Should the Crusaders change their name?
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@Crucial said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
I hope that a sensible outcome rather than a reactive one is found.
As I said earlier, I have no problem with rebranding by removing the imagery of killing from the brand but also think that keeping the name indicates that meanings change over time.Errr - I think, Crucial, that you will be wasting your time. The decision has been made.
I'm fairly sure the science of news reading / public announcements holds that to ameliorate a controversial decision first there must be a "soft launching" to lock it in. That was today, fronted by Tew to camouflage the government hiding behind the potted palms.
Then there is the dinky little survey for no good reason, other than to place some time between the steps - people get on with other things and stop thinking about it. The slag we had as prime minister used refer to that period of relative silence as a "national conversation".
The final phase is either a brief announcement on a Friday night while everyone is at the pub or a big splash with someone charismatic from government praising a courageous Tew for
bringing the people to heelhelping people heal, and someone recognisable in the background singing a ballad - such as Neil Finn with Don't Dream its Over.They would have several options shovel ready for an unscheduled final announcement, to capitalise on fortuitous circumstances - a freight train derailment or a Virgin flight losing a propeller blade or the First Beta Boy very publicly storming out of Government House in a huff when She complained about what he'd knocked up for dinner ... that sort of thing.
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NZH poll:
Should the Crusaders change their name after the Christchurch terror attacks
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/rugby/news/article.cfm?c_id=80&objectid=12218977
Option D) āCrusaders shouldnāt change a thing,ā is currently leading poll at 63%
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(I can already see future NZH op-eds using this poll to PROVE the majority of Kiwis are toxic racists.) -
Also we should not refer to TARANAKI as The Naki.
Radio NZ had a "spokesperson for the Muslim community" on this morning followed immediately by someone from Te Wananga saying Naki was offensive.
I think when you have a spokesperson on any subject then context should be given to their bona fides in terms of truly representing who they purport to speak for. Massive fail Radio NZ.
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@dogmeat said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
Also we should not refer to TARANAKI as The Naki.
Radio NZ had a "spokesperson for the Muslim community" on this morning followed immediately by someone from Te Wananga saying Naki was offensive.
I think when you have a spokesperson on any subject then context should be given to their bona fides in terms of truly representing who they purport to speak for. Massive fail Radio NZ.
And here comes the slippery slope.
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@gt12 said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
If youād like to make your thoughts known, I believe this link goes through to the survey research being carried out:
Thereās something in a name
Kind regards
ACT Crusader -
A rebranding of the name Crusaders is the most common theme I have heard this week....
I mean if the name and existing brand is apparently so offensive, will they ban wearing of old fan merch? It isnt good form to wear Nazi stuff, and we are lead to believe the Crusades are up there in terms of Muslim persecution.
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@taniwharugby said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
A rebranding of the name Crusaders is the most common theme I have heard this week....
I mean if the name and existing brand is apparently so offensive, will they ban wearing of old fan merch? It isnt good form to wear Nazi stuff, and we are lead to believe the Crusades are up there in terms of Muslim persecution.
Don't give the PC Brigade ideas.
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Interesting interview with a survivor of the attack by Peter Williams, about the name change;
Peter
Abdul is with us this morning now. Good morning Abdul, you are the person whose text I read before. Thank you for being with us on air.
Abdul
How are you Peter?
Peter
Iām very good. So, you were in the Linwood mosque on thatā¦ fatefulā¦ fateful afternoon?
Abdul
Yes, I was, yeah.
Peter
How are you doing?
Abdul
Iām doing great umā¦ midweek, yeah. Coping up every day and yeah hopefully it willā¦ it will mend. Yep.
Peter
Were you injured at all, or not?
Abdul
No, I was lucky erā¦ because of [Baba indistinct] went after him and unfortunatelyā¦ yeah, he ran because of that he ran away otherwise he would have just put the gun again and finish us off, in there. Forty more people lying down helpless.
Peter
Yeah. How long have you lived in Christchurch Abdul?
Abdul
Um here for four years. I lived in Auckland for two and a half years so altogether seven years in New Zealand.
Peter
Where did you come from?
Abdul
Fiji.
Peter
Right.
Abdul
I lost my uncle there. I just my uncle Musa Patel over there in Linwood and Asaf Ali from Fijiā¦ oh yeah, itās not good.
Peter
No, and we certainly wish you the best. I was certainly intrigued by your text this morning because coming from Fiji youāve obviously been a rugby followerā¦
Abdul
Yep.
Peter
ā¦virtually all your life, I suppose so, unlike a lot of Muslims from, shall we say non-rugby playing countries like ah Pakistan or whatever, rugby is something that you are pretty interested in so you live in Christchurch, the home of the Crusaders, tell us then as a Muslim, as somebody who was in a mosque that fateful afternoon what you think of this proposal to change the name of the Crusaders?
