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@reprobate said in US Politics:
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in US Politics:
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
To his adversaries, sacking Comey made Trump look like he was hiding something.
Telling Lester Holt that it was because of the "Russia thing" reaffirmed their suspicions and made the job of his administration much harder.
Everyone had all but forgotten about the "scandalous dossier", now we're talking about it again and not only that, we now know that the FBI are still actively investigating it.
Like many headlines during Trumps presidency, this is largely a mess of Trump's own making but you'll never hear him say it.Again, I agree he should shut tfu and stop giving others ammunition. But I find it hard to accept that this whole "Russia stole/hacked/influenced/bought the election" or the accusations of Trump being some kind of Russian puppet are something he's brought upon himself. This was a narrative cooked up by the losers and happily run with the Democratic party and large sections of the media. Arguing that Trump deserves it because he's such a dick is a pretty farking weak argument.
the bipartisan consensus seems to be that russia attempting to influence the election is fact. then you have flynn (and to a lesser degree sessions) lying about meeting with russians. put those together and it is worth investigating, it's a big deal having a foreign country fucking with american democracy. it's not something that has been made up by the media, though they are guilty of sensationalising it for clicks.
If he is as clean as he says, wouldn't Trump welcome the investigations that would settle things once and for all? It would be ridiculous if he got in trouble for try to obstruct a federal investigation that proved he was a-OK
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@canefan said in US Politics:
@reprobate said in US Politics:
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in US Politics:
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
To his adversaries, sacking Comey made Trump look like he was hiding something.
Telling Lester Holt that it was because of the "Russia thing" reaffirmed their suspicions and made the job of his administration much harder.
Everyone had all but forgotten about the "scandalous dossier", now we're talking about it again and not only that, we now know that the FBI are still actively investigating it.
Like many headlines during Trumps presidency, this is largely a mess of Trump's own making but you'll never hear him say it.Again, I agree he should shut tfu and stop giving others ammunition. But I find it hard to accept that this whole "Russia stole/hacked/influenced/bought the election" or the accusations of Trump being some kind of Russian puppet are something he's brought upon himself. This was a narrative cooked up by the losers and happily run with the Democratic party and large sections of the media. Arguing that Trump deserves it because he's such a dick is a pretty farking weak argument.
the bipartisan consensus seems to be that russia attempting to influence the election is fact. then you have flynn (and to a lesser degree sessions) lying about meeting with russians. put those together and it is worth investigating, it's a big deal having a foreign country fucking with american democracy. it's not something that has been made up by the media, though they are guilty of sensationalising it for clicks.
If he is as clean as he says, wouldn't Trump welcome the investigations that would settle things once and for all? It would be ridiculous if he got in trouble for try to obstruct a federal investigation that proved he was a-OK
Where has he tried to obstruct a federal investigation that is about proving he was ok?
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@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@canefan said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@reprobate said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback and also given comey was a republican, and torpedoed the Clinton campaign, how can you basket him with this corrupt leftist media that is out to get trump who is behaving so wonderfully?
Because he had zero choice but to notify congress. He was betting on Clinton winning when he usurped the DOJ and didn't recommend prosecution.
Why did he let Lynch bully him into lying for political reasons.
This was not the case. IIRC at the time the general consensus was that it was highly irregular to notify congress about developments pertaining to an ongoing investigation
You dont recall correctly at all.
I'm working and don't have time to go back. But a quick trawl netted this article which also has a link to justice policy regarding conduct in the run up to elections 2012. I assume it was carried over to 2016
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It is not difficult. If you find it offensive is not relevant. It is going to get a reaction from other posters who will get annoyed by it... the thread will turn into posters insulting each other.... And this thread will get locked. Play the ball and not the man is a rule of TSF and is being particularly enforced in this thread.
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@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@canefan said in US Politics:
@reprobate said in US Politics:
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in US Politics:
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
To his adversaries, sacking Comey made Trump look like he was hiding something.
Telling Lester Holt that it was because of the "Russia thing" reaffirmed their suspicions and made the job of his administration much harder.
Everyone had all but forgotten about the "scandalous dossier", now we're talking about it again and not only that, we now know that the FBI are still actively investigating it.
