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@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
Also how dodgy is it that Lynch asks Comey to not use the word "investigation" about Clinton ... He said that makes him uncomfortable. . but complies. But doesn't take notes in any following meetings. Trump gets in and suddenly he makes notes on everything?
TBF Lynch was his boss, Trump wasn't (in the sense that there is meant to be distance)
Errrrr no.
What gives you that idea? No difference in the "distance" required.Not according to Comey. Whether he is correct or not in that it is the way he viewed it and would explain the different approach
Where did Comey say or define what 'distance ' is?
Lynch has no more right to interfere than Trump. Where does he say otherwise?In his written statement.
No, he absolutely did not.
Which page and paragraph?
3, second to last
At one point, I explained why it was so important that the FBI and the
Department of Justice be independent of the White House -
@Crucial said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
Also how dodgy is it that Lynch asks Comey to not use the word "investigation" about Clinton ... He said that makes him uncomfortable. . but complies. But doesn't take notes in any following meetings. Trump gets in and suddenly he makes notes on everything?
TBF Lynch was his boss, Trump wasn't (in the sense that there is meant to be distance)
Errrrr no.
What gives you that idea? No difference in the "distance" required.Not according to Comey. Whether he is correct or not in that it is the way he viewed it and would explain the different approach
Where did Comey say or define what 'distance ' is?
Lynch has no more right to interfere than Trump. Where does he say otherwise?In his written statement.
No, he absolutely did not.
Which page and paragraph?
3, second to last
At one point, I explained why it was so important that the FBI and the
Department of Justice be independent of the White HouseThat doesnt mean that Lynch can interfere in an active political investigation! Just that the WH cannot. Which I never denied.
Where does he claim that Lynch can interfere in a political investigation?
I am not claiming Trump can.. you are claiming Lynch can
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@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
Also how dodgy is it that Lynch asks Comey to not use the word "investigation" about Clinton ... He said that makes him uncomfortable. . but complies. But doesn't take notes in any following meetings. Trump gets in and suddenly he makes notes on everything?
TBF Lynch was his boss, Trump wasn't (in the sense that there is meant to be distance)
Errrrr no.
What gives you that idea? No difference in the "distance" required.Not according to Comey. Whether he is correct or not in that it is the way he viewed it and would explain the different approach
Where did Comey say or define what 'distance ' is?
Lynch has no more right to interfere than Trump. Where does he say otherwise?In his written statement.
No, he absolutely did not.
Which page and paragraph?
3, second to last
At one point, I explained why it was so important that the FBI and the
Department of Justice be independent of the White HouseThat doesnt mean that Lynch can interfere in an active investigation! Just that the WH cannot. Which I never denied.
Where does he claim that Lynch can interfere in a political investigation?
I am not claiming Trump can.. you are claiming Lynch can
Where did those goalposts go? I'm confused.
Weren't you talking about how when Lynch told Comey to do something he didn't take notesit but when Trump did he took notes?
He doesn't get to act independently of the DoJ but (interprets) that he should from the WH. I'm not necessarily agreeing with his stance just providing an explanation to the differing approach.
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@Crucial said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
Also how dodgy is it that Lynch asks Comey to not use the word "investigation" about Clinton ... He said that makes him uncomfortable. . but complies. But doesn't take notes in any following meetings. Trump gets in and suddenly he makes notes on everything?
TBF Lynch was his boss, Trump wasn't (in the sense that there is meant to be distance)
Errrrr no.
What gives you that idea? No difference in the "distance" required.Not according to Comey. Whether he is correct or not in that it is the way he viewed it and would explain the different approach
Where did Comey say or define what 'distance ' is?
Lynch has no more right to interfere than Trump. Where does he say otherwise?In his written statement.
No, he absolutely did not.
Which page and paragraph?
3, second to last
At one point, I explained why it was so important that the FBI and the
Department of Justice be independent of the White HouseThat doesnt mean that Lynch can interfere in an active investigation! Just that the WH cannot. Which I never denied.
Where does he claim that Lynch can interfere in a political investigation?
I am not claiming Trump can.. you are claiming Lynch can
Where did those goalposts go? I'm confused.
Weren't you talking about how when Lynch told Comey to do something he didn't take notesit but when Trump did he took notes?
He doesn't get to act independently of the DoJ but (interprets) that he should from the WH. I'm not necessarily agreeing with his stance just providing an explanation to the differing approach.
He does get to act independently of the DOJ (from an investigative standpoint). He has to go where the evidence leads, and not be told where the evidence leads by the DOJ hierarchy, Maybe that is where you are confused.
