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Conspiring with a foreign power to subvert British democracy. Not surprising but still incredibly disgusting.
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Sorry but why would anyone expect him to resign?
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@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Brexit:
Sorry but why would anyone expect him to resign?
Exactly.
I'm not a fan, but from what I've seen his party still want him to be leader so no need to resign there.
And if he isn't able to deliver Brexit on 31 October that's because opposition parties have put a block on it.
Or am I missing something?
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Johnson said he'd rather die in a ditch than ask for an extension of Article 50. Some commentators (incorrectly in my opinion) think this will mean he will resign.
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Some speculation that he will force an election by resigning as PM, not party leader, then vote No Confidence in Corbyn. Not likely, as the main Tory political message is that the idea of PM Corbyn is unfathomable.
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Some of this is difficult for Boris Johnson as a person. His younger brother, Joe, resigned on Friday. Some of his closest and oldest friends from Oxford and journalism days are very senior in the Remain campaign. Several MPs very loyal in the past to him no longer have Conservative party whip. Recent break-up with wife and kids. Strain showed a bit on Thursday & Friday (he is not the best Poker player) but he won't resign.
Weekend opinion polls very good for Johnson. He will try to force an election tomorrow. A one-line Bill saying "Not withstanding the Fixed Term Parliament Act of 2010, there will be a General Election on October 15th" would only need a simple Commons majority (then Lords approval & Queens signature), rather than 2/3rds Commons support.
Opposition parties would love to delay an election until November or early next year. Another postponement to Brexit would see Conservative support drift to Farage. Another quarter of negative growth figures and the UK is in recession which would be helpful for Corbyn and Labour's electoral fortunes. Lib Dems still lack finance and organisation to target more than about 60 seats, but are in conversations with some ex-Tory donors who are pro-EU.
Fascinating to see who prevails tomorrow.
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I enjoyed this for a read, one part of it:
Hand-in-hand with this concept goes the other universal rule of Westminster politics: that is, you want to avoid an ascendant opponent in the first place. You want to keep your opponent weak enough to get beaten on polling day but not so weak that their own party replaces them with someone who could beat you.
This is precisely why the Coalition never went for the jugular on Bill Shorten.
But of course both these concepts are far too complex for Jeremy Corbyn, a man whose density is rivalled only by the bottom half of the periodic table.
The UK Labour leader's refusal to co-operate with Theresa May on a soft Brexit both dramatically increased the likelihood of a hard one and rendered her position so untenable that it effectively ensured her replacement by the far more popular Boris Johnson.
Not only that, Mr Corbyn's own position on Brexit was so hopelessly compromised and confused that his only tactic of the past two years was to loudly and constantly demand the Conservatives go to the polls, apparently blissfully unaware of the possibility that when they finally granted his wish, it might be under a different leader.
Now of course his bluff has been called and sooner or later, he will have no choice but to send himself to his doom. Honestly, anyone who ever gets the chance to play cards with this guy should immediately take him up on it and chuck their car keys in the pot. A five-year-old could beat him with pair of deuces.
www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=12265853
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I liked this bit...
"The far more disturbing thing to emerge from this whole sorry sh*tshow is the outrageously elitist attitude that the masses were not educated enough to know what they were voting for in the 2016 referendum and their error must be corrected by their intellectual betters.
Even Orwell himself would marvel that in 21st century Britain, supposedly enlightened politicians are arguing that people should be able to vote any way they want as long as it's the right one. Some pigs are indeed more equal than others.
The good news is that if these people really want a government that decides what's good for them without the pesky nuisance of democracy, then there's a very big and powerful country they can move to.
The only catch is it's not in Europe."
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Opposition parties would love to delay an election until November or early next year. Another postponement to Brexit would see Conservative support drift to Farage
I don’t think it would. Farage is a bit of a bystander at the moment and hasn’t really got anything to offer other than a no deal alliance.
Another quarter of negative growth figures and the UK is in recession which would be helpful for Corbyn and Labour's electoral fortunes. Lib Dems still lack finance and organisation to target more than about 60 seats, but are in conversations with some ex-Tory donors who are pro-EU.
Fascinating to see who prevails tomorrow.
He’s in Ireland speaking to Vadrakar which will be interesting for public support. Macron snd Merkel comments after BoJo meetings were quite optimistic. If he gets similar from Leo it could be a big deal momentum swing.
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Problems there.
- Trump doesn't really like free trade and resents UK trade surplus with US.
- Deal would need to be approved by House. Democrats in House won't support a deal if UK breaks Good Friday Agreement.
- Deal would need 67 votes in the Senate where again the Democrats will back Ireland.
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@MajorRage Brexit Party still polling about 13%. Watch that go up if Brexit delayed beyond October.
Farage has promised not to stand against Conservative MPs who voted against Withdrawal Agreement three times and promise not to support any deal.
Rumour has it that Farage is preparing to stand in Uxbridge, Johnson's own constituency. Farage is very skillful at positioning always a bit to the right of the Tories.
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Problems there.
- Trump doesn't really like free trade and resents UK trade surplus with US.
- Deal would need to be approved by House. Democrats in House won't support a deal if UK breaks Good Friday Agreement.
- Deal would need 67 votes in the Senate where again the Democrats will back Ireland.
On point 1, I think his dislike for Macron, Merkel, and EU commision outweighs anything else. He'd love to get one over them. I've just finished his book, one thing that strikes me he doesn't mind losing out a bit financially in order to stand up for what he thinks is right, especially against whom he views as bullies.
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Behind a paywall so I don't know the details...thinking maybe I should get a subscription.. haven't seen any Telegraph articles fall into the absurd as yet, maybe its still a semi decent source? Or is it heavily Tory skewed?
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If the political class don't want something to happen, then it's hard for it to happen.
Agreed - and interesting stats!
The thing about a referendum, is that it is generally not legally binding. So the sitting government can choose to ignore its outcome if not what they wanted - obviously with the accompanying risks to their future power hopes.
So a referendum is "getting a sense of what people want" as opposed to what must then legally be done.
This bit is often ignored by Brexiteers in their arguments with the Remoaners when they seem to hold that the referendum is some legally binding moment / declaration.But the fun twist with the Brexit referendum though, was if I recall correctly, that the government of the time had promised - pre the referendum - to implement the outcome... So they morally (although not legally) bound themselves to a non-binding vote. Cue the circus.
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@Billy-Webb said in Brexit:
So a referendum is "getting a sense of what people want" as opposed to what must then legally be done.
This bit is often ignored by Brexiteers in their arguments with the Remoaners when they seem to hold that the referendum is some legally binding moment / declaration.But the fun twist with the Brexit referendum though, was if I recall correctly, that the government of the time had promised - pre the referendum - to implement the outcome... So they morally (although not legally) bound themselves to a non-binding vote. Cue the circus.
The trouble with that stance is not only did the government say it would be implemented but many, if not all of the freelancing conservative MPs were on the record saying they would too. This also puts aside there has been a general election in the interim where conservative candidates ran on a platform of delivering Brexit.
I haven't really heard this point made before (at least at this late stage, maybe in the immediate aftermath of the vote), because even the modest ardent remainer accepts that any avenue to reversing Brexit would need to go through a second referendum.
Brexit