Like many headlines during Trumps presidency, this is largely a mess of Trump's own making but you'll never hear him say it.Again, I agree he should shut tfu and stop giving others ammunition. But I find it hard to accept that this whole "Russia stole/hacked/influenced/bought the election" or the accusations of Trump being some kind of Russian puppet are something he's brought upon himself. This was a narrative cooked up by the losers and happily run with the Democratic party and large sections of the media. Arguing that Trump deserves it because he's such a dick is a pretty farking weak argument.
the bipartisan consensus seems to be that russia attempting to influence the election is fact. then you have flynn (and to a lesser degree sessions) lying about meeting with russians. put those together and it is worth investigating, it's a big deal having a foreign country fucking with american democracy. it's not something that has been made up by the media, though they are guilty of sensationalising it for clicks.
If he is as clean as he says, wouldn't Trump welcome the investigations that would settle things once and for all? It would be ridiculous if he got in trouble for try to obstruct a federal investigation that proved he was a-OK
Where has he tried to obstruct a federal investigation that is about proving he was ok?
Do you think the Russia probe will come to nothing? Trump seems to tweet so. Then why does he seem intent on doing stuff that makes him seem dirty? I know you think Comey was fired for being incompetent. Yet here he loves him
He said himself later that he was firing him over the Russian thing. It certainly wasn't over the handling of the Clinton thing, unless that isn't him speaking in that video
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@canefan said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@canefan said in US Politics:
@reprobate said in US Politics:
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in US Politics:
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
To his adversaries, sacking Comey made Trump look like he was hiding something.
Telling Lester Holt that it was because of the "Russia thing" reaffirmed their suspicions and made the job of his administration much harder.
Everyone had all but forgotten about the "scandalous dossier", now we're talking about it again and not only that, we now know that the FBI are still actively investigating it.
Like many headlines during Trumps presidency, this is largely a mess of Trump's own making but you'll never hear him say it.Again, I agree he should shut tfu and stop giving others ammunition. But I find it hard to accept that this whole "Russia stole/hacked/influenced/bought the election" or the accusations of Trump being some kind of Russian puppet are something he's brought upon himself. This was a narrative cooked up by the losers and happily run with the Democratic party and large sections of the media. Arguing that Trump deserves it because he's such a dick is a pretty farking weak argument.
the bipartisan consensus seems to be that russia attempting to influence the election is fact. then you have flynn (and to a lesser degree sessions) lying about meeting with russians. put those together and it is worth investigating, it's a big deal having a foreign country fucking with american democracy. it's not something that has been made up by the media, though they are guilty of sensationalising it for clicks.
If he is as clean as he says, wouldn't Trump welcome the investigations that would settle things once and for all? It would be ridiculous if he got in trouble for try to obstruct a federal investigation that proved he was a-OK
Where has he tried to obstruct a federal investigation that is about proving he was ok?
Do you think the Russia probe will come to nothing? Trump seems to tweet so. Then why does he seem intent on doing stuff that makes him seem dirty? I know you think Comey was fired for being incompetent. Yet here he loves him
He said himself later that he was firing him over the Russian thing. It certainly wasn't over the handling of the Clinton thing, unless that isn't him speaking in that video
Pretty hard to say it will come to nothing. Do I think Trump will have been proven in any way to have improper conduct with Russia? Yes absolutely. There is simply no evidence. And this saga has been going for MONTHS.
I think Comey was fired for a few reasons one of which is the fact that despite prior form of commenting on active investigations, despite his organisation leaking like a sieve and despite him knowing that it was massive deal in the media.... he refused to acknowledge that Trump was not being investigated. That would piss any sane person off.
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@reprobate said in US Politics:
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in US Politics:
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
To his adversaries, sacking Comey made Trump look like he was hiding something.
Telling Lester Holt that it was because of the "Russia thing" reaffirmed their suspicions and made the job of his administration much harder.
Everyone had all but forgotten about the "scandalous dossier", now we're talking about it again and not only that, we now know that the FBI are still actively investigating it.