Lets assume Sessions didnt recuse himself, you think Comey would be happy if he told him to drop the case? Would have just meekly done that?
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Comey Leaked His Memo
Obstruction aside, one of the more stunning moments during the hearing came when Comey confessed that he deliberately leaked to “a friend” the contents of the memo memorializing his conversation with Trump… so that it would then be leaked to the media. Comey said it was his personal property. Wrong. Under the Federal Records Act and the FBI’s own Records Management regulations, “any document that is made in the course of business” is the property not of the person who authored it, but the property of the U.S. government. And so are its contents. It matters not whether the document, as this one, is unclassified. Comey improperly and, perhaps, unlawfully leaked a government document involving an FBI investigation. Comey admitted he did it to prompt the appointment of a special counsel who is now tasked with examining Russia’s interference in the presidential election. At the very least, Comey violated government rules by converting government property for his own use. It does not matter, legally, that he was no longer employed by the FBI. Is it a crime? Under 18 USC 793 (“Leaking Non-Classified Information”), it is a crime punishable by up to 10 years imprisonment to “willfully communicate or transmit national defense information,” even though it is not classified. While the contents of the memo do not deal directly with national defense matters, the overall investigation does. So it is debatable whether Comey could be charged. If nothing else, Comey’s leak appears to be a rather sleazy tactic designed to harm the president. How can he justify publicizing his own self-serving narrative while admitting in his testimony that he resisted all attempts by the president to publicize the truth that Trump was not personally under investigation? He cannot. It is equally disgraceful that Comey appears to have purposefully written his memo as an unclassified document so that he could later use it to his advantage by leaking it to the public without committing a serious crime. Making it classified, he told the committee, “would tangle it up.” In other words, he manipulated the classification system to exploit the political damage his document might cause. Comey’s testimony did manage to put to rest the constant accusation that President Trump attempted to quash the Russian investigation. Sen. Burr inquired, “Did the president at any time ask you to stop the FBI investigation into Russian involvement in the 2016 U.S. elections?” Comey replied, “Not to my understanding, no.” As anticipated, Comey trashed Trump in a manner that is typical of an angry or disgruntled former employee who lashes out at the boss who fired him. But his venomous attack seemed shrill and unbecoming of his stature. He branded Trump a liar and claimed the president “defamed” him when Trump described the FBI as “poorly led and in disarray” under Comey’s leadership. As a lawyer, Comey well knows that the president was expressing an opinion which is protected speech under the First Amendment. Hence, it is not defamation at all. Moreover, truth is a complete defense. Given Comey’s mishandling of the Hillary Clinton email case, in which he contorted the law and usurped the authority of the Attorney General, the president’s description may be the truth. And so, the much anticipated Senate Intelligence Committee hearing did not provide what President Trump’s antagonists yearned for – evidence of guilt. The only guilt rests with the president’s critics, especially many in the media, who have leveled wild and baseless assertions that he committed a crime during his now infamous conversation with the fired FBI Director on February 14th. Through ignorance and malevolence, they have laid bare their contempt for facts and the law in pursuit of a political mugging. It’s a shame that is not a crime.
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I hope, in time, the true basis of evidence for the FBI first beginning the investigation into "Trump campaign collusion" is fully brought into the open.
There is a minimum standard that must be reached before people can be put under surveillance.
If the main basis was the Russian pissing dossier, then I suspect a few people might be in trouble. Chuck Grassley is pursuing the firm who produced the report. Thus far, they are refusing to answer his questions.
My theory: Chuck Grassley is attempting to establish the FBI, on behalf of the DNC, knowingly published false information to perpetuate the Known-False Trump-Russia correction.
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@NTA said in US Politics:
The first one could be funnier - if there was a dump truck loading Trump's family into the swamp.
they could both be funnier if, they were actually funny, or is that the point?
Amusing though, it's everyone out to get Trump!
Granted some of it is witch hunting and making stories where there isnt one, but god Trump doesnt help himself at all!
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@taniwharugby he's a fucking classic for claiming victim status when he holds all the cards. All this whiny bullshit about fake news is just distracting from the fact he's not doing the job.
Hundreds of positions still not filled in the administration. Continual legal and constitutional gaffes. Contradicting his own staff within hours of them making statements.
It's a joke.
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Comey let Trump fall on his own sword and was all too happy to watch it happen. No one wants employees like that.
