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@nzzp said in NZ Politics:
@Kirwan said in NZ Politics:
Probably have to go outside to find someone as good as Key again.
Wait, not Luxon?
I agree, by the way, National full of uninspiring folk right now.
I'm not convinced yet. He has some charisma and will be one to watch
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@nzzp said in NZ Politics:
@canefan I'm not just not convinced, I'm averse. Right now seems a muppet. Need to see plenty more before I'd consider voting for him
They need an everyman/ woman. Someone who can resonate with all sorts. Like John. Or Cindy. I remember the time Key dropped into his old street in Christchurch. Turned apparently anti-nats who came up to front him and had them eating out of his hand. An amazing skill
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@nzzp said in NZ Politics:
Nick Smith, etc ... just not interesting capable or inspiring I don't think.
I've posted on a few occasions that I can't stand Nick Smith, who regularly gives the impression that he knows everything about everything better than everyone else.
But, it's harsh to say he's not capable. He's probably one of National's most capable when he keeps his head down to work constructively.
Interesting and inspiring for Nick are up for grabs.
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@Chris-B fair call, a bit harsh.
He has a PhD in Civil Engineering, so clearly not a muppet. But I think has been captured by the parliamentary system, and nothing like as effective as he used to be. Seems stale.
in any case, the caucus (well, what's left of it) seems full of yesterdays' people. Brownlee and Smith don't do it for me at all.
ah well, onwards and upwards. They'll reinvent themselves, or Labour will get a third term. This is the brutal reality of political life. Discipline and consistent messaging with a clear vision gets rewarded. This is not what we have seen from National since March.
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@nzzp said in NZ Politics:
@Chris-B fair call, a bit harsh.
He has a PhD in Civil Engineering, so clearly not a muppet. But I think has been captured by the parliamentary system, and nothing like as effective as he used to be. Seems stale.
in any case, the caucus (well, what's left of it) seems full of yesterdays' people. Brownlee and Smith don't do it for me at all.
ah well, onwards and upwards. They'll reinvent themselves, or Labour will get a third term. This is the brutal reality of political life. Discipline and consistent messaging with a clear vision gets rewarded. This is not what we have seen from National since March.
Probably both will be true. Unless Labour get nothing done
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@nzzp When they've been gutted of much of their experience, they might need a few older hands to help guide them.
But, otherwise, Nick has been there too long. He's become an expert at arguing his point of view, without necessarily being right.
Looks to me like he'd be doing himself a favour by getting out (and not to run for fucking Mayor of Nelson).
He's a year younger than me and looks 15 years older - and that's not my assessment originally, but I agree.
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@Chris-B Agree totally. Nothing to stop Nick or Gerry standing down but being available to provide guidance to the newer crowd. While it was a bad result, the Nats still have ex-ministers in caucus so they do have some experience to guide the new MPs.
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@canefan said in NZ Politics:
@nzzp said in NZ Politics:
@Kirwan said in NZ Politics:
Probably have to go outside to find someone as good as Key again.
Wait, not Luxon?
I agree, by the way, National full of uninspiring folk right now.
I'm not convinced yet. He has some charisma and will be one to watch
Luxon - will be interesting to see how he goes. I don't think that he exactly won hearts and minds at Air NZ when I was there, but not many CEO's do. Being an evangelical christian isn't always popular either. Seems smart and speaks well enough though.
Mark Mitchell doesn't seem to want to go higher. Hager tried to discredit him, but who knows what to believe there. Could have gone up the ladder if he wanted too. Married to Possum Bourne's widow so maybe she doesn't want him to (already lost one husband and I would imagine the demands on time would be large). Met him a couple of times seems like a good guy.
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@Snowy said in NZ Politics:
@canefan said in NZ Politics:
@nzzp said in NZ Politics:
@Kirwan said in NZ Politics:
Probably have to go outside to find someone as good as Key again.
Wait, not Luxon?
I agree, by the way, National full of uninspiring folk right now.
I'm not convinced yet. He has some charisma and will be one to watch
Luxon - will be interesting to see how he goes. I don't think that he exactly won hearts and minds at Air NZ when I was there, but not many CEO's do. Being an evangelical christian isn't always popular either. Seems smart and speaks well enough though.
Mark Mitchell doesn't seem to want to go higher. Hager tried to discredit him, but who knows what to believe there. Could have gone up the ladder if he wanted too. Married to Possum Bourne's widow so maybe she doesn't want him to (already lost one husband and I would imagine the demands on time would be large). Met him a couple of times seems like a good guy.
Mitch has expressed a passing interest in the leadership every time it's up for grabs. His ambition isn't quite matched by his work ethic, unfortunately. Good guy though, as you say.
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@Mokey said in NZ Politics:
There is an opinion headline on stuff saying Bridges should be Collins' deputy.
What the actual fuck.
Whose opinion? We probably don't need to listen to that.
The Nats could take a masssive step backwards if they want though for sure.
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Aussies are offering 2000 bucks to go there and do horticulture work. Cindy is asking people to stay.
I'm not sure how market forces, pay people a decent wage/offer good working conditions and they will come work for you continues to be such a mystery. Really sick of seeing stories about owners whining about lost crops who have been exploiting overseas workers for years.
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@Mokey or just saying we pay well and totally sidestepping people having to uproot their lives/families for a temporary job. It's a not a simple equation for sure. I'm hoping we improved conditions and pay for our migrant workforce longer term. I'm sure heaps of growers do value and treat their workers well, but we know that ain't the case across the board.
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@Paekakboyz also, some don't pay by the hour, but by the load or container etc. So if you are new, you'll be slow and not pick as much.
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@Mokey said in NZ Politics:
@Paekakboyz also, some don't pay by the hour, but by the load or container etc. So if you are new, you'll be slow and not pick as much.
Perfectly reasonable considering you're paying people to be productive.
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@antipodean said in NZ Politics:
@Mokey said in NZ Politics:
@Paekakboyz also, some don't pay by the hour, but by the load or container etc. So if you are new, you'll be slow and not pick as much.
Perfectly reasonable considering you're paying people to be productive.
Now don't be silly. Forums like this couldn't exist if we were all paid by productivity.
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@antipodean at the moment they are paying no one because they can't get workers. The pay wasn't flash to begin with. Exactly who do they think is going to move them/and or family to another region for average pay that will be even lower to start while they train?
Being pissy about productivity is all well and good if the market is over supplied with workers. There is a gross shortage. So they can either come up with a new plan that will attract the resources available, or go bankrupt with rotting crops. Their choice.
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@Mokey said in NZ Politics:
@antipodean at the moment they are paying no one because they can't get workers. The pay wasn't flash to begin with. Exactly who do they think is going to move them/and or family to another region for average pay that will be even lower to start while they train?
Being pissy about productivity is all well and good if the market is over supplied with workers. There is a gross shortage. So they can either come up with a new plan that will attract the resources available, or go bankrupt with rotting crops. Their choice.
Perhaps people on the dole could be volunteered?
NZ Politics