Like many headlines during Trumps presidency, this is largely a mess of Trump's own making but you'll never hear him say it.Again, I agree he should shut tfu and stop giving others ammunition. But I find it hard to accept that this whole "Russia stole/hacked/influenced/bought the election" or the accusations of Trump being some kind of Russian puppet are something he's brought upon himself. This was a narrative cooked up by the losers and happily run with the Democratic party and large sections of the media. Arguing that Trump deserves it because he's such a dick is a pretty farking weak argument.
the bipartisan consensus seems to be that russia attempting to influence the election is fact. then you have flynn (and to a lesser degree sessions) lying about meeting with russians. put those together and it is worth investigating, it's a big deal having a foreign country fucking with american democracy. it's not something that has been made up by the media, though they are guilty of sensationalising it for clicks.
It's one thing to talk about attempted Russian involvement its another thing entirely to claim Trump was Putin's bitch. Good to see that you concede that it was bullshit spun by the media and hardly something that can be claimed Trump brought upon himself.
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@canefan said in US Politics:
@reprobate said in US Politics:
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in US Politics:
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
To his adversaries, sacking Comey made Trump look like he was hiding something.
Telling Lester Holt that it was because of the "Russia thing" reaffirmed their suspicions and made the job of his administration much harder.
Everyone had all but forgotten about the "scandalous dossier", now we're talking about it again and not only that, we now know that the FBI are still actively investigating it.
Like many headlines during Trumps presidency, this is largely a mess of Trump's own making but you'll never hear him say it.Again, I agree he should shut tfu and stop giving others ammunition. But I find it hard to accept that this whole "Russia stole/hacked/influenced/bought the election" or the accusations of Trump being some kind of Russian puppet are something he's brought upon himself. This was a narrative cooked up by the losers and happily run with the Democratic party and large sections of the media. Arguing that Trump deserves it because he's such a dick is a pretty farking weak argument.
the bipartisan consensus seems to be that russia attempting to influence the election is fact. then you have flynn (and to a lesser degree sessions) lying about meeting with russians. put those together and it is worth investigating, it's a big deal having a foreign country fucking with american democracy. it's not something that has been made up by the media, though they are guilty of sensationalising it for clicks.
If he is as clean as he says, wouldn't Trump welcome the investigations that would settle things once and for all? It would be ridiculous if he got in trouble for try to obstruct a federal investigation that proved he was a-OK
Didn't Comey say that Trump had told him it was a good thing that his "satellites" were being investigated?
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@Rancid-Schnitzel said in US Politics:
@canefan said in US Politics:
@reprobate said in US Politics:
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in US Politics:
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
To his adversaries, sacking Comey made Trump look like he was hiding something.
Telling Lester Holt that it was because of the "Russia thing" reaffirmed their suspicions and made the job of his administration much harder.
Everyone had all but forgotten about the "scandalous dossier", now we're talking about it again and not only that, we now know that the FBI are still actively investigating it.
Like many headlines during Trumps presidency, this is largely a mess of Trump's own making but you'll never hear him say it.Again, I agree he should shut tfu and stop giving others ammunition. But I find it hard to accept that this whole "Russia stole/hacked/influenced/bought the election" or the accusations of Trump being some kind of Russian puppet are something he's brought upon himself. This was a narrative cooked up by the losers and happily run with the Democratic party and large sections of the media. Arguing that Trump deserves it because he's such a dick is a pretty farking weak argument.
the bipartisan consensus seems to be that russia attempting to influence the election is fact. then you have flynn (and to a lesser degree sessions) lying about meeting with russians. put those together and it is worth investigating, it's a big deal having a foreign country fucking with american democracy. it's not something that has been made up by the media, though they are guilty of sensationalising it for clicks.
If he is as clean as he says, wouldn't Trump welcome the investigations that would settle things once and for all? It would be ridiculous if he got in trouble for try to obstruct a federal investigation that proved he was a-OK
Didn't Comey say that Trump had told him it was a good thing that his "satellites" were being investigated?
Good point, you have Comey saying that Trump is not under investigation and Trump saying go after any of his satellites (if he can) .. Comey even says that he didn't feel pressured by Trump to stop the investigation into Russia... and Trump is hiding something????
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@Rancid-Schnitzel said in US Politics:
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
To his adversaries, sacking Comey made Trump look like he was hiding something.
Telling Lester Holt that it was because of the "Russia thing" reaffirmed their suspicions and made the job of his administration much harder.