Given Comey is a well seasoned lawyer and the former head of the FBI, he of course knows that in a he-said he-said situation, nothing meaningful will happen which kinda makes this whole exercise pointless. Heck even the charge of Obstruction is weak but lump that with a charge of perjury and theres your grounds for impeachment. If Comey seriously didnt trust the President, I wouldnt have put it past him to tape the conversations himself. -
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
Comey let Trump fall on his own sword and was all too happy to watch it happen. No one wants employees like that.
Given Comey is a well seasoned lawyer and the former head of the FBI, he of course knows that in a he-said he-said situation, nothing meaningful will happen which kinda makes this whole exercise pointless. Heck even the charge of Obstruction is weak but lump that with a charge of perjury and theres your grounds for impeachment. If Comey seriously didnt trust the President, I wouldnt have put it past him to tape the conversations himself.What? Please clarify... you think a baseless accusation of obstruction along with a baseless accusation of perjury is enough for impeachment?
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@NTA said in US Politics:
@taniwharugby he's a fucking classic for claiming victim status when he holds all the cards. All this whiny bullshit about fake news is just distracting from the fact he's not doing the job.
Hundreds of positions still not filled in the administration. Continual legal and constitutional gaffes. Contradicting his own staff within hours of them making statements.
It's a joke.
Why don't you think he is doing his job? His tax reforms are with the Senate, his Obamacare replacement is also with the Senate. ... as for positions vacant. .. always going to happen if the democrats decide to delay every appointment regardless. Nothing Trump can do about that.
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@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
as for positions vacant. .. always going to happen if the democrats decide to delay every appointment regardless. Nothing Trump can do about that.
As of his first 100 days in Office, Trump hadn't even put forth nominees for over 80% of the jobs requiring Senate approval.
So you can't really pin that on the Democrats.
How is he going to carry out an agenda if he's not even going to put people up to make this wonderful legislation happen?
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Look - someone has a live tracker for it:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/politics/trump-administration-appointee-tracker/database/
As of 9 June at 9:42AM (let's assume Washington time zone), of the supposed 558 key positions:
426 no nominee
9 awaiting nomination
83 fully nominated
40 confirmedMaybe its part of draining the swamp i.e. reducing the cost in the executive branch.
While that might be a neolib's wet dream, the irony is to change that requires people to change that.
Comparison to other admins is available, of which the most interesting part is the number of Failed Nominations - Trump and Obama equal on 3.
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@NTA said in US Politics:
Look - someone has a live tracker for it:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/politics/trump-administration-appointee-tracker/database/
As of 9 June at 9:42AM (let's assume Washington time zone), of the supposed 558 key positions:
426 no nominee
9 awaiting nomination
83 fully nominated
40 confirmedMaybe its part of draining the swamp i.e. reducing the cost in the executive branch.
While that might be a neolib's wet dream, the irony is to change that requires people to change that.
Comparison to other admins is available, of which the most interesting part is the number of Failed Nominations - Trump and Obama equal on 3.
Wow. The numbers don't lie. That's a lot of positions awaiting nomination and 3 failed nominations doesn't sound like enough to constitute a plot by the dems to stall the Trump administration
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I find no reason to disbelieve what Comey has testified so far and it should worry Trump fans that the Senate Intelligence Committee is treating his testimony as credible. Comey would have approached Trump knowing exactly what to expect. He's a lawyer and ex head of the FBI after all - he's no idiot. Accusations of partisanship seem weak when we know he was a registered republican right up until 2016 and that he has royally pissed off both sides of the political establishment.
Everything Comey has testified so far seems in line with what I would expect from Trump. If I'm to believe Comey is fibbing, I'd have expected him to use stronger language other than "I'm hoping" - as I said earlier, the case for obstruction is weak and it makes no sense that a seasoned attorney would fabricate a weak case that on its own is unlikely to go anywhere. That Trump emptied the room is a dead give away that he knew what he was doing was not kosher. If you think Comey would leak a baseless case for Obstruction and thats his end game, I would argue that you have grossly under-estimated the former FBI director.As for the charge of perjury - well, that obviously hinges on Trump testifying against Comey which he has (astoundingly) offered to do. Of course, I don't believe anything that Trump has said so far. He has the least credibility of any President in modern history and has a decades old public profile as a as a chronic bullshitter. He has trouble sticking to message without the aid of a teleprompter. Comey knew before he leaked his notes that the logical conclusion from that action is Trump testifying.
FWIW, when I worked in finance, I recorded meetings on my phone quite regularly because some of the people I worked with were ethically questionable. It would not surprise me if Comey acted likewise whilst working under Trump.
US Politics