All Blacks v Ireland II
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I'm not going to read the article, but Rattue predictably having another pop at Read. The guy is insufferable.
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Ardie had a very good game. Nothing at all was lost by Cane going off. It might have been a gain based on the way Ardie played
Aaron was very poor in the first test and not much better in this one. Its a concern that the coaches can not see this. Esp with TJP playing so well. So they have a great alternative but can't see it
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I think the onus has got to be on the tackler to take more care in these situations. Not go charging in head first like Cane did. But Cane can be a bit careless with no regard for other players
But in the circumstances I think a yellow not red was enough
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Didn't I always tell you Aaron Smith was shit?
Classic test, a great contest, Schmiddy has Ireland well-drilled and focused. They should waste Australia next week but the stats today with their poss/terr are a demonstration of how limited they were in a couple of important aspects like finishing and decision-making, and how much more we could improve...
Dagg and B.Barrett now clear first-choices. Oustanding game from Barrett, a breakout performance under pressure for form, and he kicked too..
The Potatoes hammered us at the breakdown, which will now be every other team's idea of our Achilles tendon. The thing of standing off the ruck may need some re-thinking, they'd just keep going forward, and got like a thousand turnovers to our like none. Bring back Matt Todd. BUT we defended like motherfuckers in the second half, NO TRIES YOU WHINGING DONKIES...
And Jack O'Piper was a joke.
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I enjoyed reading the match thread as many of the comments echoed my reaction at the time while watching the game live. But I still much prefer these types of tests than one-sided games.
As to Peyper, you know he had a terrible game when both coaches complain about him.
Despite the much-improved D by the ABs they still missed >10% of their tackles. Some of the defence around the fringes of the ruck was average too but the scramble defence was excellent.
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@pukunui said in Ireland II:
Bit of a concern that we have been living off scraps of possession a few games lately. It seems that if they aren't kicking it to us lots and our offensive defence isn't causing errors we don't have many ways to get the ball back. Not calling for a pocock style approach but would be good to attack the breakdown a bit more often in the middle part of the field to turn that possession stat around. Need to fix our chronic offside issues too.
Well said, we do seem to turn the ball over a lot from held up in the tackle or not enough support at breakdown. I'm sure the coaches are well aware of it but we always seem to be on the wrong side of possession stats. Perhaps we prefer to have aggressive D and hope to get ball from broken play, not sure.
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@Winger said in Ireland II:
I think the onus has got to be on the tackler to take more care in these situations. Not go charging in head first like Cane did. But Cane can be a bit careless with no regard for other players
But in the circumstances I think a yellow not red was enough
Sorry mate I was referring to Feki trying to take off the Irishmans head.
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@Winger said in Ireland II:
Ardie had a very good game. Nothing at all was lost by Cane going off. It might have been a gain based on the way Ardie played
The secret to effective trolling is moderation.
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The Cane tackle was pretty ugly though. Here's another angle
Doesn't appear to be a head clash.
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It's pretty much been said.
Excellent win built on unfailing defence and commitment away to a parochial crowd and a lop sided refereeing approach.
Stoked with the win
Irish commentators were a disgrace but fuck those guys.
Best pissing and moaning at conversion time sent rugby one step closer to the fucking farce that is soccer and their inability to deal with a refs decision and for that may he suffer erectile dysfunction for eternityOh and next time you get tackled, let 3 teammates form a ruck over you and then just get up with the ball and run forward- it's easy and Jaco loves that shit
3 tries to none, what's the prize for getting close?
Siam, obviously a sore winner
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@Toddy said in Ireland II:
The Cane tackle was pretty ugly though. Here's another angle
Doesn't appear to be a head clash.
I never thought it was a head clash, so nothing cleared up for me with that.
But I don't think it's ugly. I can live with the penalty as his shoulder hit his head. But anything more than that would be particularly harsh IMO.
Not that I'm up to date with any directives that apparently IRB have recently made, that I'm reading about.
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I suspect we all have it wrong regarding the Cane tackle and subsequent penalty. While the players were waiting to restart you can hear Peyper say "the injury was caused by a head clash" he also explained to Read "he brought his arm up but the timing was out" (or similar).
I think the penalty was actually for a shoulder charge.
The whole event was just one of those things that happen in a dynamic game. Cane was making a legit tackle but Henshaw spun and moved in an unpredictable way causing the timing to go wrong.
Headclash happened and arm came around late making it all look worse.
It wasn't even clumsy, just a product of unpredictable moving parts. -
@Rapido said in Ireland II:
@Toddy said in Ireland II:
The Cane tackle was pretty ugly though. Here's another angle
Doesn't appear to be a head clash.
I never thought it was a head clash, so nothing cleared up for me with that.
Which part of head on head contact (clearly visible as coming first) are you choosing to ignore?