Everyone had all but forgotten about the "scandalous dossier", now we're talking about it again and not only that, we now know that the FBI are still actively investigating it.
Like many headlines during Trumps presidency, this is largely a mess of Trump's own making but you'll never hear him say it.Again, I agree he should shut tfu and stop giving others ammunition. But I find it hard to accept that this whole "Russia stole/hacked/influenced/bought the election" or the accusations of Trump being some kind of Russian puppet are something he's brought upon himself. This was a narrative cooked up by the losers and happily run with the Democratic party and large sections of the media. Arguing that Trump deserves it because he's such a dick is a pretty farking weak argument.
I don't believe Trump has been colluding with the Russians in regards to hacking the election.
I wouldnt say Trump deserves it because he's a dick, I would argue that Trump planted the seeds for the democrats to sow by way of his continuous praise / defence of Putin / Russia, his denial of US intelligence findings claiming that Russia was hacking America, his lies about his business dealings with Russia and his refusal to release his tax returns (which would either exculpate or incriminate him). This might all be innocent however Trump has a history of being a dodgy businessman, he has done little to win over the trust of the American people and instead seems to have flaunted his disregard for their concerns.
This timeline is good for a refresher:
http://www.politico.com/trump-russia-ties-scandal-guide/timeline-of-eventsI had all but forgotten about his callout to Russia to hack Hillary (I'm not claiming it was a legitimate request but this is the kind of absurdly dumb shit that gives political opponents ammunition).
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@phoenetia said in US Politics:
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in US Politics:
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
To his adversaries, sacking Comey made Trump look like he was hiding something.
Telling Lester Holt that it was because of the "Russia thing" reaffirmed their suspicions and made the job of his administration much harder.
Everyone had all but forgotten about the "scandalous dossier", now we're talking about it again and not only that, we now know that the FBI are still actively investigating it.
Like many headlines during Trumps presidency, this is largely a mess of Trump's own making but you'll never hear him say it.Again, I agree he should shut tfu and stop giving others ammunition. But I find it hard to accept that this whole "Russia stole/hacked/influenced/bought the election" or the accusations of Trump being some kind of Russian puppet are something he's brought upon himself. This was a narrative cooked up by the losers and happily run with the Democratic party and large sections of the media. Arguing that Trump deserves it because he's such a dick is a pretty farking weak argument.
I don't believe Trump has been colluding with the Russians in regards to hacking the election.
I wouldnt say Trump deserves it because he's a dick, I would argue that Trump planted the seeds for the democrats to sow by way of his continuous praise / defence of Putin / Russia, his denial of US intelligence findings claiming that Russia was hacking America, his lies about his business dealings with Russia and his refusal to release his tax returns (which would either exculpate or incriminate him). This might all be innocent however Trump has a history of being a dodgy businessman, he has done little to win over the trust of the American people and instead seems to have flaunted his disregard for their concerns.
This timeline is good for a refresher:
http://www.politico.com/trump-russia-ties-scandal-guide/timeline-of-eventsI had all but forgotten about his callout to Russia to hack Hillary (I'm not claiming it was a legitimate request but this is the kind of absurdly dumb shit that gives political opponents ammunition).
I disagree with much of that, but your opinion so fair enough.
I do take issue with 'flaunting the American peoples concerns'... I doubt most care either way. And those that do care are likely entrenched.
All this circumstantial evidence which IMO is completely hopeless, has just led to entrenchment... and apathy.Anyone sane now knows that Trump is not a pawn of Putin, and that was the basis of all of this. The bedrock has fallen away form the whole narrative... so they switch narrative. We are going to have 4 more years of this. Does Trump help himself.. nope.
Does it not concern you that the media went all in on such a completely and utterly false narrative?
I am starting to think we would have had the same sort of propaganda war if Cruz, Bush or Rubio had won.
Not sure you remember, but think back to how Bush the younger was treated by the media. MSM are democrats through and through.
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@phoenetia said in US Politics:
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in US Politics:
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
To his adversaries, sacking Comey made Trump look like he was hiding something.
Telling Lester Holt that it was because of the "Russia thing" reaffirmed their suspicions and made the job of his administration much harder.
Everyone had all but forgotten about the "scandalous dossier", now we're talking about it again and not only that, we now know that the FBI are still actively investigating it.
