one instance of a cancellation due to lack of policing resource - at the level of policing the event would have required pre-shooting. Not a higher level of resource, or that they see an increased risk for said event.
But in saying that other changes like the one for CubaDupa is a mix of the two factors. Where an event in a totally open space would be tough to provide security for, even at levels before the chch incident. And they are worried about the higher risk of 'something' happening.
@Siam I think some of it is about helping people get back to an even keel. In that there is an expectation that we'll see higher level of security for a while. All well and good to say we are getting played but emotions and responses to all this are still raw as.
If we are still seeing things cancelled etc in 3+ months, especially as the findings of reviews into this scenario come out, then I think your take on the situation will be justified.
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@Paekakboyz what's the threat?
If we had access to the doc like the rest of the world, serious questions would be asked regarding our response.
We are not a fearful country but are being portrayed as such. This was a great opportunity to promote helping the victims and getting on with life. Instead it's handwringing due to a demonstrably one off act of 30 mins violence, the like of which has been prevalent worldwide.
What's the threat? I know I'm alluding to info not available though mate.
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@Siam said in Censorship and the Mosque Shooting:
Having learned about the gunman, there is no reason for heightened security or alarm.
NZ is getting played
Here in Christchurch there’s alot of nervous people still around...I don’t think this is due to any hyperbole in the media or from government, it’s a natural reaction to such an event.
A heightened police presence and security level is reassuring, regardless of whether there’s likely to be another attack.
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@Siam I think the primary threat it a dumbass copycat incident. The attack being pretty much a lone wolf incident (web/forum links aside) would indicate a low level of risk from another 'cell' or similar. Or at least as far as the info that has been shared.
What you are calling fearful I'm seeing a prudent and time-bound. We aren't a bunch of wussy's now because we've had a horrendous thing happen and people are unsettled. I think you actually unpacked part of it yourself - this is shit that has been prevalent overseas... not here. So why the surprise when we react strongly to it??
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@Paekakboyz immediately after something like this, the average person is probably more worried about personal safety than the prospect of NZ becoming a police state
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"The threat" is copycat or retaliation by people possibly linked, but more likely completely unrelated.
Have read somewhere that the risk of both types of events in overseas experience is highest in the six weeks after a major event. And from talking to the police, sure enough we're just under two weeks into a six week response plan.
Plus again, there are a lot of police in Christchurch/drawn to Christchurch to work on the investigation and the myriad of things that go with 50 individual murders to be processed, family liaison, etc etc. And the need for some of them now to have a break after being on duty for some long hours and weeks.
I haven't seen the manifesto nor have any interest in seeing it, but I doubt it has any information about specifically who will do anything next. But I am sure that the police/SIS/GCSB/FBI/Five Eyes/Turkish authorities/Australian authorities/etc/etc will have now been through it with a fine tooth comb for specific threats, and that there's not much more that a bunch of us on a rugby forum are likely to add to that collective analysis.
Copycats or retaliation still being the more likely risk (risk, not certainty, but a bit of caution for a few weeks is hardly the end of the world).
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The six week risk is interesting @Donsteppa, and certainly makes sense - thanks for sharing.
I think the biggest risk is retaliation, though I'd never rule out the chance of a copycat. ISIS have already called for revenge, and although there are not many, there are some Salafi/Wahabi Muslims in NZ that are sympathetic to their cause. That would justify heightened security for that alone - think I read a while back there's around 40 on our terrorism watchlist (I.E. people with a criminal history that have shown support for violent jihadists).
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@Paekakboyz said in Censorship and the Mosque Shooting:
@Siam I think the primary threat it a dumbass copycat incident. The attack being pretty much a lone wolf incident (web/forum links aside) would indicate a low level of risk from another 'cell' or similar. Or at least as far as the info that has been shared.
If it were then it I think it would be Mosques that would be getting the security. I'd be figuring that retaliatory attack is the biggest concern but obviously this isn't something that can be vocalised in our current climate.
I'd be curious as to how Oz is upping its own security response. From what I've seen Jacinda & world media has done a really good job as painting NZ as compassionate and a victim in this. Conversely the perpetrator comes from Australia, we've had Senator Anning's stupid comments and media trying to associate this attack with various Australian patriot groups and conservative figures.
Even without a motivation that could come from the horrors in Christchurch, Melbourne has still had 7 Islamic inspired terrorist incidents s in the last 2 years, 3 foiled and 4 carried out attacks by 'lone wolf' individuals. There are also currently 160 individuals in Victoria being monitored on a terror watch list. I'd imagine Islamic extremists & white identatarian extremists alike would both be looking forward to further escalations in violence to satisfy their own ends. Very challenging time for security services right now I'd think.
I'm personally going to be avoiding town where possible on Fridays for a bit
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@No-Quarter said in Censorship and the Mosque Shooting:
The six week risk is interesting @Donsteppa, and certainly makes sense - thanks for sharing.
The overseas reference was buried somewhere in a Stuff article but I can't find it at the moment... I'm guessing it's ultimately a society level version of a cooling down period - having a very visible security presence to deter any hotheads from doing anything reactive, while everyone gets the chance to take a deep breath and simmer down.
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@Rembrandt said in Censorship and the Mosque Shooting:
@Paekakboyz said in Censorship and the Mosque Shooting:
@Siam I think the primary threat it a dumbass copycat incident. The attack being pretty much a lone wolf incident (web/forum links aside) would indicate a low level of risk from another 'cell' or similar. Or at least as far as the info that has been shared.
If it were then it I think it would be Mosques that would be getting the security.
They are. The last time I visited on Saturday there was an armed presence outside the local mosque for their prayer session.
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I see youtube competitor 'Bitchute' is still banned by most? ISPs in Australia.
Strangely enough Telstra & Optus seem to be giving different reasons for the banning. Telstra is talking more about corporate responsibility and 'the right thing to do' ...while Optus may have accidentally revealed that the request came from the Australian Federal Police.
I have a video showing my source but not sure if that would contravene NZ censorship guidelines as it lists all the sites that the police asked to be banned.
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@No-Quarter Yet I know JP fans will remember and will be avoiding whitcoulls henceforth
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@Kirwan said in Censorship and the Mosque Shooting:
Can’t even get basic facts like JP not being right wing accurate. Five minutes of research will have him discovering that considering actual right wingers hate his guts.
I paid more attention to the idea that censoring the ideas that appealed to the gunman was a bad idea. But we all take what we want from things.....
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@Kirwan it's gone beyond a joke aye. Just total drivel.
Has JP actually sued anyone for slander/libel around the Alt right association? Feels like he's educator media, one interview at a time, that he's not alt-right, and that they actually loath him!