Abdul
Aah to be honest ah thereās nothingā¦ um thereās no fault of the Canterbury Crusaders team. It was just an idiot who came to our mosque andā¦ and was doing stupid stuff and itās totally not anyoneās fault I reckon and Iām aā¦ Iām a true supporter of Crusaders as well and I donāt think itās any sportās fault or any oneās fault behind it. Andā¦ yeahā¦ so itās pointless of having a debate on changing their names over here.
Peter
So as far as you are concerned thereās just absolutely no need, no reason to do it?
Abdul
No, not at all.
Peter
Do you ever think, have you ever thought about how the name Crusaders has evolved, how it may have came about, howā¦ or why the team was named what they are named twenty-three years ago?
Abdul
No, not at all. Thatās what Iām just listening to your programme over here and getting to know about the history of how they got the name andā¦ yeah.
Peter
So, have you been a Muslim all your life Abdul?
Abdul
Sorry?
Peter
Have you been a Muslim all your life?
Abdul
Yep.
Peter
So, in teachings either through your mosque or through your education you never learnt about the crusades back in the medieval times? Youāve never had those feature in your life at all?
Abdul
Never did. Never did. I never came across of anything like that. No. [Indistinct] never.
Peter
What about other Muslims, Muslims from other countries ā do you think they have been educated on what happened in the middle ages?
Abdul
To be honest, what we are toldā¦ we are told about our prophet, of theā¦ of his doings all the time you know, at the mosque, andā¦ and to do better in life and in future. Like nothingā¦ nothing against any religion or anyā¦ anything like thisā¦ you know in our mosque being told to us. So, I donāt know where itās comingā¦ why people are talking about this andā¦ and itās just a waste of time I reckon.
Peter
So, you would believe that the Christians, the NZ pakeha isā¦ is feeling too much guilt, those who are suggesting that we change the name of the Crusaders are just feeling too much guilt over this incident?
Abdul
Ah, they may be. But ah itās not their fault. Totally not their fault so donāt think like that and just be supportive to all the Muslims and to everyone. And justā¦ justā¦ just love each other I reckon.
Peter
Yeah.
Abdul
Apart from having grief or any guilt against Muslim or anything like that. Yeah.
Peter
Itās a fantastic attitude you have Abdul and itās one that Iām sure will resonate with many people, and I thank you for talking to us this morning. And Iā¦ certainly after what happened to you on the 15th March atā¦ at Linwood I just wish you the best. I hope that you are going to be able to recover from the trauma that you obviously went through that afternoon and I wish you all the best and thank you for talking to us this morning.
Abdul
No worries Peter. Have a good one.
Peter
Okay. Abdul. Abdul who was in the Linwood mosque that afternoon.
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It wouldn't surprise me if the opinions of those involved, much like this guy, range from indifference to the crusaders name to support like this guy. I haven't heard the Muslim community come out against it, and I'd assume it's not because they are secretly offended, just that they don't mind. This is a beat up by NZ's mainly white media
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@Kirwan said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
Peter
So, you would believe that the Christians, the NZ pakeha isā¦ is feeling too much guilt, those who are suggesting that we change the name of the Crusaders are just feeling too much guilt over this incident?
Abdul
Ah, they may be. But ah itās not their fault. Totally not their fault ...
Thanks for posting that. Itās heartening. This guy gets it. He puts the blame onto the lone wolf psychopath who was responsible and refuses to blame anybody else. Thereās a lot of well-paid concern-troll virtue signallers typing op-eds who would do well to clam-up and listen to this guy. Sensible straight talk from Abdul.
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@canefan said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
It wouldn't surprise me if the opinions of those involved, much like this guy, range from indifference to the crusaders name to support like this guy. I haven't heard the Muslim community come out against it, and I'd assume it's not because they are secretly offended, just that they don't mind. This is a beat up by NZ's mainly white media
Yep, basically monetising the attack for ratings.
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@Salacious-Crumb figured it was worth considering here. Sort of lines up what Iām thinking, which is right minded Muslims donāt care that a rugby team is called the Crusaders.
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@Virgil itās good someone has leaked it so those piston wristed gibbons can squirm. Nothing a politician fears more than an unpopular decision.
Look at all the hiding they do about the CGT now that polls have come out with 65% against. They are cowards.
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Well the author of the article is certainly getting the desired outcome....
Just heard the CE of the crusaders on the radio - said this was untrue, that was then backed up by messages out of the PM's office and from minister of sport. They all said no truth to it - Govt is leaving this to the Crusaders and NZ rugby. The CE did not waffle at all about it - he was cut and dried about zero influence and that they have their process to follow.
So we can take it that all involved are lying and rely on the 'sources close to the crusaders say X' that there is heat coming from the Govt to dictate the outcome, or accept that someones bullshitting for clicks... interesting its one of those articles that doesn't have an authors name on it...
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and I get that of course they would deny any pressure etc. But this does come across as bullshit - and it flies in the face of how things have been handled by all involved to date imo.
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@Paekakboyz said in Should the Crusaders change their name?:
and I get that of course they would deny any pressure etc. But this does come across as bullshit - and it flies in the face of how things have been handled by all involved to date imo.
Does it? The govt have been incredibly active in attacking freedoms since the attack.