Like many headlines during Trumps presidency, this is largely a mess of Trump's own making but you'll never hear him say it.Again, I agree he should shut tfu and stop giving others ammunition. But I find it hard to accept that this whole "Russia stole/hacked/influenced/bought the election" or the accusations of Trump being some kind of Russian puppet are something he's brought upon himself. This was a narrative cooked up by the losers and happily run with the Democratic party and large sections of the media. Arguing that Trump deserves it because he's such a dick is a pretty farking weak argument.
I don't believe Trump has been colluding with the Russians in regards to hacking the election.
I wouldnt say Trump deserves it because he's a dick, I would argue that Trump planted the seeds for the democrats to sow by way of his continuous praise / defence of Putin / Russia, his denial of US intelligence findings claiming that Russia was hacking America, his lies about his business dealings with Russia and his refusal to release his tax returns (which would either exculpate or incriminate him). This might all be innocent however Trump has a history of being a dodgy businessman, he has done little to win over the trust of the American people and instead seems to have flaunted his disregard for their concerns.
This timeline is good for a refresher:
http://www.politico.com/trump-russia-ties-scandal-guide/timeline-of-eventsI had all but forgotten about his callout to Russia to hack Hillary (I'm not claiming it was a legitimate request but this is the kind of absurdly dumb shit that gives political opponents ammunition).
You don't believe that and I'm pretty farking sure the media and the Democrats don't believe that, yet they're making the most preposterous claims based on zero evidence. Even if Trump has said some dumb shit, that hardly justifies this kind of backlash. The argument that he brought it on himself just doesn't cut it in this instance.
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@Baron-Silas-Greenback OK fair enough and thanks for the explanation.
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@reprobate
One source
Took me all of 3 seconds using Google - (I am sure there are others, for example I heard it on Fox news also)
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@Frank said in US Politics:
@reprobate
One source
Took me all of 3 seconds using Google - (I am sure there are others, for example I heard it on Fox news also)
Not sure Ed Klein promoting his own salacious book is a great source but there is likely some truthful but exaggerated aspects in there.
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@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in US Politics:
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
To his adversaries, sacking Comey made Trump look like he was hiding something.
Telling Lester Holt that it was because of the "Russia thing" reaffirmed their suspicions and made the job of his administration much harder.
Everyone had all but forgotten about the "scandalous dossier", now we're talking about it again and not only that, we now know that the FBI are still actively investigating it.
Like many headlines during Trumps presidency, this is largely a mess of Trump's own making but you'll never hear him say it.Again, I agree he should shut tfu and stop giving others ammunition. But I find it hard to accept that this whole "Russia stole/hacked/influenced/bought the election" or the accusations of Trump being some kind of Russian puppet are something he's brought upon himself. This was a narrative cooked up by the losers and happily run with the Democratic party and large sections of the media. Arguing that Trump deserves it because he's such a dick is a pretty farking weak argument.
I don't believe Trump has been colluding with the Russians in regards to hacking the election.
I wouldnt say Trump deserves it because he's a dick, I would argue that Trump planted the seeds for the democrats to sow by way of his continuous praise / defence of Putin / Russia, his denial of US intelligence findings claiming that Russia was hacking America, his lies about his business dealings with Russia and his refusal to release his tax returns (which would either exculpate or incriminate him). This might all be innocent however Trump has a history of being a dodgy businessman, he has done little to win over the trust of the American people and instead seems to have flaunted his disregard for their concerns.
This timeline is good for a refresher:
http://www.politico.com/trump-russia-ties-scandal-guide/timeline-of-eventsI had all but forgotten about his callout to Russia to hack Hillary (I'm not claiming it was a legitimate request but this is the kind of absurdly dumb shit that gives political opponents ammunition).
I disagree with much of that, but your opinion so fair enough.
I do take issue with 'flaunting the American peoples concerns'... I doubt most care either way. And those that do care are likely entrenched.
All this circumstantial evidence which IMO is completely hopeless, has just led to entrenchment... and apathy.Anyone sane now knows that Trump is not a pawn of Putin, and that was the basis of all of this. The bedrock has fallen away form the whole narrative... so they switch narrative. We are going to have 4 more years of this. Does Trump help himself.. nope.