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@antipodean said in Ireland II:
@taniwharugby said in Ireland II:
man there are some tears coming from the Irish in the aftermath....cheating, dirty, out to mame players at every touch....
The normally measured Murray Kinsella is even taking the koolaid. Contrast their response with the congratulations from all and sundry when they finally managed a win two weeks ago.
I saw this from that article:
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This Test match was utterly physical, but Barrett’s ability to slow the game down and see the opportunity was crucial."What does that even mean?
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@Toddy said in Ireland II:
The Cane tackle was pretty ugly though. Here's another angle
Doesn't appear to be a head clash.
Strange how we all see different things. It makes you immediately understand why witness accounts of crimes are often so unreliable.
After watching this and other footage multiple times, and imagining the roles were reversed (trying to get a more objective opinion), this is what I see.
First, Henshaw's body position is in a slight downward angle due to contact with Read. Because of this angle he basically moves in the direction of Cane's right shoulder.
At the same time, Cane uses his left arm for the tackle, but is slightly late with his right, which goes forward shoulder first in the direction of Henshaw's shoulder. There seems to be an intent to use his arm though.
Due to Henshaw moving slightly downward, Cane's shoulder doesn't hit Henshaw's shoulder but Henshaw's left jaw or ear.
However, in the same movement or a fraction of a second prior, their heads clash as well. The right side of Canes face seems to hit Henshaw's forehead/temple. It's this head clash that seems to cause Henshaw to go down (not the shoulder).The question is whether Cane could have avoided this from happening. IMO that's not the case. It all happened at full speed. Even if you'd argue that he should have used his right arm faster to avoid a shoulder clash, he could never have influenced Henshaw's downward movement. There's also no way he could have seen that coming.
It's all in the nature of the game. In accordance with the WR policy against high and dangerous tackles, I can live with the penalty, but don't think it was a YC.
Btw, the tackle on BB was entirely different and was a tackle on the neck/head and should have been penalised. I also think I can see BB ground the ball.
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@Stargazer mate you got links to the Cane tackle footage, preferably not only super slowmo?
I got done over by the phone charger not being plugged in 100 % correctly and hence no alarm. I'd wager I'm the only person on the planet that's ever happened to. -
@Siam said in Ireland II:
@Stargazer mate you got links to the Cane tackle footage, preferably not only super slowmo?
I got done over by the phone charger not being plugged in 100 % correctly and hence no alarm. I'd wager I'm the only person on the planet that's ever happened to.I'm sure you have Aaron Cruden's sympathy
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right i've just watched this, and had to listen to the irish commentators. now there's something i will never, ever do again. what a pack of fluffybunnies. they whinge all fucking day about high tackles from us, and then on being presented with multiple slow-motion replays of barrett being hit high while scoring they don't even fucking mention it? not even fucking once? not even a fucking hint of it? fucking hell, fuck off you one-eyed bags of shit. the irish played with a heap of heart and endeavour - the sort of thing i would normally warm to - but after having to listen to those fuckwits i can't help but despise the fucking lot of them.
as for peyper. what a total fucking idiot. the penalty count was atrocious, he was only looking at one side throughout. the aaron smith card - what the fuck was that? coming through the gate from behind the last feet, playing the ball with his foot, after it was out anyway, and he gets yellow carded? faaark offff you incompetent game-ruining fucking fool.ah, that's better.
as to the game. well, it was pretty good eh? intense, hard and fast. i had doubts about squire beforehand, and thought he was our best loosie. read too quiet. cane a couple of big hits before the injury but that was about it. savea energetic but ineffective. retallick was just fucking amazing, best player on the field by some margin. whitelock looked knackered from about 65 mins on, hands on hips, missing tackles, slow to get back etc. our props were outplayed. coles was good. the irish sub hooker was a dud, fucked their lineouts. their loosies were good, too many errors from o'brien though.
aaron smith, rough on the kicking. tj perenara - great footy player, pity the worst part of his game is his most important role. barrett, really good. courageous defence. missed one he should have made, but made several big ones. fekitoa was excellent, aside from the card which was terrible, and the kick out on the full. izzy dagg was absolutely instrumental in the middle stages coming in to 1st receiver and varying the attack. why we use cruden to kick for touch while he is on the field i will never understand. it's just fucking stupid.a heap of credit to ireland. losing 10 and 12 and still giving it shit and putting us under that much pressure is very, very impressive. fuck your commentators though, fuck them right in their arses.
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Those complaining the ABs didn't contest enough, it was pretty damn clear that O'Peyper was going to look for any reason to make up a penalty against the ABs. Watching towards the end of the match it was quite striking how the ABs were just tackle and ignore the breakdown completely, even to the extent of running away from Irish trying to clean out.