Does it not concern you that the media went all in on such a completely and utterly false narrative?
I am starting to think we would have had the same sort of propaganda war if Cruz, Bush or Rubio had won.
Not sure you remember, but think back to how Bush the younger was treated by the media. MSM are democrats through and through.
As I see it, birtherism, benghazi and those emails have been swapped for "the Russia probe".
I don't think the Republicans are getting any worse from the Democrats than what they gave. It's only been 4 months though...
Out of all of this, what has surprised me the most is how many Republicans flipped their opinions on Russia seemingly overnight. Thats been really weird and not something I thought Id ever see in my lifetime. -
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in US Politics:
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in US Politics:
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
To his adversaries, sacking Comey made Trump look like he was hiding something.
Telling Lester Holt that it was because of the "Russia thing" reaffirmed their suspicions and made the job of his administration much harder.
Everyone had all but forgotten about the "scandalous dossier", now we're talking about it again and not only that, we now know that the FBI are still actively investigating it.
Like many headlines during Trumps presidency, this is largely a mess of Trump's own making but you'll never hear him say it.Again, I agree he should shut tfu and stop giving others ammunition. But I find it hard to accept that this whole "Russia stole/hacked/influenced/bought the election" or the accusations of Trump being some kind of Russian puppet are something he's brought upon himself. This was a narrative cooked up by the losers and happily run with the Democratic party and large sections of the media. Arguing that Trump deserves it because he's such a dick is a pretty farking weak argument.
I don't believe Trump has been colluding with the Russians in regards to hacking the election.
I wouldnt say Trump deserves it because he's a dick, I would argue that Trump planted the seeds for the democrats to sow by way of his continuous praise / defence of Putin / Russia, his denial of US intelligence findings claiming that Russia was hacking America, his lies about his business dealings with Russia and his refusal to release his tax returns (which would either exculpate or incriminate him). This might all be innocent however Trump has a history of being a dodgy businessman, he has done little to win over the trust of the American people and instead seems to have flaunted his disregard for their concerns.
This timeline is good for a refresher:
http://www.politico.com/trump-russia-ties-scandal-guide/timeline-of-eventsI had all but forgotten about his callout to Russia to hack Hillary (I'm not claiming it was a legitimate request but this is the kind of absurdly dumb shit that gives political opponents ammunition).
You don't believe that and I'm pretty farking sure the media and the Democrats don't believe that, yet they're making the most preposterous claims based on zero evidence. Even if Trump has said some dumb shit, that hardly justifies this kind of backlash. The argument that he brought it on himself just doesn't cut it in this instance.
I'm saying he is his own worst enemy. A career politician wouldn't make such stupid mistakes and these faults are unique to Trump.
Who needs to be told that you shouldn't publicly invite the Russians to hack the US Government? It's so absurd. -
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in US Politics:
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in US Politics:
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
To his adversaries, sacking Comey made Trump look like he was hiding something.
Telling Lester Holt that it was because of the "Russia thing" reaffirmed their suspicions and made the job of his administration much harder.
Everyone had all but forgotten about the "scandalous dossier", now we're talking about it again and not only that, we now know that the FBI are still actively investigating it.
Like many headlines during Trumps presidency, this is largely a mess of Trump's own making but you'll never hear him say it.Again, I agree he should shut tfu and stop giving others ammunition. But I find it hard to accept that this whole "Russia stole/hacked/influenced/bought the election" or the accusations of Trump being some kind of Russian puppet are something he's brought upon himself. This was a narrative cooked up by the losers and happily run with the Democratic party and large sections of the media. Arguing that Trump deserves it because he's such a dick is a pretty farking weak argument.
I don't believe Trump has been colluding with the Russians in regards to hacking the election.
I wouldnt say Trump deserves it because he's a dick, I would argue that Trump planted the seeds for the democrats to sow by way of his continuous praise / defence of Putin / Russia, his denial of US intelligence findings claiming that Russia was hacking America, his lies about his business dealings with Russia and his refusal to release his tax returns (which would either exculpate or incriminate him). This might all be innocent however Trump has a history of being a dodgy businessman, he has done little to win over the trust of the American people and instead seems to have flaunted his disregard for their concerns.
This timeline is good for a refresher:
http://www.politico.com/trump-russia-ties-scandal-guide/timeline-of-eventsI had all but forgotten about his callout to Russia to hack Hillary (I'm not claiming it was a legitimate request but this is the kind of absurdly dumb shit that gives political opponents ammunition).
You don't believe that and I'm pretty farking sure the media and the Democrats don't believe that, yet they're making the most preposterous claims based on zero evidence. Even if Trump has said some dumb shit, that hardly justifies this kind of backlash. The argument that he brought it on himself just doesn't cut it in this instance.
I'm saying he is his own worst enemy. A career politician wouldn't make such stupid mistakes and these faults are unique to Trump.
Who needs to be told that you shouldn't publicly invite the Russians to hack the US Government? It's so absurd.I think there's a general consensus here that he's his own worst enemy and has a serious case of foot-in-mouth disease, but that still doesn't justify these kinds of absurd conspiracy theories. It's one thing to, for example, discuss the feasibility of building his wall or his travel ban, but it's completely batshit crazy to claim or even speculate that he's under the control of the Kremlin.
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@phoenetia said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in US Politics:
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
To his adversaries, sacking Comey made Trump look like he was hiding something.
Telling Lester Holt that it was because of the "Russia thing" reaffirmed their suspicions and made the job of his administration much harder.
Everyone had all but forgotten about the "scandalous dossier", now we're talking about it again and not only that, we now know that the FBI are still actively investigating it.
Like many headlines during Trumps presidency, this is largely a mess of Trump's own making but you'll never hear him say it.Again, I agree he should shut tfu and stop giving others ammunition. But I find it hard to accept that this whole "Russia stole/hacked/influenced/bought the election" or the accusations of Trump being some kind of Russian puppet are something he's brought upon himself. This was a narrative cooked up by the losers and happily run with the Democratic party and large sections of the media. Arguing that Trump deserves it because he's such a dick is a pretty farking weak argument.
I don't believe Trump has been colluding with the Russians in regards to hacking the election.
I wouldnt say Trump deserves it because he's a dick, I would argue that Trump planted the seeds for the democrats to sow by way of his continuous praise / defence of Putin / Russia, his denial of US intelligence findings claiming that Russia was hacking America, his lies about his business dealings with Russia and his refusal to release his tax returns (which would either exculpate or incriminate him). This might all be innocent however Trump has a history of being a dodgy businessman, he has done little to win over the trust of the American people and instead seems to have flaunted his disregard for their concerns.
This timeline is good for a refresher:
http://www.politico.com/trump-russia-ties-scandal-guide/timeline-of-eventsI had all but forgotten about his callout to Russia to hack Hillary (I'm not claiming it was a legitimate request but this is the kind of absurdly dumb shit that gives political opponents ammunition).
I disagree with much of that, but your opinion so fair enough.
I do take issue with 'flaunting the American peoples concerns'... I doubt most care either way. And those that do care are likely entrenched.
All this circumstantial evidence which IMO is completely hopeless, has just led to entrenchment... and apathy.Anyone sane now knows that Trump is not a pawn of Putin, and that was the basis of all of this. The bedrock has fallen away form the whole narrative... so they switch narrative. We are going to have 4 more years of this. Does Trump help himself.. nope.
Does it not concern you that the media went all in on such a completely and utterly false narrative?
I am starting to think we would have had the same sort of propaganda war if Cruz, Bush or Rubio had won.
Not sure you remember, but think back to how Bush the younger was treated by the media. MSM are democrats through and through.
As I see it, birtherism, benghazi and those emails have been swapped for "the Russia probe".
I don't think the Republicans are getting any worse from the Democrats than what they gave. It's only been 4 months though...
Out of all of this, what has surprised me the most is how many Republicans flipped their opinions on Russia seemingly overnight. Thats been really weird and not something I thought Id ever see in my lifetime.Yes it's astonishing how what we see these days from the so-called "proper and impartial" news sources so closely resembles the type of shit dredged up about Obama by two-bit rightwing blogs.
"The 80s called, they want their foreign policy back."
Now who said that and why? If you want to marvel over a Russia flip take a gander at how the Democrats are demonising them more now than when they were the bloody Soviet Union.
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